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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 10.05am
Originally posted by susmik I am afraid that Wisbech Eagle always posts shyte and you wont stop him I am afraid. I have given up trying to debate with him as he will always twist things around to suit his point of view. What you have given up is trying to defend the shyte you have posted. When challenged to provide evidence your silence spoke volumes. People are free to draw their own conclusions. I have mine. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 10.05am

Originally posted by susmik

I am afraid that Wisbech Eagle always posts shyte and you wont stop him I am afraid. I have given up trying to debate with him as he will always twist things around to suit his point of view.

What you have given up is trying to defend the shyte you have posted.

When challenged to provide evidence your silence spoke volumes.

People are free to draw their own conclusions. I have mine.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

steeleye20 Croydon 15 Sep 19 10.19am
The truth about brexit is that thee are no benefits whatsoever. Johnson, who was originally against brexit, saw his route to power and unlimited wealth. What an opportunity, and he and his backers will become filthy rich. Brexiteers are real suckers. Democracy? We won't bother with that. My brilliant post page 2092 re-printed. Why buy Cameron's book when it is here for you free of all charges and EU tariffs.......

steeleye20

Croydon 15 Sep 19 10.19am

The truth about brexit is that thee are no benefits whatsoever.

Johnson, who was originally against brexit, saw his route to power and unlimited wealth.

What an opportunity, and he and his backers will become filthy rich.

Brexiteers are real suckers.

Democracy? We won't bother with that.

My brilliant post page 2092 re-printed.

Why buy Cameron's book when it is here for you free of all charges and EU tariffs.......

Rudi Hedman Caterham 15 Sep 19 10.21am
Originally posted by dollardays Latest Westminster voting intention (YOUGOV - 9-10 Sep) Con - 32% Lab - 23% Lib Dem - 19% Brexit Party - 14% Green - 7% Other - 5% A couple of good polls for the Conservatives in recent days. When you look at that you think with a con-Brexit pact they’ll breeze home. But the snp will dominate Scotland and the Lib Dem’s will pick up some seats with a clear policy on Brexit. There won’t be a majority and this will go on for another thousand or 3 or 4 pages. COYP

Rudi Hedman

Caterham 15 Sep 19 10.21am

Originally posted by dollardays

Latest Westminster voting intention (YOUGOV - 9-10 Sep)
Con - 32%
Lab - 23%
Lib Dem - 19%
Brexit Party - 14%
Green - 7%
Other - 5%

A couple of good polls for the Conservatives in recent days.

When you look at that you think with a con-Brexit pact they’ll breeze home. But the snp will dominate Scotland and the Lib Dem’s will pick up some seats with a clear policy on Brexit. There won’t be a majority and this will go on for another thousand or 3 or 4 pages.

COYP

susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 10.44am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle What you have given up is trying to defend the shyte you have posted. When challenged to provide evidence your silence spoke volumes. People are free to draw their own conclusions. I have mine. The evidence is within treaty itself which you have admitted you could not be arsed to read.....END OF !! Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

susmik

PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 10.44am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

What you have given up is trying to defend the shyte you have posted.

When challenged to provide evidence your silence spoke volumes.
People are free to draw their own conclusions. I have mine.

The evidence is within treaty itself which you have admitted you could not be arsed to read.....END OF !!

Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.27am
Originally posted by susmik The evidence is within treaty itself which you have admitted you could not be arsed to read.....END OF !! No it isn't. I doubt anyone other than the drafters have actually read the whole treaty. Including you! Like everyone I read the detailed summary of it's provisions and not the convoluted legal language and cross referencing of the treaty itself I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed. You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist. You claim to be the expert so now prove it. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.27am

Originally posted by susmik

The evidence is within treaty itself which you have admitted you could not be arsed to read.....END OF !!

No it isn't. I doubt anyone other than the drafters have actually read the whole treaty. Including you! Like everyone I read the detailed summary of it's provisions and not the convoluted legal language and cross referencing of the treaty itself

I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed.

You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist.

You claim to be the expert so now prove it.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

the silurian The garden of England.(not really) 15 Sep 19 11.32am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle No it isn't. I doubt anyone other than the drafters have actually read the whole treaty. Including you! Like everyone I read the detailed summary of it's provisions and not the convoluted legal language and cross referencing of the treaty itself I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed. You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist. You claim to be the expert so now prove it. Ohh someones getting rattled!!

the silurian

The garden of England.(not really) 15 Sep 19 11.32am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed.

You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist.

You claim to be the expert so now prove it.

Ohh someones getting rattled!!

Stirlingsays 15 Sep 19 11.38am
Anyone with two brain cells can see how disingenerous the argument is. Unless the UK leaves the EU everything susmik stated will come to pass.....Unless the UK leaves now it won't be given the opportunity again. Arguing about specific treaties for this or that is reductio ad absurdum. Like focusing on your outdoor swimming pool as the tsunami comes. Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Sep 2019 11.38am) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

15 Sep 19 11.38am

Anyone with two brain cells can see how disingenerous the argument is.

Unless the UK leaves the EU everything susmik stated will come to pass.....Unless the UK leaves now it won't be given the opportunity again.

Arguing about specific treaties for this or that is reductio ad absurdum. Like focusing on your outdoor swimming pool as the tsunami comes.

Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Sep 2019 11.38am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.41am
Originally posted by steeleye20 The truth about brexit is that thee are no benefits whatsoever. Johnson, who was originally against brexit, saw his route to power and unlimited wealth. What an opportunity, and he and his backers will become filthy rich. Brexiteers are real suckers. Democracy? We won't bother with that. My brilliant post page 2092 re-printed. Why buy Cameron's book when it is here for you free of all charges and EU tariffs....... Surprisingly though the Sunday Times is actually read rather more than the HOL so probably has more impact. Especially as the right leaning majority here have very fixed opinions. I haven't yet read the Sunday Times piece. Only the summaries of what's there but it seems pretty damning to me. What Cameron says has that ring of truth we can all see when things are so obviously true they cannot be denied. He is saying nothing that wasn't clearly apparent during the referendum campaign but were dismissed then as just "election" posturing when in fact they are much more important than that. The accusation is that Johnson is a sham who is putting his own ambition before the interests of the country. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.41am

Originally posted by steeleye20

The truth about brexit is that thee are no benefits whatsoever.

Johnson, who was originally against brexit, saw his route to power and unlimited wealth.

What an opportunity, and he and his backers will become filthy rich.

Brexiteers are real suckers.

Democracy? We won't bother with that.

My brilliant post page 2092 re-printed.

Why buy Cameron's book when it is here for you free of all charges and EU tariffs.......

Surprisingly though the Sunday Times is actually read rather more than the HOL so probably has more impact. Especially as the right leaning majority here have very fixed opinions.

I haven't yet read the Sunday Times piece. Only the summaries of what's there but it seems pretty damning to me.

What Cameron says has that ring of truth we can all see when things are so obviously true they cannot be denied. He is saying nothing that wasn't clearly apparent during the referendum campaign but were dismissed then as just "election" posturing when in fact they are much more important than that.

The accusation is that Johnson is a sham who is putting his own ambition before the interests of the country.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 11.43am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle No it isn't. I doubt anyone other than the drafters have actually read the whole treaty. Including you! Like everyone I read the detailed summary of it's provisions and not the convoluted legal language and cross referencing of the treaty itself I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed. You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist. You claim to be the expert so now prove it. I do not claim to an expert but I do claim to be able to read even if you cannot or will not. Also I do not need to prove anything to a person like you that is so argumentative and really such an unintelligent human being. I am not alone in my opinion of you as many other people on this thread and other threads have mentioned !! Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

susmik

PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 11.43am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I have challenged you to show us all where it says anything even remotely resembling the fantasies you claimed.

You have failed to do so. If it's there show us where. That's such a glorious opportunity to prove me wrong that if you fail to take it up it can only be because it doesn't exist.

You claim to be the expert so now prove it.

I do not claim to an expert but I do claim to be able to read even if you cannot or will not. Also I do not need to prove anything to a person like you that is so argumentative and really such an unintelligent human being. I am not alone in my opinion of you as many other people on this thread and other threads have mentioned !!

Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.52am
Originally posted by the silurian Ohh someones getting rattled!! Maybe, but not me. A poster made a claim he is unable to back up. That's disingenuous at best. The only support from elsewhere being some spurious idea that never mind whether any of it is actually true and written into the treaties it is going to all happen by default anyway if we stay in the EU. Which is about as daft a concept as you can get. The UK is a sovereign state and as the EU requires total unanimity on every important issue we have the complete authority to reject any proposal which doesn't suit us. So none of the suggested things are going to happen unless our Parliament agrees to them and they won't. Unless it becomes the, very unlikely, case that it is in our own interests to do so. It won't happen by default. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.52am

Originally posted by the silurian

Ohh someones getting rattled!!

Maybe, but not me.

A poster made a claim he is unable to back up.

That's disingenuous at best.

The only support from elsewhere being some spurious idea that never mind whether any of it is actually true and written into the treaties it is going to all happen by default anyway if we stay in the EU.

Which is about as daft a concept as you can get. The UK is a sovereign state and as the EU requires total unanimity on every important issue we have the complete authority to reject any proposal which doesn't suit us.

So none of the suggested things are going to happen unless our Parliament agrees to them and they won't. Unless it becomes the, very unlikely, case that it is
in our own interests to do so. It won't happen by default.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.59am
Originally posted by susmik I do not claim to an expert but I do claim to be able to read even if you cannot or will not. Also I do not need to prove anything to a person like you that is so argumentative and really such an unintelligent human being. I am not alone in my opinion of you as many other people on this thread and other threads have mentioned !! You cannot prove it can you? Your constant avoidance proves you cannot. Whether I am argumentative, or not, isn't the issue. It's whether you, having "read the whole treaty" can identify for everyone who hasn't, like me, and only read the summaries, where it specifies the changes that you claim will happen. Now either stop digging your hole and climb the ladder I have put in for you or admit you are unable to do so. It's up to you to prove your claim, and not up to me. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 11.59am

Originally posted by susmik

You cannot prove it can you? Your constant avoidance proves you cannot. Whether I am argumentative, or not, isn't the issue. It's whether you, having "read the whole treaty" can identify for everyone who hasn't, like me, and only read the summaries, where it specifies the changes that you claim will happen.

Now either stop digging your hole and climb the ladder I have put in for you or admit you are unable to do so.

It's up to you to prove your claim, and not up to me.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 12.17pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle You cannot prove it can you? Your constant avoidance proves you cannot. Whether I am argumentative, or not, isn't the issue. It's whether you, having "read the whole treaty" can identify for everyone who hasn't, like me, and only read the summaries, where it specifies the changes that you claim will happen. Now either stop digging your hole and climb the ladder I have put in for you or admit you are unable to do so. It's up to you to prove your claim, and not up to me. It seems that Stirlingsays has got it ...why cannot you????? Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

susmik

PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 12.17pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Now either stop digging your hole and climb the ladder I have put in for you or admit you are unable to do so.

It's up to you to prove your claim, and not up to me.

It seems that Stirlingsays has got it ...why cannot you?????

Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 12.31pm
Originally posted by susmik It seems that Stirlingsays has got it ...why cannot you????? No he hasn't! Even he is not suggesting that the Lisbon Treaty provides for the things you suggest. He is saying that if we stay in the EU then eventually those things would all come to pass anyway, whatever the Treaties say. Which is a very different argument. Equally as wrong by the way but still different. So sorry, but it seems you are alone on this. Now let's have the references as to where in the Lisbon Treaty, that you have read in it's entirety, does it state the things you claim it says. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Sep 19 12.31pm

Originally posted by susmik

It seems that Stirlingsays has got it ...why cannot you?????

No he hasn't!

Even he is not suggesting that the Lisbon Treaty provides for the things you suggest.

He is saying that if we stay in the EU then eventually those things would all come to pass anyway, whatever the Treaties say.

Which is a very different argument. Equally as wrong by the way but still different.

So sorry, but it seems you are alone on this.

Now let's have the references as to where in the Lisbon Treaty, that you have read in it's entirety, does it state the things you claim it says.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Stirlingsays 15 Sep 19 12.41pm
How is it wrong? The result of EU treaties has seen the gradual transfer of sovereignty. Staying in the EU would only see this increase. Unless we leave, this can't be reversed short of violent revolution. Stop lying to people. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

15 Sep 19 12.41pm

How is it wrong?

The result of EU treaties has seen the gradual transfer of sovereignty. Staying in the EU would only see this increase.

Unless we leave, this can't be reversed short of violent revolution.

Stop lying to people.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 12.57pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays How is it wrong? The result of EU treaties has seen the gradual transfer of sovereignty. Staying in the EU would only see this increase. Unless we leave, this can't be reversed short of violent revolution. Stop lying to people. Its no good trying to reason with this overage schoolboy Stirling . He only sees things his way and all of our points of views etc are beyond his understanding or comprehension. We are flogging a dead horse in his case. I shall not respond to his childish un educational posts anymore no matter what he comes up with. He is totally wasted space I am afraid. Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

susmik

PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 15 Sep 19 12.57pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

How is it wrong?

The result of EU treaties has seen the gradual transfer of sovereignty. Staying in the EU would only see this increase.

Unless we leave, this can't be reversed short of violent revolution.

Stop lying to people.

Its no good trying to reason with this overage schoolboy Stirling . He only sees things his way and all of our points of views etc are beyond his understanding or comprehension. We are flogging a dead horse in his case. I shall not respond to his childish un educational posts anymore no matter what he comes up with. He is totally wasted space I am afraid.

Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

SpyroCrystal 15 Sep 19 1.06pm
Civil disobedience if the powers that be betray Brexit. Big up the Palace!!!!

SpyroCrystal 15 Sep 19 1.06pm

Civil disobedience if the powers that be betray Brexit.

Big up the Palace!!!!

Stirlingsays 15 Sep 19 1.16pm
Originally posted by susmik Its no good trying to reason with this overage schoolboy Stirling . He only sees things his way and all of our points of views etc are beyond his understanding or comprehension. We are flogging a dead horse in his case. I shall not respond to his childish un educational posts anymore no matter what he comes up with. He is totally wasted space I am afraid. You are of course correct.....it's a waste of time debating with him as he's fundamentally dishonest. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

15 Sep 19 1.16pm

Originally posted by susmik

You are of course correct.....it's a waste of time debating with him as he's fundamentally dishonest.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays 15 Sep 19 1.17pm
Originally posted by SpyroCrystal Civil disobedience if the powers that be betray Brexit. Indeed, if we don't actually leave, I think protests against this break with democracy are valid. Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Sep 2019 1.19pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays

15 Sep 19 1.17pm

Originally posted by SpyroCrystal

Civil disobedience if the powers that be betray Brexit.

Indeed, if we don't actually leave, I think protests against this break with democracy are valid.

Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Sep 2019 1.19pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

silvertop Portishead 15 Sep 19 1.30pm
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle Stop posting shyte. You can count the number of hard right people on here on one hand and still have fingers left over but rubbishing those with opposite views has been a tactic of remainers since day one Pot Kettle

silvertop

Portishead 15 Sep 19 1.30pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Stop posting shyte. You can count the number of hard right people on here on one hand and still have fingers left over but rubbishing those with opposite views has been a tactic of remainers since day one

Pot

Kettle

nickyf 15 Sep 19 1.48pm
People are trying to make us forget but here is a reminder of what we were told. Mr Cameron said in his 2015 speech: “You will have to judge what is best for you and your family, for your children and grandchildren, for our country, for our future. “It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave. “Your decision. Nobody else’s. Not politicians’. Not Parliament’s. Not lobby groups’. Not mine. Just you. You, the British people, will decide. Edited by nickyf (15 Sep 2019 1.49pm) Edited by nickyf (15 Sep 2019 1.49pm)

nickyf 15 Sep 19 1.48pm

People are trying to make us forget but here is a reminder of what we were told.

Mr Cameron said in his 2015 speech: “You will have to judge what is best for you and your family, for your children and grandchildren, for our country, for our future.
“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
“Your decision. Nobody else’s. Not politicians’. Not Parliament’s. Not lobby groups’. Not mine. Just you. You, the British people, will decide.

Edited by nickyf (15 Sep 2019 1.49pm)

Edited by nickyf (15 Sep 2019 1.49pm)

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