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The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
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 Teddy Eagle  04 Oct 19 5.54pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
No it isn't. It consists of you, I and everybody else. The only place it is judged is in Parliament by their duly elected representatives. I am I and everybody else is you. That’s exactly what I meant.
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 5.56pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
They will argue that they are NOT ignoring their electorate by doing what they believe is right. That they need to explain why to them when they face them again is perfectly reasonable. I would rather have someone with a conscience representing me than a sheep who is just lobby fodder. We may just as well elect voting machines if that is all they do. No-one should face threats of any kind because of their job. How does this version differ from a dictatorship other than the fact that we can periodically decide who’s doing the dictating?
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silvertop  Portishead 04 Oct 19 5.57pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I wondered who would make the "whatabout" response. No it didn't but that's because it wasn't trying to analyse the "remain" campaign, which was weak and often playing catch up. Trying to counter the kind of wild claims made by the "leave" campaign produced some equally wild responses. None were what were needed. Whether they balanced each other is a matter of opinion but as this was no way to try to take such a serious decision the point that the referendum was a total failure is well made. Describing the campaign as week is wrong. It sought to argue logic and convince. They seemed concerned about insulting the people's intelligence. That was a mistake. Had they done just that and done no more than face the camera and repeat a simple 3 word catch phrase ad nauseam they might have won the day. Imagine that. The fate of this country decided by a better strap line. If there is another referendum suggestion for a remain slogan - it will never end!
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 6.03pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
They will argue that they are NOT ignoring their electorate by doing what they believe is right. That they need to explain why to them when they face them again is perfectly reasonable. I would rather have someone with a conscience representing me than a sheep who is just lobby fodder. We may just as well elect voting machines if that is all they do. No-one should face threats of any kind because of their job. No. That’s a cop out. If I punch someone in the face then explain I thought he’d look better with new teeth he’s got the right to be unhappy about it even though I might have been acting iwith genuine concern.
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palace_in_frogland  In a broken dream 04 Oct 19 6.54pm |
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Perhaps this should be the new slogan.
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Attachment: | Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 7.04pm |
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Originally posted by palace_in_frogland
Perhaps this should be the new slogan. With Juncker saying “You’re my country now Dave”.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.19pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
Tommy robinson! "Tommy Robinson" isn't doing a job though is he? He is pursuing a personal agenda.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.20pm |
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Originally posted by YT
Just out of interest, Wisbech, how much campaigning did YOU do in the referendum? None. I was out of the country for the months prior. What has that to do with anything?
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 7.26pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
"Tommy Robinson" isn't doing a job though is he? He is pursuing a personal agenda. Or acting according to his conscience. He might think he’s acting in the country’s best interest.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.29pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
I am I and everybody else is you. That’s exactly what I meant. This isn't though about determining what the balance of public opinion is. It's about judging what's in the country's best interests. You can think and say whatever you like about our MPs but whilst the 650 are serving they are our representatives until we decide to change some, or all, or them. The UK is not governed on the basis of public opinion. If it was then we would probably have restored the death penalty, halved taxes and gone bankrupt by now. We ask our MPs to decide these things. All 650 of them and not just the government.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.32pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Or acting according to his conscience. He might think he’s acting in the country’s best interest. He isn't an MP. He isn't paid to act according to his conscience. He can think whatever he likes and do whatever he wants, within the law, but he cannot make law. If he breaks the law then he must expect the law to act.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.40pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
How does this version differ from a dictatorship other than the fact that we can periodically decide who’s doing the dictating? It's because we are ultimately in charge that makes ALL the difference. We are delegating the responsibility, without specifying the decisions, but not giving up our ownership of the responsibility. So it's not dictatorship in any form. It's Parliamentary democracy.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 7.41pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
He isn't an MP. He isn't paid to act according to his conscience. He can think whatever he likes and do whatever he wants, within the law, but he cannot make law. If he breaks the law then he must expect the law to act. Right. So if he were elected he’d be fine to “act according to his conscience”. Is he trying to make law? Or highlight others who are breaking it?
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 7.45pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It's because we are ultimately in charge that makes ALL the difference. We are delegating the responsibility, without specifying the decisions, but not giving up our ownership of the responsibility. So it's not dictatorship in any form. It's Parliamentary democracy. So some people get to choose who decides what’s best for us without challenge or complaint. Sounds quite dictatory.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.47pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Describing the campaign as week is wrong. It sought to argue logic and convince. They seemed concerned about insulting the people's intelligence. That was a mistake. Had they done just that and done no more than face the camera and repeat a simple 3 word catch phrase ad nauseam they might have won the day. Imagine that. The fate of this country decided by a better strap line. If there is another referendum suggestion for a remain slogan - it will never end! Oh it was woefully weak! Selling the status quo is always a difficult job and so much harder to do than just to offer change. Change always looks better because you can promise all kinds of things that you say will happen. The grass is always greener etc etc. You have nothing to measure such claims against. So to do it successfully required a really well thought out campaign, concentrating on the future security of our children and the way the world has shrunk. It didn't happen and the people believed the leave lies and fanciful promises. Trump sells his gullible base snake oil every week. The leave campaign learned from him. Sad!
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.51pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Right. So if he were elected he’d be fine to “act according to his conscience”. Is he trying to make law? Or highlight others who are breaking it? What's your point? "Robinson" isn't an MP! If he was he would be entitled to vote in Parliament according to his conscience. Like any MP and every other citizen he must obey the law at all times.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 04 Oct 19 7.53pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
So some people get to choose who decides what’s best for us without challenge or complaint. Sounds quite dictatory. There are plenty of challenges and complaints in Parliamentary debates. The decisions get taken at the end, after they have all been aired and answered.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Teddy Eagle 04 Oct 19 7.56pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
What's your point? "Robinson" isn't an MP! If he was he would be entitled to vote in Parliament according to his conscience. Like any MP and every other citizen he must obey the law at all times. Just that by your criteria were he to be elected then everyone should apparently stop criticising him and just accept that he was acting in good faith. That’s quite unlikely.
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| martin2412 Living The Dream 04 Oct 19 8.09pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
It would have been helpful if leave had considered what was deliverable or not 3 years ago. REMAIN CALLED THE REFERENDUM. Leave obviously stood against them without much time to consider what might happen in 3 years time. In fact, nobody could have known how obstructive Labour and the EU would be.
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cryrst  The garden of England 04 Oct 19 8.15pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Or acting according to his conscience. He might think he’s acting in the country’s best interest. His job is uploading to the internet.
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