Is It Time For Roy To Go, Yes or NO

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Is It Time For Roy To Go, Yes or NO

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NEILLO Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 11.45am
Originally posted by PatrickA I don’t agree it’s always been about the money. It’s off topic but I’m old enough to remember teams like Derby and Nottingham Forest winning the equivalent of the Premier League, of Villa and Nottingham Forest winning the Champions League. Football is about dreams and glory as well as finance and at the end of a (rare) Palace victory I don’t go away thinking that will mean another £2million for moving up a place in the table. I don’t know any fans that think this way. I don't either. But it wasn't the fans that I was referring to. It's the club owners and the players that have always prioritised the money. Old, Ungifted and White

NEILLO

Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 11.45am

Originally posted by PatrickA

I don’t agree it’s always been about the money.
It’s off topic but I’m old enough to remember teams like Derby and Nottingham Forest winning the equivalent of the Premier League, of Villa and Nottingham Forest winning the Champions League.
Football is about dreams and glory as well as finance and at the end of a (rare) Palace victory I don’t go away thinking that will mean another £2million for moving up a place in the table.
I don’t know any fans that think this way.

I don't either.

But it wasn't the fans that I was referring to.

It's the club owners and the players that have always prioritised the money.

Old, Ungifted and White

doombear Too far from Selhurst Park 05 Jul 20 11.46am
Originally posted by NEILLO Yep, with you all the way on that. Yep, my sentiments also

doombear

Too far from Selhurst Park 05 Jul 20 11.46am

Originally posted by NEILLO

Yep, with you all the way on that.

Yep, my sentiments also

jeeagles 05 Jul 20 12.00pm
Originally posted by PZ Eagle Seeing as you knee-jerkers seem to know all about managing a PL club better than the professionals you should not need to ask the question. Before the Liverpool game we had won four on the trot to go from 30 points to safety at 42 with no goals conceded. Don't suppose in your eyes Roy had anything to do with that. 4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league. Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham. Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle!

jeeagles

05 Jul 20 12.00pm

Originally posted by PZ Eagle

Seeing as you knee-jerkers seem to know all about managing a PL club better than the professionals you should not need to ask the question. Before the Liverpool game we had won four on the trot to go from 30 points to safety at 42 with no goals conceded. Don't suppose in your eyes Roy had anything to do with that.

4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league.

Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham.

Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle!

Eaglecoops CR3 05 Jul 20 12.11pm
Originally posted by NEILLO Forget '' modern '' football. It's always been about the money, there's just a lot more of it about at the top level of the game these days. I am not so sure it has always been about money. Most club owners were philanthropic in the way they ran clubs in the 60's, 70's and 80's. Often the money to buy a player came out of the chairman's pocket. They were in football because they had a personal fortune and loved the game. I agree it is now different, the players obscene salaries have Jimmy Hill to thank for that side of things and the owners are now corporates with financial objectives or they are foreign billionaires. Our most recent buyout before the septics, when we were in financial trouble, was all local guys with a passion for the club. They did ok out of it financially eventually however they didn't bail the club out because it was a money spinner, they did it because they were first and foremost Palace fans. If things had gone tits up, which it could have done, then they would have lost their investments in the club.

Eaglecoops

CR3 05 Jul 20 12.11pm

Originally posted by NEILLO

Forget '' modern '' football. It's always been about the money, there's just a lot more of it about at the top level of the game these days.

I am not so sure it has always been about money. Most club owners were philanthropic in the way they ran clubs in the 60's, 70's and 80's. Often the money to buy a player came out of the chairman's pocket. They were in football because they had a personal fortune and loved the game.

I agree it is now different, the players obscene salaries have Jimmy Hill to thank for that side of things and the owners are now corporates with financial objectives or they are foreign billionaires.

Our most recent buyout before the septics, when we were in financial trouble, was all local guys with a passion for the club. They did ok out of it financially eventually however they didn't bail the club out because it was a money spinner, they did it because they were first and foremost Palace fans.

If things had gone tits up, which it could have done, then they would have lost their investments in the club.

Eaglecoops CR3 05 Jul 20 12.21pm
Originally posted by jeeagles 4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league. Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham. Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle! In short, I think there are only 3 teams worse than us in the PL, Villa, Bournemouth, Norwich and then about 4 or 5 who are a similar standard, West Ham, Brighton, Newcastle, Southampton, Watford. Our current league position is not a reflection of how we have played, but the way results are going at the moment our finishing position could well be an accurate reflection because it will probably be 15th or 16th. Yes I do think that Everton, Burnley, Wolves and Sheffield Utd are better than us.

Eaglecoops

CR3 05 Jul 20 12.21pm

Originally posted by jeeagles

4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league.

Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham.

Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle!

In short, I think there are only 3 teams worse than us in the PL, Villa, Bournemouth, Norwich and then about 4 or 5 who are a similar standard, West Ham, Brighton, Newcastle, Southampton, Watford. Our current league position is not a reflection of how we have played, but the way results are going at the moment our finishing position could well be an accurate reflection because it will probably be 15th or 16th.

Yes I do think that Everton, Burnley, Wolves and Sheffield Utd are better than us.

NEILLO Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 12.51pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops I am not so sure it has always been about money. Most club owners were philanthropic in the way they ran clubs in the 60's, 70's and 80's. Often the money to buy a player came out of the chairman's pocket. They were in football because they had a personal fortune and loved the game. I agree it is now different, the players obscene salaries have Jimmy Hill to thank for that side of things and the owners are now corporates with financial objectives or they are foreign billionaires. Our most recent buyout before the septics, when we were in financial trouble, was all local guys with a passion for the club. They did ok out of it financially eventually however they didn't bail the club out because it was a money spinner, they did it because they were first and foremost Palace fans. If things had gone tits up, which it could have done, then they would have lost their investments in the club. I was told a story of how back in the 70's and Palace were fighting against relegation from the old First Division. We re-signed Bobby Kellard, made him captain and offered him a pay structure that heavily rewarded him on points gained from individual games. Rationale being that he was a scary character around the dressing room and that would motivate the players to perform. So on a much lower scale than todays huge amounts at stake, but my point being that money was always a factor in football and it's naive to think otherwise. By the way, the story was told to me by Bobby himself, and it didn't have a happy ending - we got relegated ! Old, Ungifted and White

NEILLO

Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 12.51pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

If things had gone tits up, which it could have done, then they would have lost their investments in the club.

I was told a story of how back in the 70's and Palace were fighting against relegation from the old First Division.

We re-signed Bobby Kellard, made him captain and offered him a pay structure that heavily rewarded him on points gained from individual games. Rationale being that he was a scary character around the dressing room and that would motivate the players to perform.

So on a much lower scale than todays huge amounts at stake, but my point being that money was always a factor in football and it's naive to think otherwise.

By the way, the story was told to me by Bobby himself, and it didn't have a happy ending - we got relegated !

Old, Ungifted and White

jeeagles 05 Jul 20 12.57pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops In short, I think there are only 3 teams worse than us in the PL, Villa, Bournemouth, Norwich and then about 4 or 5 who are a similar standard, West Ham, Brighton, Newcastle, Southampton, Watford. Our current league position is not a reflection of how we have played, but the way results are going at the moment our finishing position could well be an accurate reflection because it will probably be 15th or 16th. Yes I do think that Everton, Burnley, Wolves and Sheffield Utd are better than us. Looking at our upcoming fixtures, it’s pretty clear that our current league position flatters is, many of the people defending Roy have tunnel vision and fail to see the bigger picture. Our performances against some of the teams listed were dreadful. Against Everton at home we stuck everyone behind he ball even though they had 10 men. Both performances vs Sheffield United and Southampton were terrible. Brighton at home was embarrassing. Against Watford away we played 3 holding midfielders whilst they were rock bottom. All down to the tactics and lack of subs by the manager in my opinion.

jeeagles

05 Jul 20 12.57pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Yes I do think that Everton, Burnley, Wolves and Sheffield Utd are better than us.

Looking at our upcoming fixtures, it’s pretty clear that our current league position flatters is, many of the people defending Roy have tunnel vision and fail to see the bigger picture.

Our performances against some of the teams listed were dreadful.

Against Everton at home we stuck everyone behind he ball even though they had 10 men. Both performances vs Sheffield United and Southampton were terrible. Brighton at home was embarrassing. Against Watford away we played 3 holding midfielders whilst they were rock bottom.

All down to the tactics and lack of subs by the manager in my opinion.

Uphill Bedford 05 Jul 20 12.59pm
Tactically we are the proverbial 'busted flush' So predicable we are now easy to beat. Opponents just concentrate on taking Zaha and Ayew out early and put two on both (after Grealish the two most fouled players in the league) We are so fixed defensively with the midfield solely used as first line of defence. But for Cahill (and in the past Tomkins) we would not have got to 42 points. Creativity is virtually nil and any capable passers (Reidewald, Meyer and before them, Bannon) are not trusted. So it is quick passes to a marked forward, we lose the ball. Playing out of defence is a minefield we frequently try to attempt with occasional disastrous consequences. The keepers have both lost confidence and when we concede a goal what does the manager do? Simple, take off a forward and bolster the overworked defence. For all his faults the most glaring and baffling is his (mis) use of subs. He has only one 'plan' if you can call it that, tactical changes are not in his repertoire. Naturally he blames this on lack of resources and bad luck. If he were manager of any normal business he would be sacked yet our trusting and reverential boss rewards him with another year's contract. Our only hope of avoiding relegation next season is if he falls on his sword, does the decent thing and goes. I am sad to say it but we now need a new manager as well as players, the sooner the better.

Uphill

Bedford 05 Jul 20 12.59pm

Tactically we are the proverbial 'busted flush'

So predicable we are now easy to beat. Opponents just concentrate on taking Zaha and Ayew out early and put two on both (after Grealish the two most fouled players in the league)

We are so fixed defensively with the midfield solely used as first line of defence. But for Cahill (and in the past Tomkins) we would not have got to 42 points.

Creativity is virtually nil and any capable passers (Reidewald, Meyer and before them, Bannon) are not trusted. So it is quick passes to a marked forward, we lose the ball. Playing out of defence is a minefield we frequently try to attempt with occasional disastrous consequences. The keepers have both lost confidence and when we concede a goal what does the manager do?

Simple, take off a forward and bolster the overworked defence.

For all his faults the most glaring and baffling is his (mis) use of subs. He has only one 'plan' if you can call it that, tactical changes are not in his repertoire. Naturally he blames this on lack of resources and bad luck. If he were manager of any normal business he would be sacked yet our trusting and reverential boss rewards him with another year's contract.

Our only hope of avoiding relegation next season is if he falls on his sword, does the decent thing and goes. I am sad to say it but we now need a new manager as well as players, the sooner the better.

NEILLO Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 1.05pm
Originally posted by Uphill Tactically we are the proverbial 'busted flush' So predicable we are now easy to beat. Opponents just concentrate on taking Zaha and Ayew out early and put two on both (after Grealish the two most fouled players in the league) We are so fixed defensively with the midfield solely used as first line of defence. But for Cahill (and in the past Tomkins) we would not have got to 42 points. Creativity is virtually nil and any capable passers (Reidewald, Meyer and before them, Bannon) are not trusted. So it is quick passes to a marked forward, we lose the ball. Playing out of defence is a minefield we frequently try to attempt with occasional disastrous consequences. The keepers have both lost confidence and when we concede a goal what does the manager do? Simple, take off a forward and bolster the overworked defence. For all his faults the most glaring and baffling is his (mis) use of subs. He has only one 'plan' if you can call it that, tactical changes are not in his repertoire. Naturally he blames this on lack of resources and bad luck. If he were manager of any normal business he would be sacked yet our trusting and reverential boss rewards him with another year's contract. Our only hope of avoiding relegation next season is if he falls on his sword, does the decent thing and goes. I am sad to say it but we now need a new manager as well as players, the sooner the better. Why would he do that ? While you are talking about '' normal business '', how would you feel if you had delivered against your objectives only to get sacked ? And why on earth would he resign ?? - would you in that position ?? Old, Ungifted and White

NEILLO

Shoreham-by-Sea 05 Jul 20 1.05pm

Originally posted by Uphill

Tactically we are the proverbial 'busted flush'

So predicable we are now easy to beat. Opponents just concentrate on taking Zaha and Ayew out early and put two on both (after Grealish the two most fouled players in the league)

We are so fixed defensively with the midfield solely used as first line of defence. But for Cahill (and in the past Tomkins) we would not have got to 42 points.

Simple, take off a forward and bolster the overworked defence.

Our only hope of avoiding relegation next season is if he falls on his sword, does the decent thing and goes. I am sad to say it but we now need a new manager as well as players, the sooner the better.

Why would he do that ?

While you are talking about '' normal business '', how would you feel if you had delivered against your objectives only to get sacked ? And why on earth would he resign ?? - would you in that position ??

Old, Ungifted and White

PZ Eagle Penzance 05 Jul 20 1.06pm
Originally posted by jeeagles 4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league. Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham. Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle! Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City. Conjunctivitis.com - A site for sore eyes.

PZ Eagle

Penzance 05 Jul 20 1.06pm

Originally posted by jeeagles

4 unconvincing wins against 10 men newcastle and the 3 teams with the worst form in the league.

Prior to that we'd had 1 win in 12. A list minute winner in a dour came against West Ham.

Congratulations Roy! It's a miracle!

Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City.

Conjunctivitis.com - A site for sore eyes.

hayling eagle 05 Jul 20 1.14pm
We are in a bad run of form and it is difficult to put up with, but it is too early to talk of getting rid of Roy yet. He must be aware that he has to do something to turn our form around. We have a difficult run in but he knows he must get some results. Let's give him time to turn it round. If we get 3 or less points between now and the end of the season, I might change my mind and so might the club.

hayling eagle

05 Jul 20 1.14pm

We are in a bad run of form and it is difficult to put up with, but it is too early to talk of getting rid of Roy yet. He must be aware that he has to do something to turn our form around. We have a difficult run in but he knows he must get some results. Let's give him time to turn it round. If we get 3 or less points between now and the end of the season, I might change my mind and so might the club.

cpj Kent 05 Jul 20 1.16pm
Originally posted by PZ Eagle Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City. It was actually one win in 11. Still not great!

cpj

Kent 05 Jul 20 1.16pm

Originally posted by PZ Eagle

Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City.

It was actually one win in 11. Still not great!

jeeagles 05 Jul 20 1.21pm
Originally posted by PZ Eagle Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City. 1 Watford (D), 2 Brighton (D), 3 Newcastle (L), 4 West Ham (W), 5 Southampton (D), 6 Norwich (D), 7 Derby (L), 8 Arsenal (D), 9 Man City (D), 10 Southampton (L), 11 Sheffield United (L), 12 Everton (L). You're right, one win in 12 not 13, still extremely poor. But it still makes abysmal reading, especially when you look at who we played. Not sure any other manager would have survived that run of form.

jeeagles

05 Jul 20 1.21pm

Originally posted by PZ Eagle

Sorry JE your facts are wrong, prior to those games we had more than one win out of 12 and also draws against Arsenal and Man City.

1 Watford (D), 2 Brighton (D), 3 Newcastle (L), 4 West Ham (W), 5 Southampton (D), 6 Norwich (D), 7 Derby (L), 8 Arsenal (D), 9 Man City (D), 10 Southampton (L), 11 Sheffield United (L), 12 Everton (L).

You're right, one win in 12 not 13, still extremely poor. But it still makes abysmal reading, especially when you look at who we played. Not sure any other manager would have survived that run of form.

EddieMac 05 Jul 20 2.02pm
Originally posted by jeeagles 1 Watford (D), 2 Brighton (D), 3 Newcastle (L), 4 West Ham (W), 5 Southampton (D), 6 Norwich (D), 7 Derby (L), 8 Arsenal (D), 9 Man City (D), 10 Southampton (L), 11 Sheffield United (L), 12 Everton (L). You're right, one win in 12 not 13, still extremely poor. But it still makes abysmal reading, especially when you look at who we played. Not sure any other manager would have survived that run of form. Have a look at our starting 11 during most of that run of games and have a look at our bench. Is it any wonder we picked up little to no points? Il keep saying it, we may look like we have a decent squad but we don’t. A lot of you constantly crying about subs but who in the name of Christ can we bring on? We have no options

EddieMac

05 Jul 20 2.02pm

Originally posted by jeeagles

Have a look at our starting 11 during most of that run of games and have a look at our bench. Is it any wonder we picked up little to no points? Il keep saying it, we may look like we have a decent squad but we don’t. A lot of you constantly crying about subs but who in the name of Christ can we bring on? We have no options

EddieMac 05 Jul 20 2.08pm
[Link] Can anyone tell me that that is a first 11 and bench fit for the best league in the world?

EddieMac

05 Jul 20 2.08pm

[Link]

Can anyone tell me that that is a first 11 and bench fit for the best league in the world?

EddieMac 05 Jul 20 2.12pm
Crystal Palace 31Guaita 34KellySubstituted forPierrickat 83'minutes 5Tomkins 12SakhoSubstituted forKouyatéat 45'minutes 44Riedewald 7MeyerSubstituted forWickhamat 60'minutes 22McCarthy 4Milivojevic 18McArthur 11Zaha 9J Ayew Substitutes 8Kouyaté 13Hennessey 21Wickham 35Woods 37Kirby 40Pierrick 41Daly Starting 11 and bench against Norwich. Great isn’t it folks. Such a strong squad we have. Have a good strong look at that bench and ask yourself why we struggle to change games.

EddieMac

05 Jul 20 2.12pm

Crystal Palace
31Guaita
34KellySubstituted forPierrickat 83'minutes
5Tomkins
12SakhoSubstituted forKouyatéat 45'minutes
44Riedewald
7MeyerSubstituted forWickhamat 60'minutes
22McCarthy
4Milivojevic
18McArthur
11Zaha
9J Ayew

Substitutes
8Kouyaté
13Hennessey
21Wickham
35Woods
37Kirby
40Pierrick
41Daly

Starting 11 and bench against Norwich. Great isn’t it folks. Such a strong squad we have. Have a good strong look at that bench and ask yourself why we struggle to change games.

EddieMac 05 Jul 20 2.16pm
Yesterday’s bench is a little stronger but who would you bring on to change that game?? 6Dann 7Meyer 8Kouyaté 10Townsend 13Hennessey 22McCarthy 35Woods 39Mitchell 40Pierrick It is not as easy as it looks is it ? Meyer and Townsend are our strongest attacking players and they are well off the boil. The rest are defensive players or unproven young lads and what Iv seen of Pierrick he won’t be getting a start anytime soon. Roy can’t wave a magic wand and make Ronaldo appear on his bench. We have a piss poor squad and that is a fact. Edited by EddieMac (05 Jul 2020 2.18pm)

EddieMac

05 Jul 20 2.16pm

Yesterday’s bench is a little stronger but who would you bring on to change that game??

6Dann
7Meyer
8Kouyaté
10Townsend
13Hennessey
22McCarthy
35Woods
39Mitchell
40Pierrick

It is not as easy as it looks is it ?

Meyer and Townsend are our strongest attacking players and they are well off the boil. The rest are defensive players or unproven young lads and what Iv seen of Pierrick he won’t be getting a start anytime soon.

Roy can’t wave a magic wand and make Ronaldo appear on his bench. We have a piss poor squad and that is a fact.

Edited by EddieMac (05 Jul 2020 2.18pm)

doombear Too far from Selhurst Park 05 Jul 20 3.27pm
Originally posted by EddieMac Yesterday’s bench is a little stronger but who would you bring on to change that game?? 6Dann 7Meyer 8Kouyaté 10Townsend 13Hennessey 22McCarthy 35Woods 39Mitchell 40Pierrick It is not as easy as it looks is it ? Meyer and Townsend are our strongest attacking players and they are well off the boil. The rest are defensive players or unproven young lads and what Iv seen of Pierrick he won’t be getting a start anytime soon. Roy can’t wave a magic wand and make Ronaldo appear on his bench. We have a piss poor squad and that is a fact. Edited by EddieMac (05 Jul 2020 2.18pm) This is our problem. We keep blaming Roy for not getting the team to play more attacking football but WHERE are our attacking bench options? We will go down next year unless some serious signings are made AND we have more than a Plan A option. We can only have a Plan B and C etc. if we have the right resources to allow that to happen. The best we can do with our current squad is to let Wilf and Jordan have free roles and let Meyer, MacArthur or even Riederwald play as attacking midfielders.

doombear

Too far from Selhurst Park 05 Jul 20 3.27pm

Originally posted by EddieMac

Yesterday’s bench is a little stronger but who would you bring on to change that game??

6Dann
7Meyer
8Kouyaté
10Townsend
13Hennessey
22McCarthy
35Woods
39Mitchell
40Pierrick

It is not as easy as it looks is it ?

Roy can’t wave a magic wand and make Ronaldo appear on his bench. We have a piss poor squad and that is a fact.

Edited by EddieMac (05 Jul 2020 2.18pm)

This is our problem. We keep blaming Roy for not getting the team to play more attacking football but WHERE are our attacking bench options?

We will go down next year unless some serious signings are made AND we have more than a Plan A option. We can only have a Plan B and C etc. if we have the right resources to allow that to happen. The best we can do with our current squad is to let Wilf and Jordan have free roles and let Meyer, MacArthur or even Riederwald play as attacking midfielders.

PZ Eagle Penzance 05 Jul 20 3.33pm
Originally posted by jeeagles 1 Watford (D), 2 Brighton (D), 3 Newcastle (L), 4 West Ham (W), 5 Southampton (D), 6 Norwich (D), 7 Derby (L), 8 Arsenal (D), 9 Man City (D), 10 Southampton (L), 11 Sheffield United (L), 12 Everton (L). You're right, one win in 12 not 13, still extremely poor. But it still makes abysmal reading, especially when you look at who we played. Not sure any other manager would have survived that run of form. In the 12 PL Games before the run of 4 straight wins we had W2 D6 L4 for 12 Pts. Now add the 4 wins to that and it's W6 D6 L4 for 24 pts. In this league that is not deemed failure or a reason to want the Manager out.. Conjunctivitis.com - A site for sore eyes.

PZ Eagle

Penzance 05 Jul 20 3.33pm

Originally posted by jeeagles

In the 12 PL Games before the run of 4 straight wins
we had W2 D6 L4 for 12 Pts. Now add the 4 wins to that
and it's W6 D6 L4 for 24 pts. In this league that is not deemed failure or a reason to want the Manager out..

Conjunctivitis.com - A site for sore eyes.

cpj Kent 05 Jul 20 3.41pm
Originally posted by PZ Eagle In the 12 PL Games before the run of 4 straight wins we had W2 D6 L4 for 12 Pts. Now add the 4 wins to that and it's W6 D6 L4 for 24 pts. In this league that is not deemed failure or a reason to want the Manager out.. Add the 3 defeats and its w6 d6 l7 - after Tuesday you can add another to the 'L' total.

cpj

Kent 05 Jul 20 3.41pm

Originally posted by PZ Eagle

Add the 3 defeats and its w6 d6 l7 - after Tuesday you can add another to the 'L' total.

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