This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.
Visit the current forum | Forum Rules
| footythoughts |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
Why are you posting photos of Wisbelch? It's promotional material for his next fight. He's often duking it out. Anyway, enough distraction for today. Have a good day all!
|
|
|
Originally posted by footythoughts
Then it's decided, you're both fighting on the undercard of the next Anthony Joshua fight. The winner fights Caitlyn Jenner Edited by footythoughts (06 Apr 2023 11.09am)
I actually did take up boxing again recently however if anything is indicative so far it is that no matter my sex nor my gender identification I probably do not have the fitness levels to fight a sloth as things stand.
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
|
|
Originally posted by footythoughts
All people are entitled to considerations of dignity, privacy and safety, not just those we decide are. That's why these issues are complex. Your comment doesn't address the fact that your stance advocates, whether you like it or not, for trans men to be present in womens spaces. That would appear to defeat the point of what those advocating for this law change want. I certainly don't propose cubicles as an all encompassing solution to anything, rather that it's something already done in many places (prior to the politicisation of this issue) that can work well and ensures privacy of all - which is something that people could be just as passionate about.
Yes all people are, as defined by the equalities act, care act, and this is sex based law. This issue is NOT complex if sex based law is followed. Least discriminatory options are CLEAR parts of law. In regards to trans men to be present in women's spaces. A trans man is a women. They have not changed their sex. A minority of a minority may have and this is also covered by equalities law. Society can provide trans facilities where appropriate, where there is a quantifiable need, and this can be risk assessed. The equalities act clearly outlines proportionate means to achieve legitimate aims (upholding privacy, dignity and safety rights for females). The EHRC are also very clear on single sex guidance. Single sex spaces are single sex spaces. The service provider can discriminate against women identifying as men as proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim - dignity, privacy and safety. Cubicles, yes and no. There is again guidance that is being ignored by diversity mission creep, and ignorance. Mixed sex Cubicles should not be a replacement for single sex spaces. A school can replace its single sex spaces for mixed sex, neither should sports centres, a cubicle if there are only cubicles should be in a lockable area to create a single sex area to uphold rights.
|
|
|
Originally posted by Pembroke
Yes all people are, as defined by the equalities act, care act, and this is sex based law. This issue is NOT complex if sex based law is followed. Least discriminatory options are CLEAR parts of law. In regards to trans men.A trans man is a women. They have not changed their sex. A minority of a minority may have and this is covered by equalities law. Society can provide trans facilities where appropriate, where there is a real need, and this can be risk assessed. The equalities act clearly outlines proportionate means to achieve legitimate aims (upholding privacy, dignity and safety rights for females). The EHRC are also very clear on single sex guidance. Single sex spaces are single sex spaces. The service provider can discriminate against women identifying as men as a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim - dignity, privacy and safety. Cubicles, yes and no. There is again guidance that is being ignored by diversity mission creep, and ignorance. Mixed sex Cubicles should not be a replacement for single sex spaces. A school can replace its single sex spaces for mixed sex, neither should sports centres, a cubicle if there are only cubicles should be in a lockable area to create a single sex area to uphold rights.
|
|
|
Originally posted by footythoughts
I don't disagree in that where there are single use cubicles (which exist in their millions, both changing rooms and toilets even without this issue being a consideration), or possibly specific facilities for those who would be better suited to them, that sounds like a win-win. But beyond that I see no sense in doing away with sex based facilities at all as they clearly serve a purpose and I understand the desire to fight to keep them. I do think in trying to be exacting in every instance we get no further forward or just create different problems though (my 'biological sex' point) and that common sense is largey already in place and working. Society certainly takes steps to ensure safety of people - as it should but we do also have to prise reality of risk from media and political narratives designed often to distract or scare rather than problem solve. We can forensically scrutinise trans people - who in all likelihood as no or little more inclined to crime than you or I - when countless numbers of the actual released rapists and murderers you mentioned (who are certainly objectively dangerous) likely swan in and out of public toilets and the like with nowhere near as much attention. I don't think an ultra focus on political faultlines really reveals much at all about the people at the centre of said focus, other than either artifically raising them up or dehumanising them, neither or which helps them or society as a whole. That is exactly what should happen. Males are scrutinised, and that scrutiny has led to society creating single sex spaces. Society knows the sex of men represents a threat to women.99% of sexual crimes are committed by males and single sex spaces are a control, measure. Now do trans women. Are there patterns in trans women behaviour that mirror males, or females? Scrutiny reveals? Trans women appear to demonstrate a sexual offending rate that is higher than women. Its a male like behaviour. A minority of trans women behave like a minority of males. I use the word appear, data is sketchy, but there are disproportionate themes that can be observed - The numbers of trans women in prisons for sexual crimes as a proportion v females and males is disproportionate high, no its massively disproportionate. Sanity would be a lot more scrutiny on the whys, data collection, facts to inform societies practice and law.
|
|
|
Seriously
Red and Blue Army! |
|
|
Originally posted by Matov
Going to throw something out there. Utterly bats*** by the way but bear with me. The biggest increase in this trans stuff is girls to boys. Especially amongst teens. The men masquerading as women stuff is just a smoke screen to hide the real story. Now I would assume that the medical process involved for women in this process is far more complex than that for men which is primarily cosmetic surgury. But for women, and girls in particular, it must be primarily a hysterectomy. Are they effectively 'harvesting' something from those deluded girls? Female to male would required a bi-lateral mastectomy, full hysterectomy (including ovaries) oestrogen suppression medication and testosterone pills. Male to female requires removal of genitalia, cutting an opening for a 'v*****' lined with penile tissue and re-working of 'plumbing' pipework accordingly. The rest is done with drugs: oestrogen intake and testosterone suppression.
A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers |
|
|
Originally posted by Matov
Going to throw something out there. Utterly bats*** by the way but bear with me. The biggest increase in this trans stuff is girls to boys. Especially amongst teens. The men masquerading as women stuff is just a smoke screen to hide the real story. Now I would assume that the medical process involved for women in this process is far more complex than that for men which is primarily cosmetic surgury. But for women, and girls in particular, it must be primarily a hysterectomy. Are they effectively 'harvesting' something from those deluded girls? Yup, their sanity as most will eventually regret having it done and go into mass depression and hurt or kill either themselves or someone else.
|
|
|
Originally posted by cryrst
Yup, their sanity as most will eventually regret having it done and go into mass depression and hurt or kill either themselves or someone else.
Perhaps it is me just being me but my understanding of realpolitik is that everything that happens does for a reason. An advantage. And this translunacy has to fit into that. There is no electoral advantage. If anything it ultimately damages political parties who champion it (see what is happening to the likes of the SNP). But it still gets promoted across the mainstream political system. No matter who is in power, this s*** has taken hold. Only just recently William Hague went on record and said an institution such as the Women's Institute had to just accept Transwomen as members by way of progress. Why is this 'progress' just unquestionable? The powers that be must be gaining something tangible from it. The simple law of politics. A completely artificial, in every sense of the word, concept somehow foisted on us in the West (and interestingly, predominantly in the Anglo-West). For me, the only conclusion I can arrive at is that if it is not a vote winner then it must mean they are gaining something else. And that can ony come from what the terrible physical consequences of this are, primarily on women (who get slated the most for objecting to this). And for what? I can only strip this back to some kind of desire to effectively sterilise young girls and have access to what were their reproductive organs. Utterly terrifying. Literal evil in every sense of the word.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
|
|
Originally posted by Matov
Perhaps it is me just being me but my understanding of realpolitik is that everything that happens does for a reason. An advantage. And this translunacy has to fit into that. There is no electoral advantage. If anything it ultimately damages political parties who champion it (see what is happening to the likes of the SNP). But it still gets promoted across the mainstream political system. No matter who is in power, this s*** has taken hold. Only just recently William Hague went on record and said an institution such as the Women's Institute had to just accept Transwomen as members by way of progress. Why is this 'progress' just unquestionable? The powers that be must be gaining something tangible from it. The simple law of politics. A completely artificial, in every sense of the word, concept somehow foisted on us in the West (and interestingly, predominantly in the Anglo-West). For me, the only conclusion I can arrive at is that if it is not a vote winner then it must mean they are gaining something else. And that can ony come from what the terrible physical consequences of this are, primarily on women (who get slated the most for objecting to this). And for what? I can only strip this back to some kind of desire to effectively sterilise young girls and have access to what were their reproductive organs. Utterly terrifying. Literal evil in every sense of the word.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
|
|
Originally posted by Behind Enemy Lines
At this stage anything is possible (although hats off for that!). My own second, second, second guess is that it might actually be more about the eternal quest for people who crave power. And I mean REAL power. Not the common or garden fame and fortune kind but the real 1% of the 1% kind. People like Blair are a good example of what I mean. And for them, it's all about cheating death. The ultimate expression of the Faustian spirit. The only logical conclusion of the Nietzschean 'will to power' drive. But I concede, in the realms of utter silver foil hat wearing, into the realms of balaclava donnning.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
|
|
Originally posted by cryrst
I think you both are thinking too deeply about the wheres and whys. Think about the fact that kids used to be told no and given punishment or a reason why not. For about the last 20 years ( roughly when this subject could be spoken about) kids are told they can do what they want; no punishment at all. No homework, no sex education at school for years as it’s ‘dirty’. The system put in place to try to dissuade I get all of that but just consider this... The number of children, in particular, being referred to the Tavistock and Portman Foundation Trust’s gender identity development service (Gids)—the NHS service through which all UK candidates for a sex change under 18 are funnelled—is up from 77 in 2009 to 2,590 in 2018-9. But what’s almost as dramatic as the headline numbers are developments in who is transitioning. In November 2017, the Guardian reported that 70 per cent of referrals were female. This was a surprising statistic because only 10 years previously the overall ratio had been more like 75 per cent males seeking to be female, and indeed it is still the gender traffic in that direction that dominates the increasingly noisy, divisive and panic-inflected debate. Ponder on those numbers. And the dynamics. Something is SERIOUSLY f***ed up about this. Throw in the attacks, in every way conceivable, on any woman who dares object (and they get far, far more viciously slated about this than men, posing enough of a question on its own). As I constantly state, willing to accept every kind of slur going when it comes to what I have written about as my own take on the reasoning but even if people take the stance of writing me off as a fruit loop, the actual data is surely cause for massive concern on its own?
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
|
|
Originally posted by Matov
I get all of that but just consider this... The number of children, in particular, being referred to the Tavistock and Portman Foundation Trust’s gender identity development service (Gids)—the NHS service through which all UK candidates for a sex change under 18 are funnelled—is up from 77 in 2009 to 2,590 in 2018-9. But what’s almost as dramatic as the headline numbers are developments in who is transitioning. In November 2017, the Guardian reported that 70 per cent of referrals were female. This was a surprising statistic because only 10 years previously the overall ratio had been more like 75 per cent males seeking to be female, and indeed it is still the gender traffic in that direction that dominates the increasingly noisy, divisive and panic-inflected debate. Ponder on those numbers. And the dynamics. Something is SERIOUSLY f***ed up about this. Throw in the attacks, in every way conceivable, on any woman who dares object (and they get far, far more viciously slated about this than men, posing enough of a question on its own). As I constantly state, willing to accept every kind of slur going when it comes to what I have written about as my own take on the reasoning but even if people take the stance of writing me off as a fruit loop, the actual data is surely cause for massive concern on its own? I get those thoughts and the maths don’t lie. My concern is the maths of the figures of regret also don’t lie. Facts are many of these trans swing, end of !
|
|
|
Man abducted and sexually assaulted schoolgirl while dressed as woman [Link]
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
|
|
Originally posted by Nicholas91
Man abducted and sexually assaulted schoolgirl while dressed as woman [Link] I read this article too Nick. I'm sorry, but in my sad old geezer world this bloke is sick and needs medical help. The whole trans thing makes me shudder.
Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled. |
|
|
Originally posted by Palace Old Geezer
I read this article too Nick. I'm sorry, but in my sad old geezer world this bloke is sick and needs medical help. The whole trans thing makes me shudder. For me, it doesn't throw into question the notion of transgenderism it's more societies' approach to the whole thing that I find deeply concerning POG. Stories like this are becoming more frequent and as a result of the obvious flaws many recognise in the mass and unyielding promulgation and promotion of the whole thing. Most recently it's been a common thread amongst convicted criminals including mass and child murderers and paedophiles. No doubt some will attempt to distract by saying they are isolated incidents and only reflective of the individual however there is a common thread that cannot be ignored.
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
|
All images and text on this site are copyright © 1999-2025 The Holmesdale Online, unless otherwise stated.
Web Design by Guntrisoft Ltd.