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Eddie Howe now favourite


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Rachid Rachid Rachid Flag 17 Feb 21 12.02pm

Originally posted by doombear


Quite possibly, although I do wonder to what extent Lewington's absence has been a factor in:
a) Hodgson's apparent weariness and
b) the abject and apathetic performances in recent games.

I think the loss of some of the dressing room leaders (Zaha, MacArthur, MCCarthy and Tomkins) and two players in Zaha and Schlupp who are able to travel with the ball has been the bigger factor.

Ultimately the decision not to get another, preferably young, centre back in and thus free up Kouyate as an additional midfield option and bring more height during the last window has been criminal IMO.

 

beak Flag croydon 17 Feb 21 12.45pm

Originally posted by Jacey

Who,Roy Hodgson??

No ,Edith Howe.

 

TheBigToePunt Flag 17 Feb 21 1.05pm

Whether it's now, the summer or later I've no strong objection to Roy staying on, but I've no objection to Howe coming in either.

I would, however, ask Howe the following at interview:

1. When at Bournemouth you spent a lot more money than Hodgson has at Palace, and ended up relegated. Why? What would you do differently if you could go back?

2. Your Bournemouth squad was entirely of your own construction, you literally built it all from scratch, until every player at the club was your signing. How would you deal with inheriting a squad two or three other managers have collated, and working with a Director of Football?

3. You seemed powerless and a little lost to arrest the slide when your Bournemouth side were on the long poor run that resulted in relegation. Why? What did you learn, and why would it be different here when we go on a losing run (which we are bound to do occasionally)?

4. Apart from a back up goalie (Travers) you didn't bring through a single youth team player at Bournemouth. We have high hopes for our academy in the medium term - why are you the man to lead that?

5. Bournemouth's promotion into, and time in, the premier league were funded by a wealthy owner who broke FFP rules to give you an unfair advantage. That won't happen here. How will you do well with a lower level of investment than you have been used to?

6. Your record of buying promising young players from other clubs and developing them into valuable assets is hit and miss. You got a profit for Ake, and a smaller one for Wilson and Ramsdale, but you lost a fortune on Ibe, Solanke, Lerma, Rico (total cost over £70m, current value probably about £15m). You bought Mepham from Brentford for £13m, which you recouped by selling Mings to Villa. The value of the latter is now far greater than the former. Why are you the man to meet the chairman's aims of having assets of value on the pitch?

7. In their time in this league, Bournemouth played better stuff than Palace, but also got their pants pulled down far more often (even with this seasons poor performances included). What exactly is your philosophy tactically? Has it changed at all? Why would it work here?

8. Very few clubs with our budget have stayed up playing good football, and even fewer have made the change from anti-football to good football successfully. We could head hunt another very conservative coach rather than you. With that in mind, how will you change our style (if at all), and how will you handle the risk associated with change?


If he is convincing in his answers, then he will have a decent chance. I wouldn't rule out that he has thought long and hard about all these things.


Edited by TheBigToePunt (17 Feb 2021 1.05pm)

 

Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 17 Feb 21 1.16pm

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

Whether it's now, the summer or later I've no strong objection to Roy staying on, but I've no objection to Howe coming in either.

I would, however, ask Howe the following at interview:

1. When at Bournemouth you spent a lot more money than Hodgson has at Palace, and ended up relegated. Why? What would you do differently if you could go back?

2. Your Bournemouth squad was entirely of your own construction, you literally built it all from scratch, until every player at the club was your signing. How would you deal with inheriting a squad two or three other managers have collated, and working with a Director of Football?

3. You seemed powerless and a little lost to arrest the slide when your Bournemouth side were on the long poor run that resulted in relegation. Why? What did you learn, and why would it be different here when we go on a losing run (which we are bound to do occasionally)?

4. Apart from a back up goalie (Travers) you didn't bring through a single youth team player at Bournemouth. We have high hopes for our academy in the medium term - why are you the man to lead that?

5. Bournemouth's promotion into, and time in, the premier league were funded by a wealthy owner who broke FFP rules to give you an unfair advantage. That won't happen here. How will you do well with a lower level of investment than you have been used to?

6. Your record of buying promising young players from other clubs and developing them into valuable assets is hit and miss. You got a profit for Ake, and a smaller one for Wilson and Ramsdale, but you lost a fortune on Ibe, Solanke, Lerma, Rico (total cost over £70m, current value probably about £15m). You bought Mepham from Brentford for £13m, which you recouped by selling Mings to Villa. The value of the latter is now far greater than the former. Why are you the man to meet the chairman's aims of having assets of value on the pitch?

7. In their time in this league, Bournemouth played better stuff than Palace, but also got their pants pulled down far more often (even with this seasons poor performances included). What exactly is your philosophy tactically? Has it changed at all? Why would it work here?

8. Very few clubs with our budget have stayed up playing good football, and even fewer have made the change from anti-football to good football successfully. We could head hunt another very conservative coach rather than you. With that in mind, how will you change our style (if at all), and how will you handle the risk associated with change?


If he is convincing in his answers, then he will have a decent chance. I wouldn't rule out that he has thought long and hard about all these things.


Edited by TheBigToePunt (17 Feb 2021 1.05pm)

I think Danny Baker once called football management the 'Gravy train with biscuit wheels'.

There aren't many jobs in the world where nearly every applicant's CV will read:

Sacked
Sacked
Sacked
Sacked

You could interview any manager in this style, perhaps they do?

I'd like to see a similarly styled script from Hodgson's interview also. Could have started off with something along the lines of "England's loss to Iceland was pathetic, an absolute embarrassment to the fans and stunk of managerial inadequacy, can we expect to see this sort of thing with you at Palace?" I'm sure he would of said no.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

Tickled pink Flag Cornwall 17 Feb 21 1.19pm

Originally posted by Nicholas91

Given the choice, I’d rather we did over Brighton.

I’ve been ‘Roy Out’ for a while now but in all honesty that is (in my mind only) a logical stance relative to our situation as it stands now. I don’t think any nostalgia can really be afforded in football but by the same token would never look to discount or refuse acknowledgement that RH has kept us up for numerous seasons and at the end of the day it’s an achievement that warrants respect if not high praise.

If we can get over the line this season including beating the weed, again, at their place with RH to bow out as amicably as possible at the end that would be my preference and I’d suggest the most desirable outcome for all. I would also assume this is what Parish and co. are hoping for.

If we lose miserably on Monday however, and this were to be true, I’d probably be minded to side with anything other then what we’ve seen all too often especially without Zaha, and that is us looking unlikely to ever score let alone compete in or win a game.

Agree, good post.

 

Palace Old Geezer Flag Midhurst 17 Feb 21 1.21pm

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

Whether it's now, the summer or later I've no strong objection to Roy staying on, but I've no objection to Howe coming in either.

I would, however, ask Howe the following at interview:

1. When at Bournemouth you spent a lot more money than Hodgson has at Palace, and ended up relegated. Why? What would you do differently if you could go back?

2. Your Bournemouth squad was entirely of your own construction, you literally built it all from scratch, until every player at the club was your signing. How would you deal with inheriting a squad two or three other managers have collated, and working with a Director of Football?

3. You seemed powerless and a little lost to arrest the slide when your Bournemouth side were on the long poor run that resulted in relegation. Why? What did you learn, and why would it be different here when we go on a losing run (which we are bound to do occasionally)?

4. Apart from a back up goalie (Travers) you didn't bring through a single youth team player at Bournemouth. We have high hopes for our academy in the medium term - why are you the man to lead that?

5. Bournemouth's promotion into, and time in, the premier league were funded by a wealthy owner who broke FFP rules to give you an unfair advantage. That won't happen here. How will you do well with a lower level of investment than you have been used to?

6. Your record of buying promising young players from other clubs and developing them into valuable assets is hit and miss. You got a profit for Ake, and a smaller one for Wilson and Ramsdale, but you lost a fortune on Ibe, Solanke, Lerma, Rico (total cost over £70m, current value probably about £15m). You bought Mepham from Brentford for £13m, which you recouped by selling Mings to Villa. The value of the latter is now far greater than the former. Why are you the man to meet the chairman's aims of having assets of value on the pitch?

7. In their time in this league, Bournemouth played better stuff than Palace, but also got their pants pulled down far more often (even with this seasons poor performances included). What exactly is your philosophy tactically? Has it changed at all? Why would it work here?

8. Very few clubs with our budget have stayed up playing good football, and even fewer have made the change from anti-football to good football successfully. We could head hunt another very conservative coach rather than you. With that in mind, how will you change our style (if at all), and how will you handle the risk associated with change?


If he is convincing in his answers, then he will have a decent chance. I wouldn't rule out that he has thought long and hard about all these things.


Edited by TheBigToePunt (17 Feb 2021 1.05pm)

Blimey, glad I've retired - wouldn't want you to interview me.

Good questions though. You make valid points about his time at Bournemouth.

 


Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled.

TheBigToePunt Flag 17 Feb 21 1.31pm

Originally posted by Nicholas91

I think Danny Baker once called football management the 'Gravy train with biscuit wheels'.

There aren't many jobs in the world where nearly every applicant's CV will read:

Sacked
Sacked
Sacked
Sacked

You could interview any manager in this style, perhaps they do?

I'd like to see a similarly styled script from Hodgson's interview also. Could have started off with something along the lines of "England's loss to Iceland was pathetic, an absolute embarrassment to the fans and stunk of managerial inadequacy, can we expect to see this sort of thing with you at Palace?" I'm sure he would of said no.

Agreed re previous sackings not really counting against a person (within reason), but their performance whilst in post does.

I could almost imagine Hodgson saying (or at least the inference being): 'Regardless of how bad my England and Liverpool teams turned out, my record of getting results with smaller clubs in the top flight is evident. I have a proven track record, and will come to Palace with the same approach that did so well for Fulham and West Brom. I will not reinvent the wheel, and will follow on from the work Pulis and Allardyce did, which your squad seemed to buy into and suit. I was the wrong man for England and Liverpool, but the right fit for Palace'.

Which would have been a good, and true answer.

 

Chubskip Flag 17 Feb 21 1.47pm

He didn't want to come a few years ago, what would have changed his mind? I might be wrong but Celtic might be a better fit. He could rebuild his career up there like Brendon Rodgers did. Who would fancy a job managing Dads Army which I feel is the biggest problem. We have been found out now. Hang a ball under our cross bar, our keeper is flapping at crosses and attack us early as we seem to be conceding early at the moment. We will probably be ok but looking forward I would like to see a major overhaul of the squad. Whats not helping is that anyone who plays at centre back gets injured. Some of our higher paid players also look like they are collecting their pensions. I can live with getting beat, what hurts is the way we are getting beat.

Edited by Chubskip (17 Feb 2021 1.48pm)

Edited by Chubskip (17 Feb 2021 2.07pm)

 

taylors lovechild Flag 17 Feb 21 1.49pm

If Roy does go now or in the summer then there is going to need to be patience with whoever replaces him. Personally I can't see Parish risking bringing in a foreign manager from abroad, so then it is really whether he is willing to risk choosing a lower league manager with no PL experience like Cooper, or whether he continues to go with tried and tested. If it's the latter then there really aren't a great many options. As much as I'm not sold on Howe, imagine if Parish went after another out of work manager (who supposedly he approached in the past) and who went by the nickname Sparky, and who I'd rather punch myself repeatedly in the balls than have him in charge.

 

pstrutt Flag Busselton, WA 17 Feb 21 3.14pm

Originally posted by Swindy

If true, and I really hope it's not, a truly awful choice. Highly overrated manager and highly unlikely to attract much in the way of better players.
But would be typically Parish, uninspiring, mediocre on a budget and proper championship thinking.

This^

You would assume we want to push on as a club. I don't think we could afford Rafa, or the players Rafa would want, but someone of his profile suits the direction we should be pushing ourselves toward. We are not just hoping for survival are we? Otherwise, Parish becomes one of those supporters who is happy so long as we are 17th or above come the end of the season. That's not a problem if you're just a fan. If you're a 7 years Premier League Chairman, it's a disgrace.

 


So I manage a Workshop which provides a safe learning environment for blokes struggling with PTSD and other mental health issues. Being a Palace fan isn't listed yet.

pstrutt Flag Busselton, WA 17 Feb 21 3.16pm

Originally posted by taylors lovechild

If Roy does go now or in the summer then there is going to need to be patience with whoever replaces him. Personally I can't see Parish risking bringing in a foreign manager from abroad, so then it is really whether he is willing to risk choosing a lower league manager with no PL experience like Cooper, or whether he continues to go with tried and tested. If it's the latter then there really aren't a great many options. As much as I'm not sold on Howe, imagine if Parish went after another out of work manager (who supposedly he approached in the past) and who went by the nickname Sparky, and who I'd rather punch myself repeatedly in the balls than have him in charge.

And middle name "Managerial Failure."

 


So I manage a Workshop which provides a safe learning environment for blokes struggling with PTSD and other mental health issues. Being a Palace fan isn't listed yet.

nectoneagle Flag necton 17 Feb 21 3.24pm

Just an observation but following the W.Brom fixture we have a 2 week gap in fixtures.
By that time we could either have won verses Fulham and W.Brom and are relatively safe or have lost both to be deeply in the mire.
This would be a good time to switch to new man.
I have discounted Brihton as barring miracles another abject performance is on the cards.
Any thoughts?

 

AERO Flag 17 Feb 21 4.07pm

And also hopefully have our better players back.

 

TheBigToePunt Flag 17 Feb 21 4.18pm

Originally posted by nectoneagle

Just an observation but following the W.Brom fixture we have a 2 week gap in fixtures.
By that time we could either have won verses Fulham and W.Brom and are relatively safe or have lost both to be deeply in the mire.
This would be a good time to switch to new man.
I have discounted Brihton as barring miracles another abject performance is on the cards.
Any thoughts?

Good point, We will certainly know more about where we are by that point, and clubs have certainly used such long breaks to make changes before.

 

PatrickA Flag London 18 Feb 21 11.15am

Steve Coppell was a guest on a podcast a few days ago and is of the opinion that to have any chance of succeeding in football management as a minimum there are two prerequisites,
- Successful recruitment policy
- A method of playing that suits the available players (as opposed to shoehorning the players into a preferred but unsuitable system).
That set me thinking of Dyche and Howe as possible candidates.
Dyche is good at what he does.
An uncomplicated 442 with two hard working central midfielders and two physical strikers. Lots of passes into the channels and crosses with a view to testing the resolve of the opposition.
I don't think this would suit our existing players, in particular Eze and Zaha.
Howe has used more varied tactics with more possession in midfield and utilisation of ball players which may suit the likes of Eze and Zaha.
Arguably Howe would be a better fit for our current squad, but a lot will depend on recruitment plans for the summer.
I'm sure there will be other managerial candidates as well but the central point about recruitment and most appropriate playing system for the squad remains applicable.

 

southnorwoodhill Flag 18 Feb 21 11.25am

Originally posted by PatrickA

Steve Coppell was a guest on a podcast a few days ago and is of the opinion that to have any chance of succeeding in football management as a minimum there are two prerequisites,
- Successful recruitment policy
- A method of playing that suits the available players (as opposed to shoehorning the players into a preferred but unsuitable system).
That set me thinking of Dyche and Howe as possible candidates.
Dyche is good at what he does.
An uncomplicated 442 with two hard working central midfielders and two physical strikers. Lots of passes into the channels and crosses with a view to testing the resolve of the opposition.
I don't think this would suit our existing players, in particular Eze and Zaha.
Howe has used more varied tactics with more possession in midfield and utilisation of ball players which may suit the likes of Eze and Zaha.
Arguably Howe would be a better fit for our current squad, but a lot will depend on recruitment plans for the summer.
I'm sure there will be other managerial candidates as well but the central point about recruitment and most appropriate playing system for the squad remains applicable.

Perhaps this explains Hodgson's acquisitions, players who are over the hill or didn't add anything significant to the technical ability of the squad, namely Cahill, McCarthy, and Kouyate. All three unnecessary yet reflect Hodgson's defensive approach to game management. Let's not even go there with Sorloth.
If it were Howe, is there a transfer kitty available for modest signings to fit his overall philosophy?
Decent young players come at a price, look at Eze for example.


Edited by southnorwoodhill (18 Feb 2021 11.49am)

 

Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 18 Feb 21 12.22pm

Unsubstantiated bollocks.

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

TheBigToePunt Flag 18 Feb 21 12.24pm

They always used to say that a manager stood or fell by his recruitment, and that tactics were secondary. I'm not sure you can say that any more, as there really isn't such a thing as a manager now, just a first team coach who has little or nothing to do with recruitment.

I'd be very surprised if Hodgson identified transfer targets at all. Every transfer window he tells the press that he hopes the club will improve the squad, but never mentions having identified targets. He probably highlights weak positions, if that.

Even klopp has been quite clear that whether Liverpool signed the new centre half he so desperately needed wasn't up to him. Dyche looks like he has a say in the running of Burnley, but not enough to get the club to extend the contracts of several players he clearly wanted to keep last summer, so even he doesn't have any real clout.

Funny enough, the only guy I can think of who seemed to have something close to final say on signings recently was Howe at Bournemouth, but on reflection that's just a presumption. Either way, he had very mixed results, and we have a director of football at Palace, so I'd reckon the next managers recruitment record wouldn't matter as much as his ability to use a system that gets enough points to keep us up (preferably comfortably), and get the best out of whatever squad he'll inherit, and to develop individuals, especially young ones. If it's possible to do all three at the same time, which it might not be.

Dyche ticks the first box with his eyes closed, but the only players he developed into valuable assets were central defenders and goalkeepers.

 

Putitout Flag Oxford 18 Feb 21 12.35pm

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

Perhaps this explains Hodgson's acquisitions, players who are over the hill or didn't add anything significant to the technical ability of the squad, namely Cahill, McCarthy, and Kouyate. All three unnecessary yet reflect Hodgson's defensive approach to game management. Let's not even go there with Sorloth.
If it were Howe, is there a transfer kitty available for modest signings to fit his overall philosophy?
Decent young players come at a price, look at Eze for example.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (18 Feb 2021 11.49am)

This is the problem, they might seem to reflect Hodgsons approach,
But is that because we couldn’t finance any other approach without going the same way as most clubs that have tried, even having spent a good amount more than Palace, have?
Bargain basement is whats been signed. Reasonably reliable old bangers, have seen better days types. Still know how to shut a door types , though even that has now worn dangerously thin.
Howe had a wealthy Russian bankrolling , what did Howe get him ? Relegation.. Why would Steve , try to outdo the wealthy Russian.?
My feeling is even if the club can come up with some money , they need to look beyond Howe,.

 

JRW2 Flag Dulwich 18 Feb 21 12.47pm

Originally posted by Cucking Funt

Unsubstantiated bollocks.

Interesting opinion. But to which bollocks are you referring?

 

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