I'm glad, it was either that or early onset of alzheimers.

Maybe you should be explaining why you haven't posted against the posters on here supporting Hamas's constitution.

Personally I do feel there has been anti semitism on this thread....Maybe not from you (after you stated you don't support Hamas firing rockets) but from certain others .

I don't support any innocent dying......This action led to that.....Attacks upon facilities that should be safe need to be investigated.

However support for Hamas.....That you somehow seem not to have read on this thread.....Is also wrong headed.....And most have stayed silent.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

F*cking bullsh*t.

This whole 'support Israel as they have democracy and respect freedom of expression' argument needs to be put in it's place. The concept if democracy encompasses so much more than just being able to vote. When Israel removes so many liberties from Palestinians, both in gaza and in Jerusalem, you see that the modern notion of collective freedom regardless of race, gender etc. isn't respected in any way by Israel, and this is one of the fundamental tenants of western democracy.

I don't support Hamas, but Israel are just as bad and the fact we still have such a strong pro-Israel lobby here and in the US exposes the myth that we know what's best. At the end of the day if you live in gaza your life is inconceivably sh*t, and Israel is spreading fear and terror through the lives of thousands. Imagine going to bed and not knowing if your child may be taken or your house blown up by the sunrise. That's what terrorism is, a psychological attack, and as bad as Hamas are I don't deal that fear is on the same level if you are an Israeli.

If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

I went into a coma after the word 'encompasses'.

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

Clearly, it is right to support the "oppressed" in this situation ,the Palestinians, against the "oppressor", Israel, in terms that the aim should be a halt asap to the attack on Gaza. Any longer term deal should encompass Israel vacating all of the occupied territories.

Take that out of the equation, and it is true that minorities in Israel enjoy greater protection under the law than minorities in many countries in the region (ie Shia in Saudi and Bahrain),but that's no excuse.

What worries me about HAMAS (as opposed to the Palestinian people) is not that it is wrong for the Palestinians to conclude that armed struggle in the present circumstances is legitimate. Rather, what HAMAS envisage as the end game in terms of the type of state/society they aspire to, just as the Islamic State movement in Iraq/Syria alarms me with sentencing of woman to death by stoning for adultery, requirements all women are fully veiled, and cutting off men's hands for watching the World Cup on TV, all in the name of "jihad" (and more violence at times in recent weeks than in Gaza but barely any media attention because harder for journalists to be on the spot and no marches protesting in the wider world).

So, I think its important people don't overlook that supporting "getting into bed with" the oppressed (which is a very natural and legitimate decision) doesn't mean that some
very undesirable people with a very fixed agenda might be in the bed...ie back in the 1970's supporting resistance to the Shah in Iran and what transpired after "the revolution" or being anti Assad and seeing what is transpiring now in the "caliphate".

So, critical support for HAMAS as the effective governing body in Gaza rather than seeing them as lily white and bearing in mind morality in pursuing aims in not divisible.

Personally, these parts of the HAMAS Charter tell me we are not talking about simply fighting the oppressor for justice so all can live in a democratic state:

"the Hamas has been looking forward to implement Allah’s promise whatever time it might take.The prophet, prayer and peace be upon him, said: The time will not come until Muslims will fight the Jews (and kill them); until the Jews hide behind rocks and trees, which will cry: O Muslim! there is a Jew hiding behind me, come on and kill him! This will not apply to the Gharqad, which is a Jewish tree (cited by Bukhari and Muslim).

...Today it is Palestine and tomorrow it may be another country or other countries. For Zionist scheming has no end, and after Palestine they will covet expansion from the Nile to the Euphrates. Only when they have completed digesting the area on which they will have laid their hand, they will look forward to more expansion, etc. Their scheme has been laid out in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion

...There was no war that broke out anywhere without their fingerprints on it

Peace] initiatives, the so-called peaceful solutions, and the international conferences to resolve the Palestinian problem, are all contrary to the beliefs of the Islamic Resistance Movement. For renouncing any part of Palestine means renouncing part of the religion; the nationalism of the Islamic Resistance Movement is part of its faith, the movement educates its members to adhere to its principles and to raise the banner of Allah over their homeland as they fight their Jihad: “Allah is the all-powerful, but most people are not aware.” From time to time a clamoring is voiced, to hold an International Conference in search for a solution to the problem. Some accept the idea, others reject it, for one reason or another, demanding the implementation of this or that condition, as a prerequisite for agreeing to convene the Conference or for participating in it. But the Islamic Resistance Movement, which is aware of the [prospective] parties to this conference, and of their past and present positions towards the problems of the Muslims, does not believe that those conferences are capable of responding to demands, or of restoring rights or doing justice to the oppressed. Those conferences are no more than a means to appoint the nonbelievers as arbitrators in the lands of Islam. Since when did the Unbelievers do justice to the Believers? “And the Jews will not be pleased with thee, nor will the Christians, till thou follow their creed. Say: Lo! the guidance of Allah [himself] is the Guidance. And if you should follow their desires after the knowledge which has come unto thee, then you would have from Allah no protecting friend nor helper.” Sura 2 (the Cow), verse 120 There is no solution to the Palestinian problem except by Jihad"

Possibly not an outcome minorities in Palestine such as Christians would relish, given HAMAS' brutal suppression of Fatah in Gaza a few years ago.

None of which excuses what Israel is doing, nor the legitimacy of opposing it.

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Anyone supporting Hamas essentially is supporting an organization with similar aims to the Nazis because you don't like the stronger opposition.....Like supporting ISIS in Syria because we don't like Assad.

Very few people wouldn't recognise the validity in defending your home against attack. Fighting people who have unfairly caused the deaths of family members.

However that is a million miles away from supporting Hamas.

Israel has a right to fight Hamas due to the organisation's very nature. What Israel doesn't have a right to do is attack or kill anyone else.

It's why this action is ill conceived and works against them......The tunnels could have been tackled from the other end.....Strike attacks against the Hamas leadership could have continued.

Laying waste to parts of Gaza just continues to weaken what moderates remain.

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'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)