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Franca’s Opportunity??


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thegreatlardino Flag crawley/selsey 13 Feb 24 5.45pm

i dont think left side midfield is his position, more of an eze type just wandering around in the centre, do think he should have been replaced by schlupp to give mitchell some cover at the end...

 


Sometimes I set out for Ludlow
Sometimes I end up in Chepstow

Gary St.Andrews Flag Kenley 13 Feb 24 6.10pm

He played well and was a really good outlet down the left. Sam Johnson might well have found him earlier if he had been playing so he would have had more opportunities against Chelsea’s right back.

In fact all 4 of the new outfield players did well, things will start to gell with more game time….

Edited by Gary St.Andrews (13 Feb 2024 6.11pm)

 

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 13 Feb 24 6.30pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Who would you play? Our dynamic non scoring midfielder in Schlupp, or our somewhat rather lazy Edouard. Neither offer a great deal on the left side. I think I prefer to give Franca a go.

Right now, we don't have many options.
Schlupp is losing whatever he had and Franca has much needed pace.

I'd start him all the time Olise is injured but only through lack of choice.

 

Rainforest Flag London England 13 Feb 24 6.41pm

Originally posted by est1905

He didn't improve as he went along. He was still making positional and defensive errors right up to the end. Equally he still did a few good things going forward right up to the end.

He is new to football and life in this country. Also, there is the language issue. Hopefully, he will overcome these setbacks and get adjusted when he starting to know more people whether from his own country or local here.

 

DenTyler Flag Sidcup 13 Feb 24 9.25pm

I think he did fine for his first league start and against Chelsea. We know they are not the team of old but for a kid from Brazil it may have phased him the first period of the game, I think he grew into the game but was knackered a good 10 minutes before he came off. It will take some time to get match sharp. He is really raw and do I think he was worth what we paid… probably not but We are where we are and we don’t know what he is going to do which means most defenders won’t know what he is going to do and how good is it not to be predictable Palace all the time.

I do get the concern about the defensive side of things but surely the supposedly great defence minded manager we have can work out a way to get cover so he is free to roam. I definitely don’t think it is a good idea to have him in front of Mitchell. He needs to be in the middle where he gets plenty of cover and mateta, Lerma and hughes can be in his ear more.

I said earlier he would be better on the right with Munoz behind him but maybe there is a way to sit him in front of a midfield 3 behind Mateta who is like a new player at the moment and Franca with his pace can feed off him.

 

Rachid Rachid Rachid Flag 13 Feb 24 10.03pm

Thought he offered us our only outlet through his pace over a few yards and that he gave Chelsea something to think about so he as to be picked on that basis alone. But he was dispossessed very easily and literally presented the ball to the defender a couple of times when faced up just as he did Mykolenko.

Wharton was great. Busy, composed and quick to spot a forward pass.

 

Norbury Old Git Flag London 14 Feb 24 11.07am

Originally posted by Rachid Rachid Rachid

Thought he offered us our only outlet through his pace over a few yards and that he gave Chelsea something to think about so he as to be picked on that basis alone. But he was dispossessed very easily and literally presented the ball to the defender a couple of times when faced up just as he did Mykolenko.

Wharton was great. Busy, composed and quick to spot a forward pass.

Despite his failings, Franca is a teenager who speaks little English, has moved from another continent to a new style of football. I don’t remember Olise setting the world alight on his first few matches even after his injuries but he was given the chance to improve. I saw enough to give me hope that he may develop to become a decent Premier League player hopefully with us.

 

thai-eagle Flag chiang mai 14 Feb 24 11.26am

Think we have a great footballer here. Give him game time, play him behind Mateta and he will blossom. Good touches, eye for a pass and real shooting boots. Franca any given game compared to Schlupp.

 

palace99 Flag New Mills 14 Feb 24 11.45am

Originally posted by Rachid Rachid Rachid

Thought he offered us our only outlet through his pace over a few yards and that he gave Chelsea something to think about so he as to be picked on that basis alone. But he was dispossessed very easily and literally presented the ball to the defender a couple of times when faced up just as he did Mykolenko.

Wharton was great. Busy, composed and quick to spot a forward pass.

yes, that is my biggest concern.

Happy to give the guy time as he is young and is adapting to a new country etc, however, surely a skilful player will have a few tricks up his sleeve.
When he did get a couple of 1 on 1s opportunities he did look clueless.
At one point in the 1st half he had space in front of him to run into and almost stood still.

If we are going to play him i would prefer to see him in the Eze/No10 role as he seems more suited to that.

 

palace99 Flag New Mills 14 Feb 24 11.52am

Originally posted by Norbury Old Git

Despite his failings, Franca is a teenager who speaks little English, has moved from another continent to a new style of football. I don’t remember Olise setting the world alight on his first few matches even after his injuries but he was given the chance to improve. I saw enough to give me hope that he may develop to become a decent Premier League player hopefully with us.

for accuracy Olise arrived injured so was slowly introduced to the team from the bench from Sept onwards. He scored quite early into his Palace career as a sub v Leicester and also had a hand in a couple of goals. In October he was given his 1st start v Newcastle, before he went back onto the bench. He was a regular starter from Jan onwards, after his impressive performance v Millwall.

Comparing Olise and Franca is a little unfair however if you do, Olise's impact was clearly greater.

 

EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 14 Feb 24 12.24pm

Originally posted by Canterbury Palace


I'm sorry but I have to disagree. Schlupp offers absolutely nothing.

One goal and one assist in 1200+ minutes this season. Three goals and two assists in 2600+ minutes last season. That is simply nowhere near good enough for a team who are struggling to score, especially when we already have Ayew on the other wing.

The last seven games in which Schlupp has played 45 minutes or more, we've won a single point. I'm not pinning the blame just on him for that but he doesn't help.

We also conceded 20 goals in that run so it's not like he's some defensive colossus who helps us keep a tight ship.

We simply cannot have a front three of Schlupp, Ayew and Mateta, all of whom are goal shy. If it's not going to be Franca, it has to be Edoaurd.

Completely agree - Schlupp is just about acceptable in a midfield 3, but he shouldn't be anywhere near the forward positions these days.

As you say, him Ayew and JP as a 3 is just too blunt to be a front line at this level.

Franca should be given the opportunity whilst Eze, Olise and JRS are all injured - he looks far from complete but in terms of profile is a much more suitable replacement.

For those saying Roy has been vindicated in not playing him all season by that performance;

Firstly, I don't think Franca made us a worse team at all, and if anything I'm even more baffled why he's never been given an opportunity before. Chelsea are still a team full of quality, and they have a particularly offensive RB - Franca's defensive naivety is not going to be as obvious as that in every game, and going forward he offers considerably more threat than Schlupp. He didn't look miles out of his depth by any means.

Secondly, imagine he had these sort of development opportunities from the start of the season, how much further would he be along by now? The only way to solve naivety is with experience, and Roy's unwillingness to offer him any is just as much to blame. If he was 6 months into playing at this level with regular starts and minutes, I think we'd have a real asset on our hands by now.

But Roy has no interest in developing players or finding solutions, so why bother. He has no stake in Franca's development beyond this year, so why take the 'risk' of a few mistakes along the way to aid his development... it would be someone else who benefits from that in future seasons, so no incentive to care.

 

n wales eagles Flag llandudno 14 Feb 24 12.36pm

I'm sure he will be next season's championship young plaher of the year

 

NEILLO Flag Shoreham-by-Sea 14 Feb 24 1.42pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Completely agree - Schlupp is just about acceptable in a midfield 3, but he shouldn't be anywhere near the forward positions these days.

As you say, him Ayew and JP as a 3 is just too blunt to be a front line at this level.

Franca should be given the opportunity whilst Eze, Olise and JRS are all injured - he looks far from complete but in terms of profile is a much more suitable replacement.

For those saying Roy has been vindicated in not playing him all season by that performance;

Firstly, I don't think Franca made us a worse team at all, and if anything I'm even more baffled why he's never been given an opportunity before. Chelsea are still a team full of quality, and they have a particularly offensive RB - Franca's defensive naivety is not going to be as obvious as that in every game, and going forward he offers considerably more threat than Schlupp. He didn't look miles out of his depth by any means.

Secondly, imagine he had these sort of development opportunities from the start of the season, how much further would he be along by now? The only way to solve naivety is with experience, and Roy's unwillingness to offer him any is just as much to blame. If he was 6 months into playing at this level with regular starts and minutes, I think we'd have a real asset on our hands by now.

But Roy has no interest in developing players or finding solutions, so why bother. He has no stake in Franca's development beyond this year, so why take the 'risk' of a few mistakes along the way to aid his development... it would be someone else who benefits from that in future seasons, so no incentive to care.

Given your thoughts on Hodgson I think the question should be why did we buy Franca in the first place ?

Also worth factoring in is that Franca came to us already carrying an injury which delayed his availability until October - so not the start of the season. He's not had the opportunity to be six months into playing at this level.

Hodgson's job is to win football matches. That's his first priority, not player development. His methodology is well known. If he perceives there to be a risk in starting Franca then he's obviously not going to take it.

Hodgson's almost been forced into selecting him now, and I really hope Franca comes to be as good as we all hope he will be.

Let's also hope that Palace stay up and that with the benefit of a proper pre season under his belt, Franca makes real progress next season.

 


Old, Ungifted and White

A1969Eagle Flag Redhill 14 Feb 24 1.46pm

Reading these posts, observations.

You can tell who was that match.

You can who sat at home or in the pub.

You can read who has an understanding of team playing and who is clueless, like wise for individual players.

It seems those who used to pick on Ayew, need another target.

At the match, you see the bigger picture.

I was at 1st Matches (starting) for raw Zaha, Wright, Collymore, AWB, Bright to name a few. They all had starts like Franco, raw, giving there all.

If you were at the match you see so much more and you aint for one listening to strange commentary!

Franco wasn't frightened of trying to make a difference, and he did stretch Chelsea at times... they didnt know how to handle him.
He has deceptive speed.
We now have three players we jump to our feet when they have the ball.. Eze, Olise and now Franco!!

 

EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 14 Feb 24 1.50pm

Originally posted by NEILLO

Given your thoughts on Hodgson I think the question should be why did we buy Franca in the first place ?

Also worth factoring in is that Franca came to us already carrying an injury which delayed his availability until October - so not the start of the season. He's not had the opportunity to be six months into playing at this level.

Hodgson's job is to win football matches. That's his first priority, not player development. His methodology is well known. If he perceives there to be a risk in starting Franca then he's obviously not going to take it.

Hodgson's almost been forced into selecting him now, and I really hope Franca comes to be as good as we all hope he will be.

Let's also hope that Palace stay up and that with the benefit of a proper pre season under his belt, Franca makes real progress next season.

I think asking why we hired a coach with no interest in young players, having spent the last however many years declaring ourselves as a club focused on developing young players, is a very good question - it’s a complete mismatch between the club and the manager, which is always going to end up being problematic.

Ok, call it four months at this level if you want - the point still stands that he could already be a lot more developed than he is.

As for the bit in bold, it his job and he’s failing miserably at it. Questions around his priorities and methodologies are perfectly valid when he is failing to do, as you correctly highlight, the main function of his job.

 

MrRobbo Flag Chaldon 14 Feb 24 1.57pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Completely agree - Schlupp is just about acceptable in a midfield 3, but he shouldn't be anywhere near the forward positions these days.

As you say, him Ayew and JP as a 3 is just too blunt to be a front line at this level.

Franca should be given the opportunity whilst Eze, Olise and JRS are all injured - he looks far from complete but in terms of profile is a much more suitable replacement.

For those saying Roy has been vindicated in not playing him all season by that performance;

Firstly, I don't think Franca made us a worse team at all, and if anything I'm even more baffled why he's never been given an opportunity before. Chelsea are still a team full of quality, and they have a particularly offensive RB - Franca's defensive naivety is not going to be as obvious as that in every game, and going forward he offers considerably more threat than Schlupp. He didn't look miles out of his depth by any means.

Secondly, imagine he had these sort of development opportunities from the start of the season, how much further would he be along by now? The only way to solve naivety is with experience, and Roy's unwillingness to offer him any is just as much to blame. If he was 6 months into playing at this level with regular starts and minutes, I think we'd have a real asset on our hands by now.

But Roy has no interest in developing players or finding solutions, so why bother. He has no stake in Franca's development beyond this year, so why take the 'risk' of a few mistakes along the way to aid his development... it would be someone else who benefits from that in future seasons, so no incentive to care.

A lot of truth in this.

For me the bottom line is Franca is not ready. Roy has been right not to trust him, all the while we are tight and looking for 1-0 wins.

Without Olise and Eze we have next to zero attacking intent, so have to throw caution to the wind. And whilst horrible from a positional perspective, he did on occasion give them something to think about.

My bigger worry would be the 'extensive' scouting DF put in to the deal, its clear that the boy is nowhere near ready. And worth nowhere near what we paid for him.

 

NEILLO Flag Shoreham-by-Sea 14 Feb 24 2.11pm

Originally posted by A1969Eagle

Reading these posts, observations.

You can tell who was that match.

You can who sat at home or in the pub.

You can read who has an understanding of team playing and who is clueless, like wise for individual players.

It seems those who used to pick on Ayew, need another target.

At the match, you see the bigger picture.

I was at 1st Matches (starting) for raw Zaha, Wright, Collymore, AWB, Bright to name a few. They all had starts like Franco, raw, giving there all.

If you were at the match you see so much more and you aint for one listening to strange commentary!

Franco wasn't frightened of trying to make a difference, and he did stretch Chelsea at times... they didnt know how to handle him.
He has deceptive speed.
We now have three players we jump to our feet when they have the ball.. Eze, Olise and now Franco!!

So was I. Let's bear in mind the majority of those were learning their trade at a lower level.

And I was at the match the other night.

Franca has potential and if he can emulate the players you mention ( Stan away from Palace obviously ) playing for Palace, great.

 


Old, Ungifted and White

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Feb 24 2.11pm

I think the issue here is about our league position.

Were we to be comfortable and with a full squad available, I'm sure Franca would have been introduced slowly in what would be a confident environment.
As it is, he is under unfair pressure to perform in a situation where getting points is far more important than developing young players.

Right now, he is starting because other options are unavailable or not doing the business. He will either bloom or flounder under this sort of pressure, and will either be a new superstar or a decent squad player.
He's shown enough to suggest that he has more to offer.

 

PatrickA Flag London 14 Feb 24 2.12pm

We've had only two 1-0 wins all season, the second of which was nearly 6 months ago.
If Roy is going for 1-0 wins he's failing miserably.
We hardly ever keep a clean sheet so we have to find a goal in a game to even achieve a point.
A front 3 of Ayew, Mateta and Schlupp together with a midfield that struggles to score is unlikely to trouble too many defences.
I don't know whether Franca can be the panacea for our woes in front of goal, but anything that increases our creative potential is welcome to me.

Originally posted by MrRobbo

A lot of truth in this.

For me the bottom line is Franca is not ready. Roy has been right not to trust him, all the while we are tight and looking for 1-0 wins.

Without Olise and Eze we have next to zero attacking intent, so have to throw caution to the wind. And whilst horrible from a positional perspective, he did on occasion give them something to think about.

My bigger worry would be the 'extensive' scouting DF put in to the deal, its clear that the boy is nowhere near ready. And worth nowhere near what we paid for him.

 

EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 14 Feb 24 3.38pm

Originally posted by MrRobbo

A lot of truth in this.

For me the bottom line is Franca is not ready. Roy has been right not to trust him, all the while we are tight and looking for 1-0 wins.

Without Olise and Eze we have next to zero attacking intent, so have to throw caution to the wind. And whilst horrible from a positional perspective, he did on occasion give them something to think about.

My bigger worry would be the 'extensive' scouting DF put in to the deal, its clear that the boy is nowhere near ready. And worth nowhere near what we paid for him.

I get a bit lost on this bit.

For what it’s worth, I agree Franca doesn’t look ‘ready’ to regularly impact games at this level, but neither is Schlupp or half of the others he’s competing with.

Roy made a decision that we are better off aiming for solidity rather than taking a punt on Franca - since then, we’ve been humped all over the place and failed to achieve anything close to ‘solidity’ - if we’ve given up any hope of creativity, and still failed to make ourselves solid, in what way can Roy be considered correct in his judgement?

Both his decision, and the execution of it, have not gone remotely well

We don’t know how it would have played out in recent months if Franca had more minutes, but we do know how it has played out when he hasn’t, and it couldn’t be much worse

 

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