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 nairb75  Baltimore 25 Sep 15 1.15pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 1.01pm
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 12.03pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.38am
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 11.19am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.13am
Quote since1953 at 25 Sep 2015 10.47am
Watching BBC News yesterday afternoon/evening two things particularly struck a chord: It should only be a quota for refugees, not migrants. The failure to clearly distinguish between the two is likely as not part of the EU's pro-corporate policy and a means by which it can essentially enforce additional working economic migration from outside the EU. I don't have an issue with the UK giving refuge to those in need or danger. I draw the line at exploiting the desire of people for a better life as a means to undermine workers capacity to demand a fair wage in other countries - which is exactly what the EU Right of Movement has achieved. I think as has been pointed out elsewhere, the moment you pass though a safe haven, you are an economic migrant. Yes, but linguistic that's bollocks. You don't stop being a refugee until you have asylum or temporary residence - That's a political convenience by which governments in less 'accessible' countries can duck their obligations. Its 'new speak'
No I think a refugee is someone displaced or persecuted in their own country, and has no choice but to either flee or seek protection from their own country. A migrant is someone moving from one country to another - It could be a refugee, but it isn't necessarily a refugee. My wife is a migrant, she left South Africa, came to the UK and taught. My friend Sirous is a refugee, because his mother, with him, fled Iran after the regime 'murdered' his father, elder brother and two uncles. the people coming from syria are all refugees. it's not as if there are migrant syrians just taking a stroll through europe and may stay. they're ALL fleeing. why even both distinguishing in this situation? you don't put your family in a raft and go across the sea to sniff around if you like the place.
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Kermit8  Hevon 25 Sep 15 1.16pm |
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You can pass through countries and are still a refugee if you are fleeing war according to the UN so 'no' - if you are from Aleppo then you are most certainly not an economic migrant no matter where you end up. Individual countries take on it may be different but that is how the United Nations sees it as do I. Edited by Kermit8 (25 Sep 2015 1.18pm)
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Stuk  Top half 25 Sep 15 1.54pm |
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Quote nairb75 at 25 Sep 2015 1.15pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 1.01pm
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 12.03pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.38am
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 11.19am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.13am
Quote since1953 at 25 Sep 2015 10.47am
Watching BBC News yesterday afternoon/evening two things particularly struck a chord: It should only be a quota for refugees, not migrants. The failure to clearly distinguish between the two is likely as not part of the EU's pro-corporate policy and a means by which it can essentially enforce additional working economic migration from outside the EU. I don't have an issue with the UK giving refuge to those in need or danger. I draw the line at exploiting the desire of people for a better life as a means to undermine workers capacity to demand a fair wage in other countries - which is exactly what the EU Right of Movement has achieved. I think as has been pointed out elsewhere, the moment you pass though a safe haven, you are an economic migrant. Yes, but linguistic that's bollocks. You don't stop being a refugee until you have asylum or temporary residence - That's a political convenience by which governments in less 'accessible' countries can duck their obligations. Its 'new speak'
No I think a refugee is someone displaced or persecuted in their own country, and has no choice but to either flee or seek protection from their own country. A migrant is someone moving from one country to another - It could be a refugee, but it isn't necessarily a refugee. My wife is a migrant, she left South Africa, came to the UK and taught. My friend Sirous is a refugee, because his mother, with him, fled Iran after the regime 'murdered' his father, elder brother and two uncles. the people coming from syria are all refugees. it's not as if there are migrant syrians just taking a stroll through europe and may stay. they're ALL fleeing. why even both distinguishing in this situation? you don't put your family in a raft and go across the sea to sniff around if you like the place.
Optimistic as ever |
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| susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 25 Sep 15 2.47pm |
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Quote Stuk at 25 Sep 2015 1.54pm
Quote nairb75 at 25 Sep 2015 1.15pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 1.01pm
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 12.03pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.38am
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 11.19am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.13am
Quote since1953 at 25 Sep 2015 10.47am
Watching BBC News yesterday afternoon/evening two things particularly struck a chord: It should only be a quota for refugees, not migrants. The failure to clearly distinguish between the two is likely as not part of the EU's pro-corporate policy and a means by which it can essentially enforce additional working economic migration from outside the EU. I don't have an issue with the UK giving refuge to those in need or danger. I draw the line at exploiting the desire of people for a better life as a means to undermine workers capacity to demand a fair wage in other countries - which is exactly what the EU Right of Movement has achieved. I think as has been pointed out elsewhere, the moment you pass though a safe haven, you are an economic migrant. Yes, but linguistic that's bollocks. You don't stop being a refugee until you have asylum or temporary residence - That's a political convenience by which governments in less 'accessible' countries can duck their obligations. Its 'new speak'
No I think a refugee is someone displaced or persecuted in their own country, and has no choice but to either flee or seek protection from their own country. A migrant is someone moving from one country to another - It could be a refugee, but it isn't necessarily a refugee. My wife is a migrant, she left South Africa, came to the UK and taught. My friend Sirous is a refugee, because his mother, with him, fled Iran after the regime 'murdered' his father, elder brother and two uncles. the people coming from syria are all refugees. it's not as if there are migrant syrians just taking a stroll through europe and may stay. they're ALL fleeing. why even both distinguishing in this situation? you don't put your family in a raft and go across the sea to sniff around if you like the place.
The guy admits his situation is far from desperate. He has a job, albeit a low paid one, as a security guard and a roof over his head. He does not fear for his life on a daily basis as many Algerians did during the brutal civil war of the 1990s, the period known as "the black decade". In 2009 the Algerian government made clandestine emigration a crime, punishable by fines and two to six months in prison. Equipped with new boats and helicopters, the coastguard has also stepped up night-time patrols along the country's 1,200km shoreline. Algeria has become a guard dog for 'Fortress Europe' The government has urged young people to stay put to help build their own nation. Since the uprising in neighbouring Tunisia, which began in 2010, the Algerian authorities have extended youth employment schemes and given young people interest free loans to set up their own businesses. "We are helping to provoke changes in mentality," says Mr Zemali. "As well as financial help, we are trying to give young people values, get them to take responsibility for themselves. So we're creating a new generation which takes initiative, which is dynamic." It seems that a lot of youths we see on our news are no more fleeing war than you or I am! I like the idea of the Algeria has become a guard dog for 'Fortress Europe' perhaps we should help all the other countries to form the same sort of "guard dog" that will stop all these "swarms of people" invading our shores and just take in GENUINE refugees. It has to be controlled as many other European countries are doing now by just closing borders down..... Let Germany have them all as Angela Merkel did after all invite them all.......although its backfired in her face and its made her look a right tw@t now!!!
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| matt_himself Matataland 25 Sep 15 3.16pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 12.57pm
Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 12.00pm
Its now been a few weeks since this 'crisis' begun and, I ask those who wanted to open our doors to all claiming 'asylum', how many of you have taken in a Syrian family? Please describe your experiences of this situation and how you feel you have benefited human kind. Unless, of course, your actions were limited to self righteous posturings on messageboards and liking photos or emotive meme's on Facebook... The most absurd form of rhetoric. You're better than that Matt. I'm very happy for tax revenues to be spent on humanitarian issues such as refugees fleeing a civil war. I'm not really sure I can fit a Syrian family into my spare room. Probably could take in a person though. I find it funny that people on here and using various forms of social media, stated that if you didn't want all the 'refugees' to come here, then you lack 'compassion' and were a terrible human. Yet, despite all this lazy labelling, no one who was gnashing the teeth at the time appears to have done anything practical to assist the 'refugees'. Funny that.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Kermit8 Hevon 25 Sep 15 3.58pm |
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Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 3.16pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 12.57pm
Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 12.00pm
Its now been a few weeks since this 'crisis' begun and, I ask those who wanted to open our doors to all claiming 'asylum', how many of you have taken in a Syrian family? Please describe your experiences of this situation and how you feel you have benefited human kind. Unless, of course, your actions were limited to self righteous posturings on messageboards and liking photos or emotive meme's on Facebook... The most absurd form of rhetoric. You're better than that Matt. I'm very happy for tax revenues to be spent on humanitarian issues such as refugees fleeing a civil war. I'm not really sure I can fit a Syrian family into my spare room. Probably could take in a person though. I find it funny that people on here and using various forms of social media, stated that if you didn't want all the 'refugees' to come here, then you lack 'compassion' and were a terrible human. Yet, despite all this lazy labelling, no one who was gnashing the teeth at the time appears to have done anything practical to assist the 'refugees'. Funny that.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 25 Sep 15 3.59pm |
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Quote susmik at 25 Sep 2015 2.47pm
Quote Stuk at 25 Sep 2015 1.54pm
Quote nairb75 at 25 Sep 2015 1.15pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 1.01pm
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 12.03pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.38am
Quote chris123 at 25 Sep 2015 11.19am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 11.13am
Quote since1953 at 25 Sep 2015 10.47am
Watching BBC News yesterday afternoon/evening two things particularly struck a chord: It should only be a quota for refugees, not migrants. The failure to clearly distinguish between the two is likely as not part of the EU's pro-corporate policy and a means by which it can essentially enforce additional working economic migration from outside the EU. I don't have an issue with the UK giving refuge to those in need or danger. I draw the line at exploiting the desire of people for a better life as a means to undermine workers capacity to demand a fair wage in other countries - which is exactly what the EU Right of Movement has achieved. I think as has been pointed out elsewhere, the moment you pass though a safe haven, you are an economic migrant. Yes, but linguistic that's bollocks. You don't stop being a refugee until you have asylum or temporary residence - That's a political convenience by which governments in less 'accessible' countries can duck their obligations. Its 'new speak'
No I think a refugee is someone displaced or persecuted in their own country, and has no choice but to either flee or seek protection from their own country. A migrant is someone moving from one country to another - It could be a refugee, but it isn't necessarily a refugee. My wife is a migrant, she left South Africa, came to the UK and taught. My friend Sirous is a refugee, because his mother, with him, fled Iran after the regime 'murdered' his father, elder brother and two uncles. the people coming from syria are all refugees. it's not as if there are migrant syrians just taking a stroll through europe and may stay. they're ALL fleeing. why even both distinguishing in this situation? you don't put your family in a raft and go across the sea to sniff around if you like the place.
The guy admits his situation is far from desperate. He has a job, albeit a low paid one, as a security guard and a roof over his head. He does not fear for his life on a daily basis as many Algerians did during the brutal civil war of the 1990s, the period known as "the black decade". In 2009 the Algerian government made clandestine emigration a crime, punishable by fines and two to six months in prison. Equipped with new boats and helicopters, the coastguard has also stepped up night-time patrols along the country's 1,200km shoreline. Algeria has become a guard dog for 'Fortress Europe' The government has urged young people to stay put to help build their own nation. Since the uprising in neighbouring Tunisia, which began in 2010, the Algerian authorities have extended youth employment schemes and given young people interest free loans to set up their own businesses. "We are helping to provoke changes in mentality," says Mr Zemali. "As well as financial help, we are trying to give young people values, get them to take responsibility for themselves. So we're creating a new generation which takes initiative, which is dynamic." It seems that a lot of youths we see on our news are no more fleeing war than you or I am! I like the idea of the Algeria has become a guard dog for 'Fortress Europe' perhaps we should help all the other countries to form the same sort of "guard dog" that will stop all these "swarms of people" invading our shores and just take in GENUINE refugees. It has to be controlled as many other European countries are doing now by just closing borders down..... Let Germany have them all as Angela Merkel did after all invite them all.......although its backfired in her face and its made her look a right tw@t now!!! Agree with that, immigration should really be about filling vacancies that cannot be filled in the UK, tourism, study, marriage and refugees. I'm happy for people who work here as 'key skill workers' to be eligible for citizenship after say five years. But people who come into the UK for work should not be used as leverage on keeping wages low. Employing someone from outside the UK to do the job for less undermines this country, exploits foreign workers and damages social cohesion. The problem is that people blame the migrants, not those who profit from it. Companies must serve society, and not the other way around.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 25 Sep 15 4.03pm |
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Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 3.16pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 12.57pm
Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 12.00pm
Its now been a few weeks since this 'crisis' begun and, I ask those who wanted to open our doors to all claiming 'asylum', how many of you have taken in a Syrian family? Please describe your experiences of this situation and how you feel you have benefited human kind. Unless, of course, your actions were limited to self righteous posturings on messageboards and liking photos or emotive meme's on Facebook... The most absurd form of rhetoric. You're better than that Matt. I'm very happy for tax revenues to be spent on humanitarian issues such as refugees fleeing a civil war. I'm not really sure I can fit a Syrian family into my spare room. Probably could take in a person though. I find it funny that people on here and using various forms of social media, stated that if you didn't want all the 'refugees' to come here, then you lack 'compassion' and were a terrible human. Yet, despite all this lazy labelling, no one who was gnashing the teeth at the time appears to have done anything practical to assist the 'refugees'. Funny that. No one has responded to my appeal for books, pens or paper etc to send to the schools that have been set up in the camps.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 25 Sep 15 4.12pm |
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Question time last night was full of the usual cliché's. Sickening to see politicians trying to make gain out of this situation. To me it's simple. 1.We need to sort the economic migrants from real refugees We cannot continue to allow migrants to come here. There will be an endless stream of migrants arriving for various reasons, often economic, and that spells disaster for future Europe. Those that are at real risk must be selected and the rest rejected.
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| nairb75 Baltimore 25 Sep 15 6.47pm |
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Quote Stuk at 25 Sep 2015 1.54pm
the people coming from syria are all refugees. it's not as if there are migrant syrians just taking a stroll through europe and may stay. they're ALL fleeing. why even both distinguishing in this situation? you don't put your family in a raft and go across the sea to sniff around if you like the place.
Edited by nairb75 (25 Sep 2015 6.48pm)
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| matt_himself Matataland 25 Sep 15 6.59pm |
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Quote Kermit8 at 25 Sep 2015 3.58pm
Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 3.16pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 25 Sep 2015 12.57pm
Quote matt_himself at 25 Sep 2015 12.00pm
Its now been a few weeks since this 'crisis' begun and, I ask those who wanted to open our doors to all claiming 'asylum', how many of you have taken in a Syrian family? Please describe your experiences of this situation and how you feel you have benefited human kind. Unless, of course, your actions were limited to self righteous posturings on messageboards and liking photos or emotive meme's on Facebook... The most absurd form of rhetoric. You're better than that Matt. I'm very happy for tax revenues to be spent on humanitarian issues such as refugees fleeing a civil war. I'm not really sure I can fit a Syrian family into my spare room. Probably could take in a person though. I find it funny that people on here and using various forms of social media, stated that if you didn't want all the 'refugees' to come here, then you lack 'compassion' and were a terrible human. Yet, despite all this lazy labelling, no one who was gnashing the teeth at the time appears to have done anything practical to assist the 'refugees'. Funny that.
i care not one jot for him or his views, but Gusset appears to be the only one who actually is doing something tangible rather than just gassing about matters, so kudos to him.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Kermit8 Hevon 25 Sep 15 7.00pm |
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Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 25 Sep 2015 4.12pm
Question time last night was full of the usual cliché's. Sickening to see politicians trying to make gain out of this situation. To me it's simple. 1.We need to sort the economic migrants from real refugees We cannot continue to allow migrants to come here. There will be an endless stream of migrants arriving for various reasons, often economic, and that spells disaster for future Europe. Those that are at real risk must be selected and the rest rejected.
The numbers we are seeing the vast majority are genuine refugees. Syrians. It is obvious given what has happened. I wish them all the luck in the world in finding somewhere where they have a future with hope.
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