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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 21 Apr 16 3.18pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Structure and routine is achievable without enforcing gender images onto children. So why force them to make a clearly uniformed decision on it at 4 years old ? Not quite what I am saying - what I am saying is that we enforce gender concepts onto children, from a young age, rather than just let them be whatever they want to be. Children don't need to be conditioned by parents into become boys or girls other than from a social pressure to conform to our own images of male and female, not any naturally defined ones. So why ask them to chose at 4 years old, you are contradicting yourself massively. The idea of gay, trans, hetro, etc shouldn't be relevant to a child, or they all should be relevant. None of them should be relevant to a child of 4 FFS why can't kids just be kids, why in the name of f*ing common sense and sanity should a child be asked to chose it's sexual orientation at 4, it utter lefty bull s* and you know it. It no different really than raising your kid to be religious. We shouldn't raise out kids to emulate us and our ideas, but to foster their ownself and ideas. Ohhhh your going to equate deciding to suck a cock, (or pussy) to deciding to go to sunday school now ?? Jamie for the first time ever your argument is fing weak dude.* "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 21 Apr 16 3.18pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Structure and routine is achievable without enforcing gender images onto children.

So why force them to make a clearly uniformed decision on it at 4 years old ?

Not quite what I am saying - what I am saying is that we enforce gender concepts onto children, from a young age, rather than just let them be whatever they want to be. Children don't need to be conditioned by parents into become boys or girls other than from a social pressure to conform to our own images of male and female, not any naturally defined ones.

So why ask them to chose at 4 years old, you are contradicting yourself massively.

The idea of gay, trans, hetro, etc shouldn't be relevant to a child, or they all should be relevant.

None of them should be relevant to a child of 4 FFS why can't kids just be kids, why in the name of f***ing common sense and sanity should a child be asked to chose it's sexual orientation at 4, it utter lefty bull s*** and you know it.

It no different really than raising your kid to be religious. We shouldn't raise out kids to emulate us and our ideas, but to foster their ownself and ideas.

Ohhhh your going to equate deciding to suck a cock, (or pussy) to deciding to go to sunday school now ??

Jamie for the first time ever your argument is f***ing weak dude.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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jamiemartin721 Reading 21 Apr 16 5.07pm
Originally posted by dannyh None of them should be relevant to a child of 4 FFS So why do we promote gender stereotypes of boy and girl so prolifically. Originally posted by dannyh why in the name of f*ing common sense and sanity should a child be asked to chose it's sexual orientation at 4 Gender - Not sexual orientation. The two can be related, but aren't the same. Gender more refers to male or female (and possibly intersex) at that age. Whilst its highlighted as absurd to let children choose their gender, it seems to be perfectly acceptable for parents and society to implement gender patterning on them (notably how differently we treat boys from girls to the point of massively defining social restrictions and expectation on them). Children don't really start to develop sexuality until they're around 7-9ish and more definitively in and through pubity (for the most part). Originally posted by dannyh it utter lefty bull s* and you know it. I think its a valid question - Why do we expect boys and men, girls and women to adopt so many 'explict' defining gender differences - more notably why do we expect this of men, more than women. I not talking about sexuality here why for example can women wear typically male defined clothing, but not the reverse. Originally posted by dannyh hhhh your going to equate deciding to suck a cock, (or pussy) to deciding to go to sunday school now ?? No, socially conditioning children into socially defined gender paths, based on whether they are male or female. Not sexual orientation. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 21 Apr 16 5.07pm

Originally posted by dannyh

None of them should be relevant to a child of 4 FFS

So why do we promote gender stereotypes of boy and girl so prolifically.

Originally posted by dannyh
why in the name of f***ing common sense and sanity should a child be asked to chose it's sexual orientation at 4

Gender - Not sexual orientation. The two can be related, but aren't the same. Gender more refers to male or female (and possibly intersex) at that age. Whilst its highlighted as absurd to let children choose their gender, it seems to be perfectly acceptable for parents and society to implement gender patterning on them (notably how differently we treat boys from girls to the point of massively defining social restrictions and expectation on them).

Children don't really start to develop sexuality until they're around 7-9ish and more definitively in and through pubity (for the most part).

Originally posted by dannyh

it utter lefty bull s*** and you know it.

I think its a valid question - Why do we expect boys and men, girls and women to adopt so many 'explict' defining gender differences - more notably why do we expect this of men, more than women. I not talking about sexuality here why for example can women wear typically male defined clothing, but not the reverse.

Originally posted by dannyh
hhhh your going to equate deciding to suck a cock, (or pussy) to deciding to go to sunday school now ??

No, socially conditioning children into socially defined gender paths, based on whether they are male or female. Not sexual orientation.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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matt_himself Matataland 21 Apr 16 7.35pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 I don't cheat on the HOL, and am fairly newish to this site. I'm 45 years old now, and married for six years. But I had a life before becoming a Holmesdalesexual Jamie - I believe you are a well read, well educated, person who has got a lot of their knowledge of the World not through experience, but by digging and vicariously viewing the World. What I don't believe is that you enjoyed, prior to marriage, a drugs and sexual hedonism ideal.. Edited by matt_himself (22 Apr 2016 5.40am) "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 21 Apr 16 7.35pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I don't cheat on the HOL, and am fairly newish to this site. I'm 45 years old now, and married for six years.

But I had a life before becoming a Holmesdalesexual

Jamie - I believe you are a well read, well educated, person who has got a lot of their knowledge of the World not through experience, but by digging and vicariously viewing the World.

What I don't believe is that you enjoyed, prior to marriage, a drugs and sexual hedonism ideal..

Edited by matt_himself (22 Apr 2016 5.40am)

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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Hrolf The Ganger 21 Apr 16 11.19pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Isn't having children selfish, unless you have achieved a stage in life where you can make those sacrifices, where you have tired of the pleasures of youth. Where late nights, and 'good times' have begun to lose their appeal, and where something of greater meaning beckons. At the age of 45, I have now known many people who rushed towards family, marriage, kids long before they were really 'done playing' (as well as some who should never have gone down that path and some who really never lived because they made stupid decisions and lead miserable lives as a result). I think far to many people rush from their youth before they are done with 'playing with life', and in doing so still desire or romanticise the 'toys' they have put aside. This, I think, in turn leads them to regret or even resentment, because they still have 'the animal' within them. Not sure if any of this is relevant to the topic. I would agree that it is unwise to start a family if you are not committed but it seems that some people will never be ready to have kids because they ultimately only love themselves. It is o topic because the idea of indulging in imaginary gender selecting is pandering to that sort of self centered mentality.
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Hrolf The Ganger

21 Apr 16 11.19pm

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Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Isn't having children selfish, unless you have achieved a stage in life where you can make those sacrifices, where you have tired of the pleasures of youth. Where late nights, and 'good times' have begun to lose their appeal, and where something of greater meaning beckons.

At the age of 45, I have now known many people who rushed towards family, marriage, kids long before they were really 'done playing' (as well as some who should never have gone down that path and some who really never lived because they made stupid decisions and lead miserable lives as a result).

I think far to many people rush from their youth before they are done with 'playing with life', and in doing so still desire or romanticise the 'toys' they have put aside. This, I think, in turn leads them to regret or even resentment, because they still have 'the animal' within them.

Not sure if any of this is relevant to the topic.

I would agree that it is unwise to start a family if you are not committed but it seems that some people will never be ready to have kids because they ultimately only love themselves.
It is o topic because the idea of indulging in imaginary gender selecting is pandering to that sort of self centered mentality.

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Hrolf The Ganger 21 Apr 16 11.30pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 I think what I'm trying to get at, with the previous post, is that the only way we can overcome self indulgence and its desires, is to indulge those desires until they grow stale and lose their appeal. I tried to settle down in my late 20s and it went wrong, because I wasn't done with the options of sexuality and wasn't ready to be with just one woman, even though I loved her. By my late 30s, I had burned out those desires to indulge, and wanted something more fulfilling, than just sexual encounters and adventures. This is a personal decision ultimately, however, society is encouraging people to be selfish and not "grow up". It encourages hedonism and self indulgence and frowns upon the family unit. I would argue that real self fulfillment can never truly come from this kind of existence. Some would disagree but I believe that those people are deluding themselves. Clearly those who choose that path would probably would disagree but I do,none the less, believe that all people should have the right to self determination with regard to their lifestyle. Unfortunately, that does not mean they will make wise decisions. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (21 Apr 2016 11.35pm)
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Hrolf The Ganger

21 Apr 16 11.30pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I think what I'm trying to get at, with the previous post, is that the only way we can overcome self indulgence and its desires, is to indulge those desires until they grow stale and lose their appeal.

I tried to settle down in my late 20s and it went wrong, because I wasn't done with the options of sexuality and wasn't ready to be with just one woman, even though I loved her. By my late 30s, I had burned out those desires to indulge, and wanted something more fulfilling, than just sexual encounters and adventures.

This is a personal decision ultimately, however, society is encouraging people to be selfish and not "grow up". It encourages hedonism and self indulgence and frowns upon the family unit.
I would argue that real self fulfillment can never truly come from this kind of existence. Some would disagree but I believe that those people are deluding themselves. Clearly those who choose that path would probably would disagree but I do,none the less, believe that all people should have the right to self determination with regard to their lifestyle. Unfortunately, that does not mean they will make wise decisions.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (21 Apr 2016 11.35pm)

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Bert the Head Epsom 21 Apr 16 11.50pm
Originally posted by matt_himself Schools asking four year olds to choose their gender in, surprise surprise, Br*ghton: [Link] Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ". Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true. ps The Daily Mail has form, for example: The Zinoviev letter Hitler was a good man Everything causes cancer and everything cures it Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates
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Bert the Head

Epsom 21 Apr 16 11.50pm

Originally posted by matt_himself

Schools asking four year olds to choose their gender in, surprise surprise, Br*ghton:

[Link]

Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ".

Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true.

ps The Daily Mail has form, for example:
The Zinoviev letter
Hitler was a good man
Everything causes cancer and everything cures it
Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates

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Jimenez SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 22 Apr 16 12.13am
Originally posted by Bert the Head Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ". Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true. ps The Daily Mail has form, for example: The Zinoviev letter Hitler was a good man Everything causes cancer and everything cures it Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates [Link] Well its also in the local rag as well... Pro USA & Israel
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Jimenez

SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 22 Apr 16 12.13am

Originally posted by Bert the Head

Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true.

ps The Daily Mail has form, for example:
The Zinoviev letter
Hitler was a good man
Everything causes cancer and everything cures it
Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates

[Link]

Well its also in the local rag as well...

Pro USA & Israel

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fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 22 Apr 16 9.59am
The Left seem to have cornered the market in lunacy and bovine stupidity. Not a day goes by without a story of some new and exciting initiative dreamt up by some loon in the grip of advanced mental illness thats designed to punish and incovenience the general public or foist political correctness where it's not welcome. Now they're trying to influence innocent young children into their way of thinking. This initiative should be torn up and the person who dreamt it up should be thrown in jail and placed on a sex offenders register. W@NKERS Edited by fed up eagle (22 Apr 2016 9.59am)
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fed up eagle

Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 22 Apr 16 9.59am

The Left seem to have cornered the market in lunacy and bovine stupidity. Not a day goes by without a story of some new and exciting initiative dreamt up by some loon in the grip of advanced mental illness thats designed to punish and incovenience the general public or foist political correctness where it's not welcome.
Now they're trying to influence innocent young children into their way of thinking. This initiative should be torn up and the person who dreamt it up should be thrown in jail and placed on a sex offenders register.

W@NKERS

Edited by fed up eagle (22 Apr 2016 9.59am)

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Superfly The sun always shines in Catford 22 Apr 16 10.04am
Originally posted by Bert the Head Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ". Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true. ps The Daily Mail has form, for example: The Zinoviev letter Hitler was a good man Everything causes cancer and everything cures it Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates He didn't, Vincent Tabak did. Chris Jefferies was released an given an apology. Or am I missing something? :-S Lend me a Tenor 31 May to 3 June 2017 John McIntosh Arts Centre London Oratory School SW6 1RX with Superfly in the chorus [Link]
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Superfly

The sun always shines in Catford 22 Apr 16 10.04am

Originally posted by Bert the Head

Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true.

ps The Daily Mail has form, for example:
The Zinoviev letter
Hitler was a good man
Everything causes cancer and everything cures it
Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates

He didn't, Vincent Tabak did. Chris Jefferies was released an given an apology. Or am I missing something? :-S

Lend me a Tenor

31 May to 3 June 2017

John McIntosh Arts Centre
London Oratory School
SW6 1RX

with Superfly in the chorus
[Link]

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jamiemartin721 Reading 22 Apr 16 10.05am
Originally posted by matt_himself What I don't believe is that you enjoyed, prior to marriage, a drugs and sexual hedonism ideal.. Edited by matt_himself (22 Apr 2016 5.40am) What you choose to believe is of course your own decision. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 22 Apr 16 10.05am

Originally posted by matt_himself

What I don't believe is that you enjoyed, prior to marriage, a drugs and sexual hedonism ideal..

Edited by matt_himself (22 Apr 2016 5.40am)

What you choose to believe is of course your own decision.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 22 Apr 16 10.18am
Originally posted by Bert the Head Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ". Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true. ps The Daily Mail has form, for example: The Zinoviev letter Hitler was a good man Everything causes cancer and everything cures it Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates And whats wrong with the Daily Mail? I'd read that and the Daily Express over that leftist propaganda sheet The Guardian any day of the week.
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fed up eagle

Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 22 Apr 16 10.18am

Originally posted by Bert the Head

Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true.

ps The Daily Mail has form, for example:
The Zinoviev letter
Hitler was a good man
Everything causes cancer and everything cures it
Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates

And whats wrong with the Daily Mail? I'd read that and the Daily Express over that leftist propaganda sheet The Guardian any day of the week.

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matt_himself Matataland 22 Apr 16 10.25am
Originally posted by Bert the Head Your link is to the Daily Mail, though, so it probably isn't true. Reading that paper and taking everything it says unquestionably as TRUTH suggest you have HGLCS (High Gullibility Low Credibility Syndrome) and you might want to get something for it. I suggest a library card, a wider reading list and a tattoo on your forehead saying "I MUST MAKE THE EFFORT TO QUESTION WHAT I READ". Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true. ps The Daily Mail has form, for example: The Zinoviev letter Hitler was a good man Everything causes cancer and everything cures it Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates Thanks Bert. I had never considered reading articles and making my own mind up about them before. This is an epoch for me. Your wisdom knows no bounds and I will, of course, believe everything you post in future as it is completely unbiased, objective and free of emotion. "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 22 Apr 16 10.25am

Originally posted by Bert the Head

Just because you so so so want it to be true and have this in common with a dodgy/corrupt/useless tabloid content provider doesn't mean it is true.

ps The Daily Mail has form, for example:
The Zinoviev letter
Hitler was a good man
Everything causes cancer and everything cures it
Chris Jefferies didn't kill Joanna Yeates

Thanks Bert. I had never considered reading articles and making my own mind up about them before.

This is an epoch for me. Your wisdom knows no bounds and I will, of course, believe everything you post in future as it is completely unbiased, objective and free of emotion.

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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