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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 28 Sep 17 11.38am
Originally posted by steeleye20 I don't agree with Corbyn on the EU. That's kind of a big policy to disagree on yet claim he's the second coming, wouldn't you say ? "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 28 Sep 17 11.38am

Originally posted by steeleye20

I don't agree with Corbyn on the EU.

That's kind of a big policy to disagree on yet claim he's the second coming, wouldn't you say ?

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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Kermit8 Hevon 28 Sep 17 11.59am
Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all. Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang. The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 28 Sep 17 11.59am

Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all.

Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang.

The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 28 Sep 17 12.00pm
Originally posted by serial thriller Millions would've been made homeless, destitute and impoverished. But had we had a government who had given a conditional bailout, legislating for future profits of the bank to be transferred back to the state, enforced stronger regulation on predatory risky loaning and speculation, we wouldn't now be staring down the barrel of global austerity, another potentially fatal crash and the social divisions, inequality and wage depression we have. Why is it that before 2008, fascist and ultra-nationalist parties across Europe were condemned to the fringes, but now they are leading countries like Hungary, inches from power in France and Greece, and controlling centre-right political discourse in the UK, Germany and elsewhere? I would really like someone on the right to answer that. Maybe not all countries, but high levels of immigration not voted for by individual countries will be a big factor. It's not that people, especially myself, blame immigration for all problems, but they're certainly a factor, and it was the left's fault for dismissing those concerns as racist when they first surfaced. Just because something is raised during bad times, it doesn't mean they're the cause of the bad times. They may have been there throughout. It's like being dismissed for alerting of a potential economic crash during the boom times. Nobody wants to know. Instead it's all great, "I've eliminate boom and bust", the first man to do so in world history, and oversee the most pathetic record in social housing, whilst importing labour from abroadwithout a care of its impact to those affected. As long as the short-term figures look good, it's all great. COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 28 Sep 17 12.00pm

Originally posted by serial thriller

Millions would've been made homeless, destitute and impoverished.

But had we had a government who had given a conditional bailout, legislating for future profits of the bank to be transferred back to the state, enforced stronger regulation on predatory risky loaning and speculation, we wouldn't now be staring down the barrel of global austerity, another potentially fatal crash and the social divisions, inequality and wage depression we have.

Why is it that before 2008, fascist and ultra-nationalist parties across Europe were condemned to the fringes, but now they are leading countries like Hungary, inches from power in France and Greece, and controlling centre-right political discourse in the UK, Germany and elsewhere?

I would really like someone on the right to answer that.

Maybe not all countries, but high levels of immigration not voted for by individual countries will be a big factor. It's not that people, especially myself, blame immigration for all problems, but they're certainly a factor, and it was the left's fault for dismissing those concerns as racist when they first surfaced.

Just because something is raised during bad times, it doesn't mean they're the cause of the bad times. They may have been there throughout. It's like being dismissed for alerting of a potential economic crash during the boom times. Nobody wants to know. Instead it's all great, "I've eliminate boom and bust", the first man to do so in world history, and oversee the most pathetic record in social housing, whilst importing labour from abroadwithout a care of its impact to those affected. As long as the short-term figures look good, it's all great.

COYP

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 28 Sep 17 12.54pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all. Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang. The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige. I see we have progressed from Whiskey to Brasso in the blink of an eye. "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 28 Sep 17 12.54pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all.

Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang.

The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige.

I see we have progressed from Whiskey to Brasso in the blink of an eye.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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hedgehog50 Croydon 28 Sep 17 2.40pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all. Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang. The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige. The main reason people voted to leave the EU was because they wanted to live in a parliamentary democracy where their vote could change their government, instead of in a United States of Europe where their vote would change bugger all. We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]
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hedgehog50

Croydon 28 Sep 17 2.40pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

Sensible centre right and centre left = Pro EU warts 'n' all.

Ideological intransigent frothy types going toward or on the Hard Left/Right = very much Anti-EU, the whole shebang.

The rest probably just voted with whichever school of thought manipulated the best. Well done, Nige.

The main reason people voted to leave the EU was because they wanted to live in a parliamentary democracy where their vote could change their government, instead of in a United States of Europe where their vote would change bugger all.

We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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Lyons550 Shirley 28 Sep 17 3.50pm
Originally posted by serial thriller One thing he said yesterday was that 2017 was the year that politics finally caught up with the 2008 crash. We spent £500 billion bailing out the banks, a political decision which we are still paying for with austerity, with the greatest real wage decline of any major European nation aside from Greece, with drastic cuts to our schools, hospitals and social services. If we have another crash, which is looking increasingly likely, do you think we should spend another £500 billion of taxes on a non-repayable bailout, or should we demand a percentage of that money back from the tax avoiders and start spending it on schools for our kids, hospitals for our parents and social and community services which encourage integration and do something to stop the ethnic divides in our cities? Personally, I think that sort of money will do more to stop the ills of our migrant policy than any amount we spend on stronger borders, counter terrorism or exportation services. You do realise that the money used for lloyds has now been paid back...with interest...dont you? The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World
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Lyons550

Shirley 28 Sep 17 3.50pm

Originally posted by serial thriller

One thing he said yesterday was that 2017 was the year that politics finally caught up with the 2008 crash.

We spent £500 billion bailing out the banks, a political decision which we are still paying for with austerity, with the greatest real wage decline of any major European nation aside from Greece, with drastic cuts to our schools, hospitals and social services.

If we have another crash, which is looking increasingly likely, do you think we should spend another £500 billion of taxes on a non-repayable bailout, or should we demand a percentage of that money back from the tax avoiders and start spending it on schools for our kids, hospitals for our parents and social and community services which encourage integration and do something to stop the ethnic divides in our cities?

Personally, I think that sort of money will do more to stop the ills of our migrant policy than any amount we spend on stronger borders, counter terrorism or exportation services.

You do realise that the money used for lloyds has now been paid back...with interest...dont you?

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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steeleye20 Croydon 28 Sep 17 4.22pm
Originally posted by hedgehog50 The main reason people voted to leave the EU was because they wanted to live in a parliamentary democracy where their vote could change their government, instead of in a United States of Europe where their vote would change bugger all. That's nonsense our elections are entirely free and the choices quite distinct we are a parliamentary democracy for better or worse. The EU does not interfere at all even in the EU referendum nobody from the EU had any say whatsoever. If you vote tory and get years of austerity its still your choice. Your EU blame culture is the problem look out the window at Grenfell that is what the tories have done to the UK nobody else.
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steeleye20

Croydon 28 Sep 17 4.22pm

Originally posted by hedgehog50

That's nonsense our elections are entirely free and the choices quite distinct we are a parliamentary democracy for better or worse.

The EU does not interfere at all even in the EU referendum nobody from the EU had any say whatsoever.

If you vote tory and get years of austerity its still your choice.

Your EU blame culture is the problem look out the window at Grenfell that is what the tories have done to the UK nobody else.

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hedgehog50 Croydon 28 Sep 17 4.57pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 That's nonsense our elections are entirely free and the choices quite distinct we are a parliamentary democracy for better or worse. The EU does not interfere at all even in the EU referendum nobody from the EU had any say whatsoever. If you vote tory and get years of austerity its still your choice. Your EU blame culture is the problem look out the window at Grenfell that is what the tories have done to the UK nobody else. 'For better or worse'? What would you prefer? VAT immediately springs to mind, the UK parliament cannot abolish VAT or even reduce it below 15%. The UK parliament cannot legislate to reduce or stop immigration from EU countries. Also, in general, the case of R v. Secretary of State for Transport ex parte Factortame is considered decisive as to the superiority of EU law over British law. It's absurd of you to pretend that the EU is not aiming to become a United States of Europe with common laws, currency and most other things. Edited by hedgehog50 (28 Sep 2017 5.02pm) We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]
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hedgehog50

Croydon 28 Sep 17 4.57pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

That's nonsense our elections are entirely free and the choices quite distinct we are a parliamentary democracy for better or worse.

The EU does not interfere at all even in the EU referendum nobody from the EU had any say whatsoever.

If you vote tory and get years of austerity its still your choice.

Your EU blame culture is the problem look out the window at Grenfell that is what the tories have done to the UK nobody else.

'For better or worse'? What would you prefer?
VAT immediately springs to mind, the UK parliament cannot abolish VAT or even reduce it below 15%. The UK parliament cannot legislate to reduce or stop immigration from EU countries. Also, in general, the case of R v. Secretary of State for Transport ex parte Factortame is considered decisive as to the superiority of EU law over British law.
It's absurd of you to pretend that the EU is not aiming to become a United States of Europe with common laws, currency and most other things.

Edited by hedgehog50 (28 Sep 2017 5.02pm)

We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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steeleye20 Croydon 28 Sep 17 5.27pm
Originally posted by hedgehog50 'For better or worse'? What would you prefer? VAT immediately springs to mind, the UK parliament cannot abolish VAT or even reduce it below 15%. The UK parliament cannot legislate to reduce or stop immigration from EU countries. Also, in general, the case of R v. Secretary of State for Transport ex parte Factortame is considered decisive as to the superiority of EU law over British law. It's absurd of you to pretend that the EU is not aiming to become a United States of Europe with common laws, currency and most other things. Edited by hedgehog50 (28 Sep 2017 5.02pm) Your pathetic anti-EU babble continues reduced to a petty argument over VAT. The UK will simply tax its citizens in another way it cannot afford to lose tax revenue, there will already be a hike this autumn citizens will pay more as they always do. Thee is no united states of europe never has been and the uk would have vetoed it anyway. Neither is Turkey ever going to be in the EU neither are the EU controlling or interfering in UK elections. As for your 'free' trade deal with the USA they are already imposing huge tariffs against us 222% at Bombardier.
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steeleye20

Croydon 28 Sep 17 5.27pm

Originally posted by hedgehog50

Edited by hedgehog50 (28 Sep 2017 5.02pm)

Your pathetic anti-EU babble continues reduced to a petty argument over VAT.

The UK will simply tax its citizens in another way it cannot afford to lose tax revenue, there will already be a hike this autumn citizens will pay more as they always do.

Thee is no united states of europe never has been and the uk would have vetoed it anyway.

Neither is Turkey ever going to be in the EU neither are the EU controlling or interfering in UK elections.

As for your 'free' trade deal with the USA they are already imposing huge tariffs against us 222% at Bombardier.

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hedgehog50 Croydon 28 Sep 17 5.46pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 Your pathetic anti-EU babble continues reduced to a petty argument over VAT. The UK will simply tax its citizens in another way it cannot afford to lose tax revenue, there will already be a hike this autumn citizens will pay more as they always do. Thee is no united states of europe never has been and the uk would have vetoed it anyway. Neither is Turkey ever going to be in the EU neither are the EU controlling or interfering in UK elections. As for your 'free' trade deal with the USA they are already imposing huge tariffs against us 222% at Bombardier. I was merely pointing out one or two of the many areas in which our parliament is not sovereign, something that you deny. Also to deny the EU's aim is not closer integration on every level moving towards a federal EU state is simply trying to tell us that black is white. We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]
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hedgehog50

Croydon 28 Sep 17 5.46pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Your pathetic anti-EU babble continues reduced to a petty argument over VAT.

The UK will simply tax its citizens in another way it cannot afford to lose tax revenue, there will already be a hike this autumn citizens will pay more as they always do.

Thee is no united states of europe never has been and the uk would have vetoed it anyway.

Neither is Turkey ever going to be in the EU neither are the EU controlling or interfering in UK elections.

As for your 'free' trade deal with the USA they are already imposing huge tariffs against us 222% at Bombardier.

I was merely pointing out one or two of the many areas in which our parliament is not sovereign, something that you deny. Also to deny the EU's aim is not closer integration on every level moving towards a federal EU state is simply trying to tell us that black is white.

We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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pefwin Where you have to have an English ... 28 Sep 17 6.39pm
Originally posted by Lyons550 You do realise that the money used for lloyds has now been paid back...with interest...dont you? II would debate the interest the Government wasted an opportunity to make a packet, bit like Brown and our gold reserves. "Everything is air-droppable at least once." "When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."
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pefwin

Where you have to have an English ... 28 Sep 17 6.39pm

Originally posted by Lyons550

You do realise that the money used for lloyds has now been paid back...with interest...dont you?

II would debate the interest the Government wasted an opportunity to make a packet, bit like Brown and our gold reserves.

"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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pefwin Where you have to have an English ... 28 Sep 17 6.43pm
Originally posted by hedgehog50 The main reason people voted to leave the EU was because they wanted to live in a parliamentary democracy where their vote could change their government, instead of in a United States of Europe where their vote would change bugger all. Talking to random Brexit voters around the country most seemed to have voted on race grounds. As we have seen nobody knew the financial implications etc. Indeed the most frequent comment I have heard from Brexiteers is that it is a shame the vote did not include keeping out denizens of pakistan, India, the Carrabean and non white Africa. Edited by pefwin (28 Sep 2017 6.43pm) "Everything is air-droppable at least once." "When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."
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pefwin

Where you have to have an English ... 28 Sep 17 6.43pm

Originally posted by hedgehog50

Talking to random Brexit voters around the country most seemed to have voted on race grounds. As we have seen nobody knew the financial implications etc.

Indeed the most frequent comment I have heard from Brexiteers is that it is a shame the vote did not include keeping out denizens of pakistan, India, the Carrabean and non white Africa.

Edited by pefwin (28 Sep 2017 6.43pm)

"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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