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April 25 2024 6.03am

FA Adopts Rooney Rule

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 09 Jan 18 2.22pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

The FA has announced that future appointments will be governed by the Rooney rule.

I think this is fine for the FA if they want to go this way but I am against it for Premier League clubs.

In The US the Rooney rule has worked however they do not have relegation. If they sack a coach they can afford to take their time and go through a process as there are no financial implications.

We don't have the luxury of time in the Premier league. Additionally what is the point if you have already decided who you want. I once went to an interview and it was obvious that the candidate before me had the job. As it was council they had to advertise it but it was a farce. I was not annoyed that they knew who they wanted but that they had wasted my time.

Could we see BME candidates constantly on the road going from one interview to another. That doesn't seem fair.

I think the better solution is to identify BME candidates before there is a vacancy. I hope at Palace we have a shortlist of future managers we keep an eye on. Getting a BME candidate on that shortlist should be the goal.

Final point there aren't enough BME candidates with the right qualifications. I believe that Dalian Atkinson was appointed by the FA to try and drum up more interest from players. We have to have a bigger gene pool to select from.

Anyway over to you thoughts?

 


One more point

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View davenotamonkey's Profile davenotamonkey Flag 09 Jan 18 3.21pm Send a Private Message to davenotamonkey Add davenotamonkey as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

The FA has announced that future appointments will be governed by the Rooney rule.

I think this is fine for the FA if they want to go this way but I am against it for Premier League clubs.

In The US the Rooney rule has worked however they do not have relegation. If they sack a coach they can afford to take their time and go through a process as there are no financial implications.

We don't have the luxury of time in the Premier league. Additionally what is the point if you have already decided who you want. I once went to an interview and it was obvious that the candidate before me had the job. As it was council they had to advertise it but it was a farce. I was not annoyed that they knew who they wanted but that they had wasted my time.

Could we see BME candidates constantly on the road going from one interview to another. That doesn't seem fair.

I think the better solution is to identify BME candidates before there is a vacancy. I hope at Palace we have a shortlist of future managers we keep an eye on. Getting a BME candidate on that shortlist should be the goal.

Final point there aren't enough BME candidates with the right qualifications. I believe that Dalian Atkinson was appointed by the FA to try and drum up more interest from players. We have to have a bigger gene pool to select from.

Anyway over to you thoughts?

Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 09 Jan 18 4.29pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by davenotamonkey

Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter.

Of course I should have said that. The presumption was that the BME person has the talent but not the profile.

 


One more point

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 09 Jan 18 4.41pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Ridiculous.

Thr FA logic is that there a lots of Black footballers so we should have more Black coaches.
The amount of Black coach is in line with the population. This is yet another FA exercise in pandering to identity politics.

I hope we all still remember the disgraceful treatment of the women's coach.

 

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View Mr_Gristle's Profile Mr_Gristle Flag In the land of Whelk Eaters 09 Jan 18 4.48pm Send a Private Message to Mr_Gristle Add Mr_Gristle as a friend

Originally posted by davenotamonkey

Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter.

My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview.

 


Well I think Simon's head is large; always involved in espionage. (Name that tune)

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 09 Jan 18 4.50pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Mr_Gristle

My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview.

Certainly Mr Apache but would you mind moving your horse into the car park first.

 


One more point

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View Bangell's Profile Bangell Flag Oxford 09 Jan 18 9.00pm Send a Private Message to Bangell Add Bangell as a friend

Don't see why anyone has a problem with the Rooney Rule. Not a quota system or anti-meritocratic - it just ensures that candidates who might otherwise be overlooked at least get a chance, and the rule's effectiveness in the US has demonstrated that indeed decent candidates had previously been overlooked.

 

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View davenotamonkey's Profile davenotamonkey Flag 09 Jan 18 9.08pm Send a Private Message to davenotamonkey Add davenotamonkey as a friend

Originally posted by Mr_Gristle

My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview.

respect.jpg Attachment: respect.jpg (104.72Kb)

 

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View Username's Profile Username Flag Horsham 10 Jan 18 2.50pm Send a Private Message to Username Add Username as a friend

Originally posted by davenotamonkey

Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter.

No one is forced to hire someone they don't want, they just have to make the effort to interview a BAME candidate.

It doesn't effect anyone already on the shortlist, other than adding more competition.

That BAME candidate who gets on the list then gets the chance at an interview they probably wouldn't get normally. They still have to be qualified, and occasionally they will convince someone to give them a job. On the occasions they don't, they get interview practice and a chance to learn what is required in the future.

 


Employee of the month is a good example of how someone can be both a winner and a loser at the same time.

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 10 Jan 18 5.49pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Bangell

Don't see why anyone has a problem with the Rooney Rule. Not a quota system or anti-meritocratic - it just ensures that candidates who might otherwise be overlooked at least get a chance, and the rule's effectiveness in the US has demonstrated that indeed decent candidates had previously been overlooked.

The problem for me is not the idea but the reasons for implementing it.
Why is 4% of coaches being Black a problem? Less than 4% of the population are Black.
There are very few Asians playing at the top level.

 

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View black eagle.'s Profile black eagle. Flag south croydon. 10 Jan 18 5.56pm Send a Private Message to black eagle. Add black eagle. as a friend

I think it's a great idea.

If a black or asian is guaranteed an interview for the England job that is progress.

I will also say the best person should get any future England job regardless of colour.

 

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View davenotamonkey's Profile davenotamonkey Flag 10 Jan 18 6.26pm Send a Private Message to davenotamonkey Add davenotamonkey as a friend

Originally posted by Username

No one is forced to hire someone they don't want, they just have to make the effort to interview a BAME candidate.

It doesn't effect anyone already on the shortlist, other than adding more competition.

That BAME candidate who gets on the list then gets the chance at an interview they probably wouldn't get normally. They still have to be qualified, and occasionally they will convince someone to give them a job. On the occasions they don't, they get interview practice and a chance to learn what is required in the future.


If no-one is forced to hire someone they don't want, why should they be "forced" (I concede, it's not direct force, but activist pressure) to interview them in the first place?

It does affect people on the shortlist, as:

i) they were there by virtue of merit, not by whatever pigeon-hole identity-politiks has put them in (if indeed you can fit an attack helicopter into a pigeon-hole). This makes a value statement on the candidates, and a two-tier one at that.
ii) the interviewer has to spend more (total) time interviewing, or less per-candidate time if they only have (eg) a limited time for hiring. "Sorry, I've only got 5 minutes with you, as HR told us we had to fit in an extra six Attack Helicopters and a Panda. Tell us why you want the job?"

They should "make the effort" to interview a "BAME" candidate if said candidate has the skills and qualities they sodding well desire in an employee. Businesses should not have to adopt tokenism to sate the bloodlust of Common Purpose and the likes.

I agree implicit bias in candidate selection needs to be monitored: if HR systematically chuck out the CVs of people "sexually-identifying" as an Attack Helicopter, then that's wrong. That's why I support non-identifying job applications with no ethnographic or gender data.

But I stand by my comment: the best candidates should be shortlisted, and the best person should get the job. Otherwise, you'll end up looking utterly hypocritical when you ram an agenda down our throats and serve up this at the same time:

[Link]

 

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