It all sounds really promising. But only a long time can guarantee safety, and I agree that to some it might seem like a better option, but I still don’t see that counting on a vaccine is the right view to have, and why is that? It’s because the media, led by the bbc and panorama especially virtually promised them it would’ve been here last month. So now many have been hooked. And I got pulled in by the 2 becomes 8 becomes 64 bollox on Panorama. That would be true if everyone lived in an air hanger, but it isn’t true, just like the vaccine claims.

And what really is the problem then? Well the whole narrative and hope and prayer got manipulated from nature and common sense of either immunity or the virus passing through the healthy and over the vulnerable because of the fear narrative, media and the reactions beginning with ‘murderer, evil, no compassion’ and all the usual bile, over to counting on a vaccine. Because of that we got the damage to businesses, jobs, livelihoods and no doubt more illnesses and deaths. That’s what’s happened. The western liberal narrative fuelled by the media, especially BBC and Sky, and the people on the inside, decided this path and the economy ends up getting hammered because we’ll furlough everyone and a vaccine will be here and in circulation in September. Sounds great. All under control. That’s how it transpired. Manipulation. Writing this I can see how the Bill Gates vaccine conspirators get thinking this way. It begins to sound logical.

II said we should’ve ended furlough earlier, in summer, when the virus would’ve had a tougher job but possibly done its thing. But oh no, we couldn’t, or wouldn’t, and this is the situation we find ourselves in. These arguments. And why? Because our government are more concerned about what a load of stay at home liberal elites think than what is a coherent strategy. It was even at a time when shielders were still bl00dy shielding. But we end up arguing about shielding for probably longer vs more jobs and more ruin and other stuff. Otherwise the situation in the north wouldn’t be a problem like it’s being reported now. If it affected me I’d be fuming, but it isn’t so I’m not, although I suppose I am angry I’m watching our country fvck it all up for years. More years than ever before. Some of it permanently. I just don’t want to hear moaning from people who lose jobs if they were in favour of the summer break and other things going on and on. And I’ll find out by asking questions they’ll end up contradicting themselves with.

plus why have they never been advising on vitamin D and other healthy foods and some fermented foods that could help over Covid? Why didn’t they build confidence in the mindset the country should strive to make the most of it, including everyone apart from key workers, millions of whom never saw Covid get anywhere near them and went out to work everyday providing for everyone? The fear message was so strong & the promise of a vaccine seemed either so believable or needed so much it was always going to be hoped would solve it all.

COYP

We're going around in circles. As I said to Rudi we can't 'stop work on a vaccine' just because other groups might want access to it at some point. It will clearly be given to those most in need first which is logical and we can't not release something that could save millions of lives worldwide just because you've taken your analogy about Thalidomide and run with it.

This place has totally jumped the shark. You can't mention a mask, a vaccine, anything without some kind of ludicrous hysterical reaction, and at the same time some are convinced that we're going to be 'chipped' and that its some kind of NWO situation and that all drifts by unquestioned.

It's clearly reasonable, following mass stage 3 studies if successful, for certain groups to gain access to a vaccine that could make a real difference to their lives. It this is something that you want to lose your mind over that's fine by me, but I for one are hoping that the trials are a resounding success. Sorry about that.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2020 12.33am)

I don't much care what the media thinks about anything. Stage 3 results for some vaccines will be out by early November. Just to clarify I've not ever said nor do I think that someone vulnerable or elderly should entirely lock themselves away on account that a vaccine isn't out yet. I've said that it's reasonable for them to hope for positive study outcomes (in a month or two) and to gain access to it, shortly after, as it may well make a marked difference to their lives. I've not said anything outlandish or indeed anything that isn't fairly likely to transpire. If stuff like this is cause for endless debate then again its a release valve rather than an argument.

It isn’t just vulnerable groups either. All summer we’ve had people trying to get out of working, especially NEU leading the teachers. It isn’t just people concerned about elderly and vulnerable. They’re concerned about themselves. I wonder when that will end or if the vaccine is their hope or not.

COYP

I didn’t question them, I was quite clear. They aren’t strong. No question

To bully you I would have to intend harm or upset. I don’t. Couldn’t give a monkey’s about you.

And talking of vaccines I can't even get a flu jab despite the government saying there is no shortage.

Now granted I am under 65 and not vulnerable but each year I am happy to pay for mine only this year I have been told by Boots, Superdrug and my local chemist the earliest I can get it is January. Why the shortage the government promised us that this wouldn't happen and yet it is worse this year then ever.

I expect the NHS to have priority but these are private companies why haven't they ordered enough somebody has screwed up.

At this rate I will be lucky to get the Covid vaccine this time next year.

One more point