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roy out

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View southnorwoodhill's Profile southnorwoodhill Flag 12 Jan 21 9.43am Send a Private Message to southnorwoodhill Add southnorwoodhill as a friend

Originally posted by Frickin Saweet

this is what I find utterly depressing, the notion that because we have scraped survival, in diminishing form year-on-year, that we can expect to do the same for another year. It's a car crash waiting to happen. Quite a few fans (and this isn't aimed at you, Willo) seem to be happy to court relegation via sticking to what we know under Hodgson, but not by employing a manager that could breathe new life into the club. Personally I'd rather we gave it another go (trying to move the club on rather than stand still) and be prepared that there is a small chance it could lead to failure and relegation but I'm much more optimistic that it would break the cycle of mundane football we're currently experiencing.

It was a hell of a lot more exciting in the Championship, better football, more star players, and chasing that Premier League dream is so much more exciting that treading water like we are now.

OR, we may just move up to being a solid Prem team that's looking up rather than trying to grind to the minimum points each season.

I'm not suggesting Roy goes mid-season, it's too late for that now. But I pray to God our succession planning is in advanced stage and we have a new guy waiting in the wings as soon as the season finishes. In an ideal world Roy would announce his retirement before the end of the season, we can lock this thread, and start a new one speculating about the new manager.

Edited by Frickin Saweet (12 Jan 2021 9.38am)

Good post. I think the fear of change has got into some posters minds, and they have settled for survival mediocrity under Hodgson.
IMO Parish should have thanked Hodgson for his services at the end of last season and unveiled our new manager then. It didn't happen and so one can speculate whether Parish himself has decided lower table mediocrity is fine, or perhaps the person he has in mind to take over wasn't available at that point, and another season of Hodgson holding the fort was necessary while matters behind the scenes were being sorted.
As I posted previously, we are at the crossroads - many players soon to be out of contract, many on huge salaries that do not reflect their contributions on the pitch. We have reached the stage whereby the side has to be rebuilt, and clearly the future lies in the Academy. The next manager would likely have a good track record of working with youngsters and plotting a course of development for the playing side over the next few years.
I'll be amazed if Hodgson is still here next season and contract extensions have been handed to those who chronically underperform, and /or find competing at the physical level required too difficult. I'd expect relegation if that were the case.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (12 Jan 2021 10.29am)

 

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View TheBigToePunt's Profile TheBigToePunt Flag 12 Jan 21 11.36am Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by sprites

Okay...since you asked.

Guiata
Tomkins
Luka
Eze
Zaha

And ironically probably:

Riederwald
Meyer
PVA (wing back)

Honestly,you think all these would get in any team in the top 10?!

Four of them aren't good enough for ours.

 

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View MARKY's Profile MARKY Flag coulsdon 12 Jan 21 12.20pm Send a Private Message to MARKY Add MARKY as a friend

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

Good post. I think the fear of change has got into some posters minds, and they have settled for survival mediocrity under Hodgson.
IMO Parish should have thanked Hodgson for his services at the end of last season and unveiled our new manager then. It didn't happen and so one can speculate whether Parish himself has decided lower table mediocrity is fine, or perhaps the person he has in mind to take over wasn't available at that point, and another season of Hodgson holding the fort was necessary while matters behind the scenes were being sorted.
As I posted previously, we are at the crossroads - many players soon to be out of contract, many on huge salaries that do not reflect their contributions on the pitch. We have reached the stage whereby the side has to be rebuilt, and clearly the future lies in the Academy. The next manager would likely have a good track record of working with youngsters and plotting a course of development for the playing side over the next few years.
I'll be amazed if Hodgson is still here next season and contract extensions have been handed to those who chronically underperform, and /or find competing at the physical level required too difficult. I'd expect relegation if that were the case.

mediocrity! we have beaten Southampton, Man Utd, Fulham, West Brom and Sheff Utd, Man Utd and Leeds was some of the best footie we have played in the premier league, we have an antiquated stadium, our training facilities are well behind most premier league clubs. SP and Roy have done a great job keeping us in the big league. I think some realism is needed a few on here would be better supporting the Harlem Globe Trotters

Edited by southnorwoodhill (12 Jan 2021 10.29am)

 

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View NEILLO's Profile NEILLO Flag Shoreham-by-Sea 12 Jan 21 12.40pm Send a Private Message to NEILLO Add NEILLO as a friend

Originally posted by Frickin Saweet

this is what I find utterly depressing, the notion that because we have scraped survival, in diminishing form year-on-year, that we can expect to do the same for another year. It's a car crash waiting to happen. Quite a few fans (and this isn't aimed at you, Willo) seem to be happy to court relegation via sticking to what we know under Hodgson, but not by employing a manager that could breathe new life into the club. Personally I'd rather we gave it another go (trying to move the club on rather than stand still) and be prepared that there is a small chance it could lead to failure and relegation but I'm much more optimistic that it would break the cycle of mundane football we're currently experiencing.

It was a hell of a lot more exciting in the Championship, better football, more star players, and chasing that Premier League dream is so much more exciting that treading water like we are now.

OR, we may just move up to being a solid Prem team that's looking up rather than trying to grind to the minimum points each season.

I'm not suggesting Roy goes mid-season, it's too late for that now. But I pray to God our succession planning is in advanced stage and we have a new guy waiting in the wings as soon as the season finishes. In an ideal world Roy would announce his retirement before the end of the season, we can lock this thread, and start a new one speculating about the new manager.

Edited by Frickin Saweet (12 Jan 2021 9.38am)

I'm not sure that's entirely the case. My perception is that like myself ( and Willo I think too ), we acknowledge Roy's shortcomings while understanding the reluctance of Steve Parish to change if the objective is to stay in the Premier League. As a club we currently lack ambition.

And that's principally why I defend Hodgson. Would I like to see more entertaining football ? - of course I would. Do I want to see the club stay in the Premier League ? - definitely. Currently the ' cost ' of retaining our Premier League status is the pragmatic and largely unexciting brand of football that Roy provides. You can't blame him for employing the tactics that result in his best chance of achieving his objective.

Once the promised land of the Premier League is reached, without major financial investment ( which in itself is not a guarantee of success ), it's an annual struggle to stay there.

The alternative ( which you don't appear to object to ) is of course relegation. I think that would set the club back immeasurably. With no guarantee that we would be '' chasing the dream ''

 


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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 12 Jan 21 12.56pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by NEILLO

I'm not sure that's entirely the case. My perception is that like myself ( and Willo I think too ), we acknowledge Roy's shortcomings while understanding the reluctance of Steve Parish to change if the objective is to stay in the Premier League. As a club we currently lack ambition.

And that's principally why I defend Hodgson. Would I like to see more entertaining football ? - of course I would. Do I want to see the club stay in the Premier League ? - definitely. Currently the ' cost ' of retaining our Premier League status is the pragmatic and largely unexciting brand of football that Roy provides. You can't blame him for employing the tactics that result in his best chance of achieving his objective.

Once the promised land of the Premier League is reached, without major financial investment ( which in itself is not a guarantee of success ), it's an annual struggle to stay there.

The alternative ( which you don't appear to object to ) is of course relegation. I think that would set the club back immeasurably. With no guarantee that we would be '' chasing the dream ''

May I congratulate you on an excellent post, awash with sagacity and realism.
On perusing your words of wisdom I found myself nodding like a toy dog in the back of a car, with a grin of rapt adoration around my 'Chops'.
Well done Sir - I doff my hat.

 

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View TheBigToePunt's Profile TheBigToePunt Flag 12 Jan 21 1.10pm Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by NEILLO

I'm not sure that's entirely the case. My perception is that like myself ( and Willo I think too ), we acknowledge Roy's shortcomings while understanding the reluctance of Steve Parish to change if the objective is to stay in the Premier League. As a club we currently lack ambition.

And that's principally why I defend Hodgson. Would I like to see more entertaining football ? - of course I would. Do I want to see the club stay in the Premier League ? - definitely. Currently the ' cost ' of retaining our Premier League status is the pragmatic and largely unexciting brand of football that Roy provides. You can't blame him for employing the tactics that result in his best chance of achieving his objective.

Once the promised land of the Premier League is reached, without major financial investment ( which in itself is not a guarantee of success ), it's an annual struggle to stay there.

The alternative ( which you don't appear to object to ) is of course relegation. I think that would set the club back immeasurably. With no guarantee that we would be '' chasing the dream ''

This is spot on. My only observation is that I don't think Palace lack ambition as such. We just can't spend any more than we do because of FFP. We are at the glass ceiling, and the team is roughly as good as it can be (in terms of results certainly) until the club itself gets bigger and better, which Parish is trying to do.

 

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 12 Jan 21 1.17pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

This is spot on. My only observation is that I don't think Palace lack ambition as such. We just can't spend any more than we do because of FFP. We are at the glass ceiling, and the team is roughly as good as it can be (in terms of results certainly) until the club itself gets bigger and better, which Parish is trying to do.

Another excellent post.
We are birds on the same twig on this matter.
Tips hat.

 

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View doombear's Profile doombear Flag Too far from Selhurst Park 12 Jan 21 2.26pm Send a Private Message to doombear Add doombear as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Another excellent post.
We are birds on the same twig on this matter.
Tips hat.


Perhaps you and the recent posters should post on the 'Roy IN' thread.

Seriously, we need to distinguish between ambition and reality. I think SP is still a fan and therefore have no doubt that, like the rest of us fans, he wants to see Palace develop, grow bigger and be successful in the PL. Perhaps some of us more mature fans are afraid that this might not be achieved in our lifetime (or during the remaining years we are fit enough to attend games) and want to see a transformation today or next season.

The reality has already been stated in various posts, namely,
- we have limited funds to spend so struggle to compete with the bigger and or wealthier clubs.
- we have major shareholders who seem to be reluctant to shell out more than the minimum to keep us afloat in the PL.
- we have one of the worst (and smallest) grounds in the PL (and one that is worse than a number of grounds of Championship and even League 1 clubs (League 1 Ipswich have a nice ground, for example).
- our board has shown some intent by developing the Academy and gaining a status upgrade but the fruit of that will not be seen in the first team squad for a couple of years or so.
- the purchase of Eze and Ferguson are concrete evidence of a desire to freshen up the squad as well as bring in younger players for the longer term.

We are making progress, albeit slowly BUT we are vying with other clubs who are also making progress, many of whom have advantages over us.

It is my honest opinion that it is vital that the club remain in the PL and yes even if it means turgid football most weeks. As a ST holder whose return journey to home games is around 7 hours, I'm prepared to grin and bear it because I love our club and believe things will improve (with or without Roy Hodgson).

Edited by doombear (12 Jan 2021 2.29pm)

 

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View TheBigToePunt's Profile TheBigToePunt Flag 12 Jan 21 2.31pm Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by doombear

It is my honest opinion that it is vital that the club remain in the PL and yes even if it means turgid football most weeks. As a ST holder whose return journey to home games is around 7 hours, I'm prepared to grin and bear it because I love our club and believe things will improve (with or without Roy Hodgson).

Edited by doombear (12 Jan 2021 2.29pm)

Blimey, fair play to you.

It used to take me about the same sort of time to get home after games. I mean, I only lived in West Croydon, but there were so many pubs between the ground and my house...

 

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 12 Jan 21 2.46pm Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by doombear


Perhaps you and the recent posters should post on the 'Roy IN' thread.

Seriously, we need to distinguish between ambition and reality. I think SP is still a fan and therefore have no doubt that, like the rest of us fans, he wants to see Palace develop, grow bigger and be successful in the PL. Perhaps some of us more mature fans are afraid that this might not be achieved in our lifetime (or during the remaining years we are fit enough to attend games) and want to see a transformation today or next season.

The reality has already been stated in various posts, namely,
- we have limited funds to spend so struggle to compete with the bigger and or wealthier clubs.
- we have major shareholders who seem to be reluctant to shell out more than the minimum to keep us afloat in the PL.
- we have one of the worst (and smallest) grounds in the PL (and one that is worse than a number of grounds of Championship and even League 1 clubs (League 1 Ipswich have a nice ground, for example).
- our board has shown some intent by developing the Academy and gaining a status upgrade but the fruit of that will not be seen in the first team squad for a couple of years or so.
- the purchase of Eze and Ferguson are concrete evidence of a desire to freshen up the squad as well as bring in younger players for the longer term.

We are making progress, albeit slowly BUT we are vying with other clubs who are also making progress, many of whom have advantages over us.

It is my honest opinion that it is vital that the club remain in the PL and yes even if it means turgid football most weeks. As a ST holder whose return journey to home games is around 7 hours, I'm prepared to grin and bear it because I love our club and believe things will improve (with or without Roy Hodgson).

Edited by doombear (12 Jan 2021 2.29pm)

I actually agree with the general thrust of your comments.

I have perused the plethora of Roy In/Out sentiments.I appreciate the 'Bigger picture' and the constraints involved and I have not waged any campaign calling for the removal of our experienced and well-respected manager.

Of course I have been critical of some torrid performances and our style of play and often been incandescent with rage but as I have asserted numerous times we have a 'Dad's Army' squad with many in the twilight of their careers and alas past their best.
Mr Hodgson,despite an ageing squad and insignificant backing in the transfer market has ensured our survival for 3 seasons and there is every chance this could be extended to a 4th season.
The football has been far from entertaining but the end has justified the means.

 

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 12 Jan 21 3.03pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

My only observation is that I don't think Palace lack ambition as such. We just can't spend any more than we do because of FFP.

FFP the financial constraint that only seems to affect us.

On a more serious note I don't think that we have a problem with FFP at the moment anyway

 

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View TheBigToePunt's Profile TheBigToePunt Flag 12 Jan 21 4.01pm Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

FFP the financial constraint that only seems to affect us.

On a more serious note I don't think that we have a problem with FFP at the moment anyway

Not at the moment, no. But we certainly were in choppy waters.

Whilst it's incredibly hard to establish where Palace (or anyone) are with FFP, the last published financial report contained this from Parish:

'During the current financial year 2019/20 we had used the proceeds of the Aaron Wan-Bissaka sale to comply with FFP and pay down our bank debt leaving only some relatively small deferred transfer payments outstanding....

....Aside from the necessary sale of Aaron Wan-Bissaka, key players were retained and prudent and opportune acquisitions were made, bolstering the squad at relatively low cost, whilst removing the danger of breaching Financial Fair Play Regulations. External debt was repaid, putting the Club in a good position to invest for the future'.

There is also talk of the owners having provided a further 25m in long term loans last year, suggesting the club could not sustain even our relatively meagre spending without being propped up.

One way or another, we reached, then went beyond, the limit of what we can spend in the last few years.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (12 Jan 2021 4.02pm)

 

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