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October 2 2022 4.40pm

Possible Jail-time for refusing he/she/theyPronoun

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Glazier#1's Profile Glazier#1 Flag 02 Sep 22 8.43pm Send a Private Message to Glazier#1 Add Glazier#1 as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

Doesn’t the apostrophe replace an i ? Or in this particular case a singular student could actually be plural students. As in more than one has wishes. !

Edited by cryrst (02 Sep 2022 8.30pm)

Edited by cryrst (02 Sep 2022 8.31pm)

No. The 'wishes' in question are those of one student, in this case.

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Online Flag The garden of England 02 Sep 22 8.50pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Glazier#1

No. The 'wishes' in question are those of one student, in this case.

Yes in this case but it could be for plural if it were two or more.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Glazier#1's Profile Glazier#1 Flag 02 Sep 22 9.15pm Send a Private Message to Glazier#1 Add Glazier#1 as a friend

Originally posted by Nicholas91

Just for fun, I have a few questions:

1. If any of these students were to join the tragically high proportion of those who transition only to take their own lives, would you feel at all culpable? God forbid suffice to say.

2. As an educator, do you believe in the incorrect usage of language tailored solely for the wishes of a person’s subjective opinions on what they believe they are with no scientific backing whatsoever and actually running contradictory to biological science and application of language? Furthermore do you think it correct that people are told what language they ‘must’ use based on the wishes of others?

3. This ones just for me. I have always felt far superior to most others, I believe this stems from my growing up around predominantly Millwall fans. If I were a student, and demanded to be referred to as ‘His Royal highness’ or addressed as ‘Your Royal Highness’ would you oblige? I believe my claim to royalty is as valid as John’s to be referred to as She/her.

I realise this might seem very aggressive questioning but I am interested and have not ruled out my own ignorance as being a factor in my inability to process this scenario.

Wow, what a plateful!

1) I witness many students who are at a time in their life when questions of their sexuality can cause much pain and confusion. I have many that tell me of their sexuality, whatever it is, and I respect whatever it is, no matter what. It may happen that how they feel about that may change at any time or not. That is for them. It is not for me to dictate anything to them but to let them know that I am supportive of their wishes and their freedom to have them, regardless. As for 'culpable', well the answer is no. I respect their wishes but I have no right to take responsibility for their actions, providing they are not harming anybody else. They are young adults and have the right to choose.

It's so difficult to put these things into words but I've tried my hardest here.

2) I have witnessed such pain over these matters that I believe being supportive of their wishes is the least I can do. Many have been met with such aggression over these matters from others, often from those closest to them. They can be in great inner pain and turmoil.

As for the biological rights and wrongs, I am no scientist and am afraid I am not able to answer about 'scientific backing'. Sorry.

Where I work I see that many of my colleagues sign off their emails according to how they'd like to be addressed - He, Him His, for example and that's fine with me. I don't do that myself and there is no 'dictat' from above that we are obliged to.

3) You may believe that your claim to be called 'Your Royal Highness' is genuine but it would be considered to be bogus in law unless you can provide proof of your ancestry and right to the throne. That will be a matter of fact, I believe.

4) Any Millwall supporter may well be referred to as 'serf' by any Crystal Palace fan worth their salt. Lol

To be serious, though, I work with young people and many of the stories I hear would make you shudder. I'm not perfect, far from it but I do my best to be as supportive as possible to them. I remember being a teenager myself and as well having some of the best times of my life, I remember it being accompanied by periods of great pain, too.

I realise that these answers are by no means complete but I've tried my best to be honest.

We could fill a book discussing it, couldn't we?

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View Glazier#1's Profile Glazier#1 Flag 02 Sep 22 9.19pm Send a Private Message to Glazier#1 Add Glazier#1 as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

Yes in this case but it could be for plural if it were two or more.

Yes. If were talking about the wishes of more than one student, we would write: 'The students' wishes'.

Is that what you mean?

 

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View Nicholas91's Profile Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 02 Sep 22 9.45pm Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by Glazier#1

Wow, what a plateful!

1) I witness many students who are at a time in their life when questions of their sexuality can cause much pain and confusion. I have many that tell me of their sexuality, whatever it is, and I respect whatever it is, no matter what. It may happen that how they feel about that may change at any time or not. That is for them. It is not for me to dictate anything to them but to let them know that I am supportive of their wishes and their freedom to have them, regardless. As for 'culpable', well the answer is no. I respect their wishes but I have no right to take responsibility for their actions, providing they are not harming anybody else. They are young adults and have the right to choose.

It's so difficult to put these things into words but I've tried my hardest here.

2) I have witnessed such pain over these matters that I believe being supportive of their wishes is the least I can do. Many have been met with such aggression over these matters from others, often from those closest to them. They can be in great inner pain and turmoil.

As for the biological rights and wrongs, I am no scientist and am afraid I am not able to answer about 'scientific backing'. Sorry.

Where I work I see that many of my colleagues sign off their emails according to how they'd like to be addressed - He, Him His, for example and that's fine with me. I don't do that myself and there is no 'dictat' from above that we are obliged to.

3) You may believe that your claim to be called 'Your Royal Highness' is genuine but it would be considered to be bogus in law unless you can provide proof of your ancestry and right to the throne. That will be a matter of fact, I believe.

4) Any Millwall supporter may well be referred to as 'serf' by any Crystal Palace fan worth their salt. Lol

To be serious, though, I work with young people and many of the stories I hear would make you shudder. I'm not perfect, far from it but I do my best to be as supportive as possible to them. I remember being a teenager myself and as well having some of the best times of my life, I remember it being accompanied by periods of great pain, too.

I realise that these answers are by no means complete but I've tried my best to be honest.

We could fill a book discussing it, couldn't we?

OK cool. Specifically regarding the first point however I was not addressing sexuality, as long as it's between consenting adults or not in breach of any law or actually even of harm to anyone, each to their own as far as I am concerned. I was more concerned with what people are now allowed to 'identify' as.

I do share very similar sentiments firstly. If somebody wishes to be known as, or live their lives as x, I am very willing to accept that as it is of no concern to me and if it is of benefit to them I see no reason why I should feel threatened by that or indeed have any say in the matter. What I do dispute however is that somehow I should legally be forced to be complicit in what is essentially, at the end of all days, a lie. To be more accurate I'll provide an example (I have done so on another thread):

If John wants to be called 'Joanna', has modern technology provide him with everything to present aesthetically as a female, and perhaps some not quite perfect or perhaps even close medication, then fine. If that really makes John/Joanna happy I'm not too bothered. What I reject however is colluding in the delusion that despite all scientific fact there has been some sort of mistake, John actually is Joanna and to not acknowledge this is actually a criminal offence. This application of law is not only nonsensical but also a severe infringement on the freedom of people.

My second concern is that if John is actually suffering in some way that has manifested as a belief that his pain stems from his gender, which he can now change, and society allows and encourages him to do so, he goes both untreated for the aforementioned suffering and in an even more bamboozling paradigm finally takes his own or even others lives, then that would then render any party involved as 'culpable'. That seems to be the case with many.

Again, I am not saying I am correct in this thinking nor have I conducted any sincere research or thought, but I have yet to be presented with anything that alters this opinion.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 02 Sep 22 10.36pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

If a person wishes to change their gender, can they also change their race?

So, for example, could I insist on being considered as non-white? We hear of white people being accused of cultural appropriation all the time but if I consider myself to be black, why should I not be able to have my hair in dreadlocks?

Lets say I wanted to go to the US, and insisted on being treated as a Native American, because that is how I identify, on what grounds could that be denied to me?

Can I only be defined, racially, based on the pigmentation of my skin?

 


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Flag 02 Sep 22 10.41pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Matov

If a person wishes to change their gender, can they also change their race?

So, for example, could I insist on being considered as non-white? We hear of white people being accused of cultural appropriation all the time but if I consider myself to be black, why should I not be able to have my hair in dreadlocks?

Lets say I wanted to go to the US, and insisted on being treated as a Native American, because that is how I identify, on what grounds could that be denied to me?

Can I only be defined, racially, based on the pigmentation of my skin?

Better to self-identity as a billionaire. Spend £100m then argue the ethics with the bank manager.

 

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 02 Sep 22 11.11pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Better to self-identity as a billionaire. Spend £100m then argue the ethics with the bank manager.

And why not?

Also what if I want to self-identify as having a mental illness that means I cannot go to work? Or can a Government decide if I am ill or not?

Self-identification is an utter fallacy. Society collapses if you take it to any kind of logical conclusion.

Gender is fixed.
Race is fixed.

Trans anything are not what they proclaim themselves to be, no matter how much they want to play pretend in that alternative role. They can have every bit of cosmetic surgery they want, gulp down hormone blockers like water, wear whatever clothing they like and it makes not a single iota of difference to who they are.

This is all f***ing lunacy. And for what? What does society gain out of any of this? It makes a mockery of so, so much. Where is any of the upside on this?

 


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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View YT's Profile YT Flag Oxford 03 Sep 22 7.30am Send a Private Message to YT Add YT as a friend

Originally posted by Matov

And why not?

Also what if I want to self-identify as having a mental illness that means I cannot go to work? Or can a Government decide if I am ill or not?

Self-identification is an utter fallacy. Society collapses if you take it to any kind of logical conclusion.

Gender is fixed.
Race is fixed.

Trans anything are not what they proclaim themselves to be, no matter how much they want to play pretend in that alternative role. They can have every bit of cosmetic surgery they want, gulp down hormone blockers like water, wear whatever clothing they like and it makes not a single iota of difference to who they are.

This is all f***ing lunacy. And for what? What does society gain out of any of this? It makes a mockery of so, so much. Where is any of the upside on this?

Well I suppose it gives people of a certain ilk something else to worry about other than the climate and the cost of living.

 


Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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View dannyboy1978's Profile dannyboy1978 Flag 03 Sep 22 7.53am Send a Private Message to dannyboy1978 Add dannyboy1978 as a friend

This sums it all up for me.

IMG-20220902-WA0004.jpg Attachment: IMG-20220902-WA0004.jpg (85.69Kb)

 

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View YT's Profile YT Flag Oxford 03 Sep 22 8.28am Send a Private Message to YT Add YT as a friend

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

there is a nasty standoff going on here. The forces of the radical SocLib Left versus a stubborn stalwart of traditional Conservatism.

A career and a reputation in tatters. An institution tainted by a messy ideological battle in the Culture War.

who will win ? will he ? or she ? or they ? or it ?

[Link]
.
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Edited by PalazioVecchio (02 Sep 2022 4.50pm)

Is that another term for: "normal people with at least an ounce of common sense"? (Or "gram", for those offended by "ounce').

 


Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 03 Sep 22 9.03am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

I don't care what peoples preferences. If I greet someone I don't say "Hello lesbian". So even if you don't agree with people's lifestyle choices you wouldn't necessarily know what they are if you are chatting to the checkout girl about last nights soap.

If that person chooses to impart the information then that is another discussion entirely.

The problem with this pronoun stuff is that these people are imposing on you their preferences whether you like it or not and that I do have a problem with.

 


One more point

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