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April 1 2023 2.39am

Crystal Palace vs Chelsea - Match Thread

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View You What's Profile You What Flag se25 05 Oct 22 6.45am Send a Private Message to You What Add You What as a friend

Originally posted by kennybrowns leftfoot

Don't shoot me down here but as a qualified referee I'll give my take on the Silva incident.

Now clearly it was an obvious handball and it was what is known as a DOGSO (Denying a goal or an Obvious Goal Scoring Opportunity)

When you get taught about this on your course you're told to take into account the Distance to the goal, the Direction the attacker is travelling and the distance of the defenders.

I'll admit this one was a tough one but taking my Palace glasses off and putting my referee glasses on Ayew was to the left hand side of the pitch. His direction of travel was to the left and not towards the goal. His distance from goal was still about 35 yards and there was another defender, apart from Silva level with him or just behind him when the foul occurred.

I think taking all that into consideration I can see why a yellow was given and not a red.

However it was a tight one I'll admit. I hope this explains things a little bit for everyone.

Edited by kennybrowns leftfoot (04 Oct 2022 11.48pm)

How about the fact that he handled it twice deliberately?

 

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Flag 05 Oct 22 6.56am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

I must admit that here we are on Wed morning, some of the dust has settled & I still firmly believe that as he was falling he knew 100% exactly what he was doing in reaching out for the ball to deflect it away from Ayew clear in the knowledge that Chelsea were already a goal down, Ayew would be through on goal & even though there was another defender on the other side of the box (Chillwell I think) Palace could also have poured supporting players forward & he didn't want to risk going into half time 2 down -

Players at that level think fast & react fast, in my mind he knew the defence had been compromised, he blatantly cheated & hoped that if he played on trying to convince people that he grabbed at the ball as though he had been fouled & remonstrated with the ref enough he hoped that he wouldn't get penalised too severely - which is exactly what happened

 

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View southnorwoodhill's Profile southnorwoodhill Flag 05 Oct 22 7.27am Send a Private Message to southnorwoodhill Add southnorwoodhill as a friend

Had another look at the handball reply and Ayew had Edouard in close support and Olise (unmarked) racing through the centre. A shocking, cynical decision by the referee to award only a yellow card.

 

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View MrRobbo's Profile MrRobbo Flag Purley 05 Oct 22 8.30am Send a Private Message to MrRobbo Add MrRobbo as a friend

Its the sort of decision that because it was 30/40 yards out the refs can hide behind the was it an 'obvious goalscoring opportunity' question. You can debate that until the cows come home.

What is clear and obvious is that he purposely cheated. Not sending him off makes it 'ok'. And its not.

 

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View gloryhunter's Profile gloryhunter Flag EDINBURGH 05 Oct 22 9.05am Send a Private Message to gloryhunter Add gloryhunter as a friend

Originally posted by You What

How about the fact that he handled it twice deliberately?

That, for me, should have been the clincher.

 


gloryhunter (eagle in exile)

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View Spiderman's Profile Spiderman Flag Horsham 05 Oct 22 9.59am Send a Private Message to Spiderman Add Spiderman as a friend

Originally posted by kennybrowns leftfoot

Don't shoot me down here but as a qualified referee I'll give my take on the Silva incident.

Now clearly it was an obvious handball and it was what is known as a DOGSO (Denying a goal or an Obvious Goal Scoring Opportunity)

When you get taught about this on your course you're told to take into account the Distance to the goal, the Direction the attacker is travelling and the distance of the defenders.

I'll admit this one was a tough one but taking my Palace glasses off and putting my referee glasses on Ayew was to the left hand side of the pitch. His direction of travel was to the left and not towards the goal. His distance from goal was still about 35 yards and there was another defender, apart from Silva level with him or just behind him when the foul occurred.

I think taking all that into consideration I can see why a yellow was given and not a red.

However it was a tight one I'll admit. I hope this explains things a little bit for everyone.

Edited by kennybrowns leftfoot (04 Oct 2022 11.48pm)

Thanks Kenny
My take on direction that Ayew was running, he was changing direction towards goal, as he was going round Silva. Players have previously been sent off when nearer the halfway line. Perhaps FIFA stats are taken into account

 

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View West Stand's Profile West Stand Flag Dorchester 05 Oct 22 1.30pm Send a Private Message to West Stand Add West Stand as a friend

Originally posted by sprites

But surely the cynical nature of it HAS to come into it. Or some common sense. Or something. It was filthy. It seems so cruel that a complete accidental handball on a shot that may've been on target would be penalised with a red...but that from Silva gets a yellow.

The word deliberate in Law 12 has long since been removed . The trouble always has been trying to get into the mind of the offender.
Itís cynical when someone pulls some one shirt , cynical when someone blocks a opposing player.
Silva handled the ball some would say he was being professional and yes he received a yellow but the simple question the ref had to ask was it an obvious goal scoring opportunity and that as always is a subjective call on the part of the ref.

 

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View CharlesPaterson's Profile CharlesPaterson Flag 05 Oct 22 4.42pm Send a Private Message to CharlesPaterson Add CharlesPaterson as a friend

Originally posted by kennybrowns leftfoot

Don't shoot me down here but as a qualified referee I'll give my take on the Silva incident.

Now clearly it was an obvious handball and it was what is known as a DOGSO (Denying a goal or an Obvious Goal Scoring Opportunity)

When you get taught about this on your course you're told to take into account the Distance to the goal, the Direction the attacker is travelling and the distance of the defenders.

I'll admit this one was a tough one but taking my Palace glasses off and putting my referee glasses on Ayew was to the left hand side of the pitch. His direction of travel was to the left and not towards the goal. His distance from goal was still about 35 yards and there was another defender, apart from Silva level with him or just behind him when the foul occurred.

I think taking all that into consideration I can see why a yellow was given and not a red.

However it was a tight one I'll admit. I hope this explains things a little bit for everyone.

Edited by kennybrowns leftfoot (04 Oct 2022 11.48pm)


I'm also a qualified ref (semi retired) and saw this as a clear goalscoring opportunity.

The player handled the ball and prevented Ayew from his run towards the goal with NO players within 10 yards. The real problem here is that the VAR panel also saw it only as a yellow. On a Sunday morning over Purley Way you would get half the refs giving it and half not, the bias for the top 6 is clear to see.

 

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View palace_in_frogland's Profile palace_in_frogland Flag In a broken dream 05 Oct 22 4.52pm Send a Private Message to palace_in_frogland Add palace_in_frogland as a friend

Originally posted by You What

How about the fact that he handled it twice deliberately?

Exactly. Forget the goal scoring opportunity argument for a second, it just clouds the issue.

Handball 1 - yellow card.
Handball 2 - yellow card.
Result - red card.
Simples.

 

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View kennybrowns leftfoot's Profile kennybrowns leftfoot Flag Reigate 05 Oct 22 4.53pm Send a Private Message to kennybrowns leftfoot Add kennybrowns leftfoot as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

Hi Kenny -
Thanks for the below - Just a question, with your ref glasses on - if the attacker had been Wilf instead of Jordan & fresh in your mind recent goals from very similar positions & situations against Liverpool & Villa would that have altered your assessment of the situation ?

Probably not to be honest. As much as some players are better finishers than others that shouldn't be taken into account.

The frustrating thing is, is if it had been even 10/15 yards further forward it would of been a definite red in my opinion.
The key part of it is it has to be an OBVIOUS Goal Scoring opportunity.. The word obvious, as someone else has mentioned can be interpreted in different ways.

In my opinion I wouldn't class Ayews chance as an obvious goal scoring opportunity but that's just my opinion. On the other hand it doesn't seem fair that such a cynical act only gets a yellow. Its a bit like when Chielini (prob spelt wrong) pulled Rashfords shirt by the neck in the Euro Final on the half way line to stop him.. It was so cynical that a yellow didn't seem enough.

 


Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

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View southnorwoodhill's Profile southnorwoodhill Flag 05 Oct 22 5.02pm Send a Private Message to southnorwoodhill Add southnorwoodhill as a friend

Originally posted by MrRobbo

Its the sort of decision that because it was 30/40 yards out the refs can hide behind the was it an 'obvious goalscoring opportunity' question. You can debate that until the cows come home.

What is clear and obvious is that he purposely cheated. Not sending him off makes it 'ok'. And its not.

He didn't cheat. The up to date euphemism is "clever". Clever now means cheated, but in a clever way. Showed intelligence to fool the referee. Clever.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (05 Oct 2022 5.16pm)

 

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View MrRobbo's Profile MrRobbo Flag Purley 05 Oct 22 7.46pm Send a Private Message to MrRobbo Add MrRobbo as a friend

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

He didn't cheat. The up to date euphemism is "clever". Clever now means cheated, but in a clever way. Showed intelligence to fool the referee. Clever.

Edited by southnorwoodhill (05 Oct 2022 5.16pm)

Of course from Chelsea's side it was a smart move. Just a shame that the refs hide behind their rule book, rather than making an example and eradicating the clear and obvious cheating.

But maybe that's what Palace are missing a bit of at the min. Some old fashioned 'street smarts'. The foul that prevents the break, the timewasting, the shirt tugs that go unnoticed.

The things that he big teams do well and get away with it, and in tight games can be the difference between 1 and 3 points

 

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