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December 6 2022 11.48pm

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 10 Nov 22 7.32pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

So nurses want a 17% rise
Civil servants want a 10% rise with no change to Ts and Cs and no redundancy changes.
Both have basically been told to foxtrot Oscar.
This seems so political it’s beyond a joke.
Yes I’m sure they all do a great job but really taking the piss now.
So inflation is high but will they take a drop in pay when inflation goes down; and it will. Do they think they are the only ones getting an offered pay rise below inflation.
The private sector is 10-1 of employees in the uk. They won’t get close to the perks of pension, silly sick pay and HR off the scale.
Get a grip and realise it ain’t happening and so it shouldn’t.
Yes a nurse will help me and so will the council but ffs we’ve done 400 billion on covid and giving billions in fuel aid to everyone and extra benefits to plus 7 millionin in the uk alone and god knows how much to the worlds ponces for this climate bollox.
Give labour and the unions a go asap as they seem to be shouting the loudest and when they get in they will see the account is empty and they’re fecked.

 

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 10 Nov 22 8.13pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

So nurses want a 17% rise
Civil servants want a 10% rise with no change to Ts and Cs and no redundancy changes.
Both have basically been told to foxtrot Oscar.
This seems so political it’s beyond a joke.
Yes I’m sure they all do a great job but really taking the piss now.
So inflation is high but will they take a drop in pay when inflation goes down; and it will. Do they think they are the only ones getting an offered pay rise below inflation.
The private sector is 10-1 of employees in the uk. They won’t get close to the perks of pension, silly sick pay and HR off the scale.
Get a grip and realise it ain’t happening and so it shouldn’t.
Yes a nurse will help me and so will the council but ffs we’ve done 400 billion on covid and giving billions in fuel aid to everyone and extra benefits to plus 7 millionin in the uk alone and god knows how much to the worlds ponces for this climate bollox.
Give labour and the unions a go asap as they seem to be shouting the loudest and when they get in they will see the account is empty and they’re fecked.

Problem here is nurses have been undervalued, under supported and underpaid for years. We shouldn’t be in a situation where they’re demanding a 17% pay increase, but we are, because they’ve been treated like unskilled or low skilled workers who actually need a degree and more to qualify yet they’ll have to pay it back as a type of tax after it was loaned to them. Maybe not all of it, but they will be paying it back. It shouldn’t be charged, but if you leave the profession or country within a time period you’re paying it back as normal.

 


COYP

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 10 Nov 22 8.36pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Problem here is nurses have been undervalued, under supported and underpaid for years. We shouldn’t be in a situation where they’re demanding a 17% pay increase, but we are, because they’ve been treated like unskilled or low skilled workers who actually need a degree and more to qualify yet they’ll have to pay it back as a type of tax after it was loaned to them. Maybe not all of it, but they will be paying it back. It shouldn’t be charged, but if you leave the profession or country within a time period you’re paying it back as normal.

Undervalued in what way though. They do have a choice tbh. Either take the 40 pieces with massive end of employment benefits or go and work somewhere else. I’m a boiler engineer and when I repair said broken boiler and make an old or Poorly person warm and comfortable etc etc should I pat myself on the back and demand pay rises or crack on and realise I chose that particular profession. Saving lives as a nurse, sorting out someone’s benefits, or a n other role. I don’t think one is more important than the other tbh. Everything be needs help at some stage in life. The type of help is relavant to the importance of the person at the time they need it.

 

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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 9.25pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

My wife is a nurse and in her Trust they have voted to strike. We haven't discussed whether, or how, she voted. She is though sympathetic to the demands.

I am not. I don't think anyone should contemplate going on strike at the moment. If anyone achieves an above average settlement that will become the norm and our inflation and debt problems will just get worse.

Of course I am proud of her and the work she does and realise that her pay in real terms has fallen, but this is not the time to try to correct that.

I am particularly angry with the train drivers trying to get a larger share of the cake.

With a cost cutting budget due next week I have no idea what the government will do in response, but this makes me feel really uncomfortable. We are in a recession. In recessions real wages go down. There may well have to be another cap on increases in the public sector.

 

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 10 Nov 22 9.38pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

This BS about 'nurses' annoys the f*** out of me. Probably one of the most highly over-rated professions who seem to believe they are above reproach.

In my experience, if you get one in 5 who actually gives much beyond the barest of basic duty of care, then you are lucky.

The ones at the top of their profession, working in say critical care and so on, different gravy but the average nurse on a hospital ward? In my experience, an utter disgrace. I know of family friends who work in the nursing profession who have nothing but utter horror stories of their colleagues, many of whom look for the merest excuse to go off sick or shirk or try and come up with malicious complaints when they are pulled up about their lack of attention.

And yet we are all meant to somehow see them as 'Angels'. Nah. Ain't having it.

 


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 10 Nov 22 9.41pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

My wife is a nurse and in her Trust they have voted to strike. We haven't discussed whether, or how, she voted. She is though sympathetic to the demands.

I am not. I don't think anyone should contemplate going on strike at the moment. If anyone achieves an above average settlement that will become the norm and our inflation and debt problems will just get worse.

Of course I am proud of her and the work she does and realise that her pay in real terms has fallen, but this is not the time to try to correct that.

I am particularly angry with the train drivers trying to get a larger share of the cake.

With a cost cutting budget due next week I have no idea what the government will do in response, but this makes me feel really uncomfortable. We are in a recession. In recessions real wages go down. There may well have to be another cap on increases in the public sector.

Well I take my hat off to you WE. Although I thought you may tell your mrs to do one about the pay rise and in not so many words ; indirectly you have . I’m sure she along with 1000s more do a fabulous job but we all have to cut our cloth including hmg.
The train drivers are private sector so tbh it’s up to their employer to iron them out.
I do wonder what a different political party would do atm.

 

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View PalazioVecchio's Profile PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 10 Nov 22 10.31pm Send a Private Message to PalazioVecchio Add PalazioVecchio as a friend

costs are up, bills are up.....workers are walking away from poor pay. Its not only the Nurses.

Many employers are struggling to get the staff. The coming recession will fix that problem.

 


7 points from Manchester last season

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View orpingtoneagle's Profile orpingtoneagle Flag Orpington 10 Nov 22 10.42pm Send a Private Message to orpingtoneagle Add orpingtoneagle as a friend

We have had this debate many times on this forum.

Anyone can join a union and if enough do then legally that union is able to represent its members in the workplace.

Unions have been a catalyst for change all over the world reforming T & C's for everyone but I agree thses days they are strongest in but not confined to the public services.

No one takes strike action lightly it comes with consequences and in order to call a strike any union has to ballot and thresholds have to be met. In the PCS ballot today some areas failed to meet thresholds and in them no action can be taken.

If you go on strike you lose pay and pension for the days you are out.

Its up to you if you join a union - the days of the closed shop are long gone. If you do it's up to you if you vote and who you vote for. (Oddly a strike vote has to be postal unlike say a political party voting in anew Prime minister which can be done on line.)

So people feel strong enough to vote for action. Fair play to them and maybe it might just mean as we have seen in the rail strikes a better offer than one which makes those affected poorer year on year.

Not saying BTW that others are not suffering and have not been offered or got low or no pay rises. As a nation we are all suffering right now.

 

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View Henry of Peckham's Profile Henry of Peckham Flag Eton Mess 10 Nov 22 11.54pm Send a Private Message to Henry of Peckham Add Henry of Peckham as a friend

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

costs are up, bills are up.....workers are walking away from poor pay. Its not only the Nurses.

Many employers are struggling to get the staff. The coming recession will fix that problem.

You're right, they are ... the place where I work has been advertising for months to fill several staff vacancies. No one has applied because of the low level of wages.

They're okay for someone like me because I'm topping up my pension but I'd be queueing at the food banks and probably sitting in the dark if I had to depend on my earnings.

 


Denial is not just a river in Egypt

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View Forest Hillbilly's Profile Forest Hillbilly Flag in a hidey-hole 11 Nov 22 6.27am Send a Private Message to Forest Hillbilly Add Forest Hillbilly as a friend

My opinions are formed from limited personal experience. Teachers haven't had an actual pay rise for years. This is true for other sectors of State Workers (though not all of them).
Unions are scrambling to play 'catch-up' on wages where there has been a significant shortfall for many years.
Morale is low in these low-pay sectors. People are leaving to take better paid jobs. There is a lack of people being trained for these places, because they are poorly paid. Therefore, qualification standards of entry are being 'diluted', so inevitably more 5hlt staff are getting through to take these jobs. We've seen it with teachers, nurses and police.
To cover the immediate shortfall in staff, Agencies are being used, whereby expenditure in these areas is rocketing.

 


,.,.,..,

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 11 Nov 22 6.37am Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Problem here is nurses have been undervalued, under supported and underpaid for years. We shouldn’t be in a situation where they’re demanding a 17% pay increase, but we are, because they’ve been treated like unskilled or low skilled workers who actually need a degree and more to qualify.

True. My wife is a nurse and she entered the profession 20 years ago knowing that the pay wasn't great and nothing has really changed since.

Many of her colleagues who leave the profession don't do so for money reasons but for being treated as assets instead of people. She worked at one hospital for ten years and was entitled to seven weeks paid holiday per year but was told to take the holidays in one week blocks and preferably in school term time despite having an autistic child at school. I persuaded her to leave and find another hospital that would treat her as a person which she did

 

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Flag 11 Nov 22 7.00am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

Like many on here I was born in 1960, grew up in the South & my formative years were the 70 / 80s - I was aware of the various strikes around that time - Print workers / Coal Power / Car Assembly Workers etc - the power of the unions at that time & the phrase of "holding the country to ransom" was one that was being used on the news every day - "the winter of our discontent" was another phrase often used - as a southerner the coal strikes only really effected me with the power strikes, I didn't live close to any mines & knew no miners, the print was largely up in Wapping & car assembly was in the midlands - even today none of my family are school teachers or nurses so I really dont have a dog in this fight & whilst I fully believe that Unions were needed back in the early days of industrialised Britain when I saw what they did in the 80s in terms of driving those professions towards alternative methods ( i.e less reliant on people (automation) & driven towards countries with lower labour costs) I have to wonder where this current round of talks / strikes etc will end, OK its difficult to replaces nurses, Teachers with the number of lessons held over teams / zoom etc over lockdown & I am not in any way suggesting that should become the norm but you can see where I am going with this - the same with train drivers / signallers, technology already exists to replace them - anyway, as I say I dont have a dog in this fight, just my tuppence worth -

 

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