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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 3.14pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle Whereas making others get vaccinated against their will is completely selfless. Let everyone who is still worried stay indoors and let the rest of us get on with life. I am not for compulsory vaccination. I am for increasing the incentives to do so. Those who have been vaccinated have cooperated with the national effort and deserve their freedom. Those who haven't, don't. One new idea I have had is this. Insurance policies load for risk. Some medical ones will exclude cover for pre-existing conditions. I will not be surprised if insurers in the USA either start to load policies for the unvaccinated, or start to exclude cover for Covid for them, thus requiring them to pay for their own treatment. With our flat rate of NI no-one has any financial incentive to stay healthy. It has been assumed that there was incentive enough in just staying healthy. However, maybe that should change, and those who could be vaccinated, but refuse, should now be charged a NI premium to cover the additional costs they are putting on the NHS? Probably too late for Covid but possibly for the next one. We cannot let this happen again. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 3.14pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Whereas making others get vaccinated against their will is completely selfless. Let everyone who is still worried stay indoors and let the rest of us get on with life.

I am not for compulsory vaccination. I am for increasing the incentives to do so. Those who have been vaccinated have cooperated with the national effort and deserve their freedom. Those who haven't, don't.

One new idea I have had is this. Insurance policies load for risk. Some medical ones will exclude cover for pre-existing conditions.

I will not be surprised if insurers in the USA either start to load policies for the unvaccinated, or start to exclude cover for Covid for them, thus requiring them to pay for their own treatment.

With our flat rate of NI no-one has any financial incentive to stay healthy. It has been assumed that there was incentive enough in just staying healthy.

However, maybe that should change, and those who could be vaccinated, but refuse, should now be charged a NI premium to cover the additional costs they are putting on the NHS?

Probably too late for Covid but possibly for the next one. We cannot let this happen again.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 21 Dec 21 3.20pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I am not for compulsory vaccination. I am for increasing the incentives to do so. Those who have been vaccinated have cooperated with the national effort and deserve their freedom. Those who haven't, don't. One new idea I have had is this. Insurance policies load for risk. Some medical ones will exclude cover for pre-existing conditions. I will not be surprised if insurers in the USA either start to load policies for the unvaccinated, or start to exclude cover for Covid for them, thus requiring them to pay for their own treatment. With our flat rate of NI no-one has any financial incentive to stay healthy. It has been assumed that there was incentive enough in just staying healthy. However, maybe that should change, and those who could be vaccinated, but refuse, should now be charged a NI premium to cover the additional costs they are putting on the NHS? Probably too late for Covid but possibly for the next one. We cannot let this happen again. That seems reasonable. Here is some information on COVID treatment costs in America from last year. The figures are quite startling. [Link]
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Teddy Eagle

21 Dec 21 3.20pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

One new idea I have had is this. Insurance policies load for risk. Some medical ones will exclude cover for pre-existing conditions.

I will not be surprised if insurers in the USA either start to load policies for the unvaccinated, or start to exclude cover for Covid for them, thus requiring them to pay for their own treatment.

With our flat rate of NI no-one has any financial incentive to stay healthy. It has been assumed that there was incentive enough in just staying healthy.

However, maybe that should change, and those who could be vaccinated, but refuse, should now be charged a NI premium to cover the additional costs they are putting on the NHS?

Probably too late for Covid but possibly for the next one. We cannot let this happen again.

That seems reasonable.
Here is some information on COVID treatment costs in America from last year. The figures are quite startling.

[Link]

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Teddy Eagle 21 Dec 21 3.25pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle That seems reasonable. Here is some information on COVID treatment costs in America from last year. The figures are quite startling. [Link] I would add though that this would have to be limited in scope or all sorts of exceptions will be made, smokers, drinkers, motorcyclists, etc.
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Teddy Eagle

21 Dec 21 3.25pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

That seems reasonable.
Here is some information on COVID treatment costs in America from last year. The figures are quite startling.

[Link]

I would add though that this would have to be limited in scope or all sorts of exceptions will be made, smokers, drinkers, motorcyclists, etc.

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Stirlingsays 21 Dec 21 3.38pm
I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link. The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration. Anyway I can say that because I recently watched a Jimmy Dore video which tracked the 'Great Barrington Declaration' and how it's been attacked and largely hidden by the authorities. Their opinions haven't appeared to change and they aren't happy regarding their treatment. It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults. Here is the Dore video: [Link] Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

21 Dec 21 3.38pm

I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link.

The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration.

Anyway I can say that because I recently watched a Jimmy Dore video which tracked the 'Great Barrington Declaration' and how it's been attacked and largely hidden by the authorities. Their opinions haven't appeared to change and they aren't happy regarding their treatment.

It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults.

Here is the Dore video:

[Link]

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 21 Dec 21 5.23pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link. The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration. Anyway I can say that because I recently watched a Jimmy Dore video which tracked the 'Great Barrington Declaration' and how it's been attacked and largely hidden by the authorities. Their opinions haven't appeared to change and they aren't happy regarding their treatment. It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults. Here is the Dore video: [Link] Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm) Read about this when it came out. Important to note that it's pre-vaccine. Certainly didn't think much of it then, but now we have vaccines, it's central premise of protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with it makes more sense. Problem is it came out pre-vaccine and not post vaccine, so although it makes more sense now, it certainly didn't then – and that's why I think a caveat is needed. Personally I think it's moot anyway – if the data stays the same there is no reason for a 2 week breaker or whatever the option on the table for the 28th is. Too politically damaging. Data stays as it is, we should be back on the road to annual jabs and no more threats of lockdowns. Edited by SW19 CPFC (21 Dec 2021 5.24pm) Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.
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SW19 CPFC

Addiscombe West 21 Dec 21 5.23pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link.

The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration.

It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults.

Here is the Dore video:

[Link]

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm)

Read about this when it came out. Important to note that it's pre-vaccine. Certainly didn't think much of it then, but now we have vaccines, it's central premise of protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with it makes more sense. Problem is it came out pre-vaccine and not post vaccine, so although it makes more sense now, it certainly didn't then – and that's why I think a caveat is needed.

Personally I think it's moot anyway – if the data stays the same there is no reason for a 2 week breaker or whatever the option on the table for the 28th is. Too politically damaging.

Data stays as it is, we should be back on the road to annual jabs and no more threats of lockdowns.

Edited by SW19 CPFC (21 Dec 2021 5.24pm)

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 5.59pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link. The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration. Anyway I can say that because I recently watched a Jimmy Dore video which tracked the 'Great Barrington Declaration' and how it's been attacked and largely hidden by the authorities. Their opinions haven't appeared to change and they aren't happy regarding their treatment. It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults. Here is the Dore video: [Link] Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm) When a small group of scientists, take a political, rather than scientific position, why on earth should they complain about "their treatment"? The condemnation was completely to be expected and thoroughly deserved. Nothing unethical involved when they are expressing opinions well outside the scientific consensus. All that happened was a calling out of their political character. With the public struggling to cope in a world which is awash with misinformation, the last thing they need is any more. People like Jeffrey Tucker are fully entitled to promote alternative political strategies. Academics aren't when camouflaging them as a scientific report. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 5.59pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I bet most people...and that would include me, didn't know of the 'Great Barrington Declaration' until they read that post and clicked the link.

The have largely been fed one perspective with any other opinion being labelled as conspiracy theory or misinformation....and just to be clear this isn't an anti vaccine declaration.

It's highly unethical stuff....essentially most governments wish to lie to their publics on consensus regarding covid policy....essentially treating them like infants instead of adults.

Here is the Dore video:

[Link]

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Dec 2021 4.26pm)

When a small group of scientists, take a political, rather than scientific position, why on earth should they complain about "their treatment"?

The condemnation was completely to be expected and thoroughly deserved. Nothing unethical involved when they are expressing opinions well outside the scientific consensus. All that happened was a calling out of their political character. With the public struggling to cope in a world which is awash with misinformation, the last thing they need is any more.

People like Jeffrey Tucker are fully entitled to promote alternative political strategies. Academics aren't when camouflaging them as a scientific report.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 6.15pm
Originally posted by SW19 CPFC Read about this when it came out. Important to note that it's pre-vaccine. Certainly didn't think much of it then, but now we have vaccines, it's central premise of protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with it makes more sense. Problem is it came out pre-vaccine and not post vaccine, so although it makes more sense now, it certainly didn't then – and that's why I think a caveat is needed. Personally I think it's moot anyway – if the data stays the same there is no reason for a 2 week breaker or whatever the option on the table for the 28th is. Too politically damaging. Data stays as it is, we should be back on the road to annual jabs and no more threats of lockdowns. Edited by SW19 CPFC (21 Dec 2021 5.24pm) Let's hope so! Until then, stay cautious and stay safe. Whatever happens, the imperative to get everyone vaccinated remains unaltered and the pressure to achieve that needs to be increased and not eased. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 6.15pm

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

Personally I think it's moot anyway – if the data stays the same there is no reason for a 2 week breaker or whatever the option on the table for the 28th is. Too politically damaging.

Data stays as it is, we should be back on the road to annual jabs and no more threats of lockdowns.

Edited by SW19 CPFC (21 Dec 2021 5.24pm)

Let's hope so! Until then, stay cautious and stay safe.

Whatever happens, the imperative to get everyone vaccinated remains unaltered and the pressure to achieve that needs to be increased and not eased.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 8.04pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle I would add though that this would have to be limited in scope or all sorts of exceptions will be made, smokers, drinkers, motorcyclists, etc. Who knows what the future might hold? If it worked as an incentive to help people help themselves, then it could be used. Of course, smoking and drinking has been targetted by taxation, which cannot be done for vaccination. Smoking has also been targetted by a form of social exclusion, with some success. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 8.04pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

I would add though that this would have to be limited in scope or all sorts of exceptions will be made, smokers, drinkers, motorcyclists, etc.

Who knows what the future might hold? If it worked as an incentive to help people help themselves, then it could be used. Of course, smoking and drinking has been targetted by taxation, which cannot be done for vaccination. Smoking has also been targetted by a form of social exclusion, with some success.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 21 Dec 21 8.37pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Who knows what the future might hold? If it worked as an incentive to help people help themselves, then it could be used. Of course, smoking and drinking has been targetted by taxation, which cannot be done for vaccination. Smoking has also been targetted by a form of social exclusion, with some success. Yes but this increase could include literally anything that someone decided was “self inflicted”. Broke your leg playing football? Your fault. Cough up.
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Teddy Eagle

21 Dec 21 8.37pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Yes but this increase could include literally anything that someone decided was “self inflicted”. Broke your leg playing football? Your fault. Cough up.

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Tim Gypsy Hill '64 Stoke sub normal 21 Dec 21 10.28pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle It's because those "facts" are not regarded as hard, as there is a general belief that there is a lot of underreporting there. Oh I see. A "general belief". So not fact then. But the fact that the previously under-reported infection versus death waves are different to the under-reported omicron infection versus death rates is reason to disregard the evidence? Whereas the reliance on the modelling, which has been spectacularly overstated on all previous occasions since the initial outbreak from Wuhan, is to be trusted and acted upon. Systematically dragged down by the lawmakers
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Tim Gypsy Hill '64

Stoke sub normal 21 Dec 21 10.28pm

Send a Private Message to Tim Gypsy Hill '64

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

It's because those "facts" are not regarded as hard, as there is a general belief that there is a lot of underreporting there.

Oh I see. A "general belief". So not fact then. But the fact that the previously under-reported infection versus death waves are different to the under-reported omicron infection versus death rates is reason to disregard the evidence? Whereas the reliance on the modelling, which has been spectacularly overstated on all previous occasions since the initial outbreak from Wuhan, is to be trusted and acted upon.

Systematically dragged down by the lawmakers

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 10.33pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle Yes but this increase could include literally anything that someone decided was “self inflicted”. Broke your leg playing football? Your fault. Cough up. Surely there are things that are considered "normal" behaviour and therefore would be covered within the standard charge? We all do things that can result in a broken leg. Like walking the dog! We don't make a deliberate choice to break our leg. Deciding not to get vaccinated is different. Deciding to smoke or even drink too much are arguable choices. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 21 Dec 21 10.33pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Yes but this increase could include literally anything that someone decided was “self inflicted”. Broke your leg playing football? Your fault. Cough up.

Surely there are things that are considered "normal" behaviour and therefore would be covered within the standard charge? We all do things that can result in a broken leg. Like walking the dog! We don't make a deliberate choice to break our leg.

Deciding not to get vaccinated is different. Deciding to smoke or even drink too much are arguable choices.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 21 Dec 21 10.37pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Surely there are things that are considered "normal" behaviour and therefore would be covered within the standard charge? We all do things that can result in a broken leg. Like walking the dog! We don't make a deliberate choice to break our leg. Deciding not to get vaccinated is different. Deciding to smoke or even drink too much are arguable choices. Maybe so but I pay quite enough tax on my beer and fags already.
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Teddy Eagle

21 Dec 21 10.37pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Deciding not to get vaccinated is different. Deciding to smoke or even drink too much are arguable choices.

Maybe so but I pay quite enough tax on my beer and fags already.

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