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Bias against Trump


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Stirlingsays Flag 15 Aug 17 5.29pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

There's no need to continue debating this with you. For example, I gave you stats from the Government Accountability Office and you questioned them because they failed to match your presumption of balance in bad behaviour. By a mere gesture such evidence was wafted aside. "Trump's not all bad and Sanders isn't all good, so you can't pick between the two."

In a nutshell, you're the adult / real man in the room (at 260lbs of almost pure muscle) and everyone else is a poor, uninformed fool who needs to listen to your sage teachings.

Meanwhile...

Edited by Ray in Houston (15 Aug 2017 2.33pm)


Yeah, we're the archetypal frog in ever heating water and you know what you are talking about. Ok Ray, Trump's got a few more years left, lets wait for the jackboots and prove me wrong. Get involved in a few punch ups if you want as you do your bit saving the world.

I've agreed there is a problem in the US with the far right more so than here. I cast doubt on those figures because they appear to be missing deaths I know have been caused by the far left so....if something isn't objective I don't really trust it...explain that to me and maybe I will trust it. But while groups like Antifa are a growing problem I don't doubt that far right groups are probably a bigger one. But regardless the vast majority on both sides regard these people as extremists.

As for my exact percentage of musculature, this will remain a mystery until Kermit takes me on in a well intentioned arm's wrestle.

You are free not to debate me, sure. I hold no gripe either way. Enjoy life and be free brother.

Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Aug 2017 5.35pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays Flag 15 Aug 17 5.32pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

It's the danger of normalising extreme behaviour. After Trump gave his scripted speech about how right wing violence is bad, he called CNN fake news as he walked off without answering questions. Later tweeted that "fake news" media are the "truly bad people". Today, Trump retweeted a cartoon that showed a CNN reporter being run down by a speeding "Trump train".

Just think about this in sequence. A right wing extremist / terrorist murders a counter-protester and injures many others by hitting them with a speeding car; then Trump says there was bad action "on many sides"; then he gets shamed into actually condemning the perpetrators; then he says the media is worse and then he rejoices in a depiction of a reporter getting killed by a speeding train.

This is not normal.

No, Trump is not normal....I think we can all agree on that.

Tell us Ray, do you support antifa?

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Ray in Houston Flag Houston 15 Aug 17 9.01pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

No, Trump is not normal....I think we can all agree on that.

Tell us Ray, do you support antifa?


They have a right to protest and, when they choose, counter-protest. However, they have shown a propensity to escalate things to violence and property damage, which is where the law should step in and arrest / punish as appropriate.

I also disagree with their tactics of hounding speakers at universities and elsewhere. While the right to freedom of speech is only constitutionally guaranteed free of government censorship (that's the bit that many people forget), speakers should not be denied a public platform just because a minority doesn't think they're going to like what they expect to hear. Let them speak and then agree / debate / denounce as you feel appropriate.

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

Stirlingsays Flag 15 Aug 17 9.31pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


They have a right to protest and, when they choose, counter-protest. However, they have shown a propensity to escalate things to violence and property damage, which is where the law should step in and arrest / punish as appropriate.

I also disagree with their tactics of hounding speakers at universities and elsewhere. While the right to freedom of speech is only constitutionally guaranteed free of government censorship (that's the bit that many people forget), speakers should not be denied a public platform just because a minority doesn't think they're going to like what they expect to hear. Let them speak and then agree / debate / denounce as you feel appropriate.

Totally agree with you. I think this is one of the best aspects about the better democracies. The freedom to express your opinion and ideas.....though obviously within reasonable bounds.

I don't like any politician mucking around with that. I hear there is some suspicion about Trump and the Internet....Hopefully not.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Ray in Houston Flag Houston 15 Aug 17 9.50pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Totally agree with you. I think this is one of the best aspects about the better democracies. The freedom to express your opinion and ideas.....though obviously within reasonable bounds.

I don't like any politician mucking around with that. I hear there is some suspicion about Trump and the Internet....Hopefully not.


Trump has put in charge of the FCC - the body that regulates the internet - a man who opposes net neutrality. An open internet - at least in the U.S. - is in serious jeopardy right now.

This is theme to the Trump administration. He has put in charge of the Dept. of Energy a man who campaigned on abolishing it. Head of the EPA? A man who was suing it and so is now in charge of his settling his own lawsuit (and does not see the need to recuse himself from the process). Head of Housing? A sleepy neurosurgeon. Head of Public Education? A woman who has worked tirelessly to privitise education (and who has a financial stake in doing so). Pretty much everyone else is either a family member or from Goldman Sachs.

#DraintheSwamp

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

Dave58 Flag Ipswich 16 Aug 17 6.57am

He now gets criticism for saying the Virginia violence came from all sides. Trump old chap, when will you realise that people don't like the truth?

 

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 16 Aug 17 9.06am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm not what you would exactly call a Trump supporter, but six months in and the US stock market has added four trillion dollars of worth to the US. Yet does his pretty much totally negative media report report that? There's a lack of evenness.

A lot of what Trump tweets about is...well to put it politely BS but on the unreliability and bias of the mainstream news media he is definitely not wrong.

Sorry but your post is also BS. Trump has had no genuine effect on the stock market, despite his many claims to the contrary. Economies take much longer to respond to stimulus than the few months since Trump became POTUS. The rise is all because of greed and the expectation that company profits will rise as a consequence of the promised tax cuts. The Republicans have been tolerating Trump only because they expect to be enriched by that. When the tipping point is reached that they no longer see any benefit in keeping him he will be dumped and the stock market will fall again to it's real level. That point isn't far away, so sell now!

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 16 Aug 17 9.14am

Originally posted by Dave58

He now gets criticism for saying the Virginia violence came from all sides. Trump old chap, when will you realise that people don't like the truth?

He quite rightly gets criticism because there is no moral equivalency between those who openly support white supremacy and Nazi ideas and those who protest them. Such ideas on display need to be resisted. The idea that a group of Nazis can parade through the streets with automatic weapons and body armour is disgusting. It isn't just free speech! It is a direct challenge to everything democracy has fought for in the last 100 years.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Stirlingsays Flag 16 Aug 17 9.17am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Sorry but your post is also BS. Trump has had no genuine effect on the stock market, despite his many claims to the contrary. Economies take much longer to respond to stimulus than the few months since Trump became POTUS. The rise is all because of greed and the expectation that company profits will rise as a consequence of the promised tax cuts. The Republicans have been tolerating Trump only because they expect to be enriched by that. When the tipping point is reached that they no longer see any benefit in keeping him he will be dumped and the stock market will fall again to it's real level. That point isn't far away, so sell now!

Hardly BS then is it. I didn't claim that Trump was some economic genius. The reason the markets have risen is precisely because of Trump being there and what they expect him to do in terms of regulations.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays Flag 16 Aug 17 9.24am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

He quite rightly gets criticism because there is no moral equivalency between those who openly support white supremacy and Nazi ideas and those who protest them. Such ideas on display need to be resisted. The idea that a group of Nazis can parade through the streets with automatic weapons and body armour is disgusting. It isn't just free speech! It is a direct challenge to everything democracy has fought for in the last 100 years.

No problems with people protesting white supremacy. However antifa also go to protests with weapons and attack people. The events at Berkeley where violence was used against a Milo event and people put in hospital set this protest violence trend going and it's just escalating now.

Both sets of people are extremists and Trump was right about this.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Kermit8 Flag Hevon 16 Aug 17 10.40am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

No problems with people protesting white supremacy. However antifa also go to protests with weapons and attack people. The events at Berkeley where violence was used against a Milo event and people put in hospital set this protest violence trend going and it's just escalating now.

Both sets of people are extremists and Trump was right about this.

The idea is, and looking at fairly recent history as a reference point, is that the far right are prepared to use extreme violence against minorities and liberals in their pursuit of power so the best way to stop them is to confront them and literally hit them harder in order to nip them in the bud.

Dialogue and debate doesn't really work with those kind of fanatical extremists whose hatred is deep and dangerous but physical overpowering does.

Some people may have a lot of disdain for direct action anti-fascists and any part-hypocrisy therein but if it keeps Nazis and their sympathisers away from office then they must be doing something correct.

 


Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]


Stirlingsays Flag 16 Aug 17 10.46am

Originally posted by Kermit8

Some people may have a lot of disdain for direct action anti-fascists and any part-hypocrisy therein but if it keeps Nazis and their sympathisers away from office then they must be doing something correct.

You should get down there Kermit....dress in black and punch a Nazi. Do your bit to save the world from the far right takeover.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 16 Aug 17 10.52am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You should get down there Kermit....dress in black and punch a Nazi. Do your bit to save the world from the far right takeover.

Why not just go to Wisbech. It's a lot nearer.

 

Kermit8 Flag Hevon 16 Aug 17 10.54am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You should get down there Kermit....dress in black and punch a Nazi. Do your bit to save the world from the far right takeover.

It is tempting. I did like a demo or two back in the day. Anti-vivisection - yes I was one of them animal rights most dangerous people in Britain brigade for a nanosecond. Stop the City was a laugh too. Some very irate red-faced w@nker bankers with ruined suits. If you can't do it when you're young when can you?

 


Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]


jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 16 Aug 17 10.58am

Originally posted by Kermit8

It is tempting. I did like a demo or two back in the day. Anti-vivisection - yes I was one of them animal rights most dangerous people in Britain brigade for a nanosecond. Stop the City was a laugh too. Some very irate red-faced w@nker bankers with ruined suits. If you can't do it when you're young when can you?

Yep, its a day out, get to meet people, usually a few women around, and its pretty good fun, even if its a largely futile approach.

Its the political motivated equivalent of hiking.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Stirlingsays Flag 16 Aug 17 11.15am

Originally posted by Kermit8

It is tempting. I did like a demo or two back in the day. Anti-vivisection - yes I was one of them animal rights most dangerous people in Britain brigade for a nanosecond. Stop the City was a laugh too. Some very irate red-faced w@nker bankers with ruined suits. If you can't do it when you're young when can you?

I suppose....I've never felt angry enough to actually get out yet...If I was young around 2008 I may have done the city protests....but it turned into a kind of 'destroy' the city rather than 'what the fcuk! I want arrests!'.

I might demo over free speech at some point or Brexit if it doesn't happen.....or the wilful lack of action on population growth if enough people catch on to what's happening there.....oh and people should definitely be demonstrating over the housing crises....which is connected to rate of population growth.

Hey suddenly I seem like a fervent protester.....There's a lot that needs to be worked on in society. I just can't be bothered to move my fat muscular arse.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Stirlingsays Flag 16 Aug 17 11.19am

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Yep, its a day out, get to meet people, usually a few women around, and its pretty good fun, even if its a largely futile approach.

Its the political motivated equivalent of hiking.

Yeah, but do the kind of women who go on protest marches wash much? I bet you find more make up in North Korean farms than on your average woman on some 'right on' protest march.

All entirely based upon my own prejudices of course.

Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Aug 2017 11.20am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

wordup Flag 16 Aug 17 12.10pm


Quote “Charlottesville: Race and Terror,” follows Christopher Cantwell, an unabashed white supremacist who spews racist invective while traveling around with a band of neo-Nazis. Cantwell is a prominent “alt-right” shock jock who came to Charlottesville to speak at the “United the Right” rally. In the documentary, Cantwell and a posse of assorted white supremacists speak forcefully about the warped theories underpinning what they consider to be an impending and inevitable race war.

“We’re not non-violent, we’ll f***ing kill these people if we have to,” he tells Vice News Tonight correspondent, Elle Reeve, after we’ve seen him rinsing mace off his face with milk.

Following the car attack that took the life of one of the protesters, 31-year-old Heather Heyer, and injured 19 others, Cantwell showed no regret, much less remorse. “I’d say it was worth it,” Cantwell says. “The fact that nobody on our side died, I’d go ahead and call that points for us.”

“I think a lot more people are going to die here,” he says, smirking, and predicted even more violent encounters in the future.

[Link]


 

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 16 Aug 17 12.50pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Hardly BS then is it. I didn't claim that Trump was some economic genius. The reason the markets have risen is precisely because of Trump being there and what they expect him to do in terms of regulations.

You were doing what other Trump apologists do. Complain about "a lack of evenness" in the way the MSM report him. There is no such thing at all. He deserves all he gets and more because he makes claims that are entirely false whilst complaining that those who explain why they are false are publishing "fake news". Trump would not not know the truth if it bit him on the backside. His claims about a rising market are false because the rise is a bubble and not down to an economic recovery he fantasises he has created. The MSM are just telling it as it is.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (16 Aug 2017 1.04pm)

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 16 Aug 17 1.01pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

No problems with people protesting white supremacy. However antifa also go to protests with weapons and attack people. The events at Berkeley where violence was used against a Milo event and people put in hospital set this protest violence trend going and it's just escalating now.

Both sets of people are extremists and Trump was right about this.

Whilst no-one should ever initiate violence against anyone, being extreme about protesting white supremacy and Nazism has more moral authority than being a white supremacist or a Nazi. Trump has twice failed to make that distinction, and I am not sure that either he, or you, understand why it matters that he needs to. If there were no Nazis then there would be no Antifa. Violence from the latter is a direct consequence of the existence of the former. The emergence from the shadows of the former is a direct consequence of Trump's election as POTUS.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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