We already collaborate with France and NATO because we don't have enough resources/ equipment to defend our own aircraft carriers. I think the US still provide some of the aircraft operating from our carriers? All but one of our type 45 destroyers are in dock because their engines are faulty and we are likely to scrap our new tank programme because that doesn't work either ... I think we need to give up any aspirations we have to compete with any superpowers.

Denial is not just a river in Egypt

It's the definition that I took issue with many moons ago, and how you've interpreted it. The aim is not to create a singular, national army abolishing EU Army.

The reality is very different, with a model very similar to the NATO approach, but solely for the EU. Also, there's no such thing as the 'NATO Army' is there. Same thing here. It's a collection of national armies being used in a collaboratively agreed political way.

Now, if you have issue with the EU, or European countries as a whole wanting to have their own version of NATO that removes the need for the US to be on board every time there is a conflict or political flare up, then that's a very different, and valid, conversation to have.

But the idea that there will be a centralised EU Army that replaces all European sovereign armies is a fantasy.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

I don't think anyone thought it hadn't been discussed. Indeed, it clearly has been. Nor that it wouldn't happen.

I think the denials were of the idea that the UK would somehow be forced to join it. I don't think that was ever even a remote possibility. I can imagine France, Italy and Germany merging their armed forces and some smaller countries joining them. I can imagine, even now, us co-operating on procurement. What I could never imagine was us delegating command of our forces to an EU authority. Unless, of course, NATO collapsed.

This was always Project Fear!

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Rather than thinking about an army the EU should be more concerned about still existing.

The politicians may be mighty full of themselves and drunk on collective power but the citizens of the EU think far less of them than they do.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I don't think I have ever said there would be a single EU army it would be a rival to NATO with each country contributing but who makes the political decisions.

I actually don't care if they go ahead and do this as we are now out of it and if it suits us to co-operate from time to time with the EU fair enough.

The issue for this EU military alliance as I see it is that France is the only meaningful military force so the others who so far have shown a reluctance to spend money and commit men will have to step up.

I suspect that is the reason why the EU appears to be holding out an olive branch to the only other effective force in western Europe.

I hope Boris says thanks but no thanks (to the alliance not co-operating when it suits us).

As another poster has said we should stop being the policeman of the world let the US and China slug that one out.

One more point

Seeing as this thread is about why the French can}"t stop the migrants, I thought it only fair to post that the leader of Islamic state in the Greater Sahara, with a $5 million bounty on his head, has been neutralised by the French troops. Adnan Abu walid ai-sahrawi, was behind an ambush in Niger ,killing eight soldiers. He was also behindthe killing of six French aid workers and their Nigerian guide and driver. Credit where credits due to monsieur Macron!

Back to the subject.

I saw this earlier.

[Link]

It turns out the UK has a modest but growing boarder force fleet. They seem to be advertising a lot of roles at the moment. Bearing in mind that a lot of cross channel ferries seem to be operating with largely Lithuanian crews at the moment you do wonder where they will get the staff from.

[Link]

The cutters travel at 25 knots, but each has a RIB attached. Either way, it will be difficult for them to catch up with a vessel heading away from it.

Other joint European operations are going on in the Aegean Sea, plus we've just withdrawn from the Med.

More tech seems to be going in on both sides of the channel to identify where launches are coming from. Except installing CCTV takes ages to make sure its compliant with GDPR.

Some good news then, which doesn't seem to be reported often. Although, this will still come as a disappointment to those who want to keep their gene pool small, weak, and inbread.

The French could always investigate who is buying all these dinghy's they must be ordering dozens each week.

One more point

You're Just showing your ignorance now.

Know all about Hybrid vigour, do you?

Two problems.

Despite what you see on TV adverts, most people tend to breed with their own kind, especially if there are religious or cultural pressures to do so. This means that the existing population will just be out bred by continuous waves of immigrants who have more children for the first couple of generations.

If there is sufficient interbreeding, the current rate of immigration will virtually replace or absorb the current gene pool, not refresh it.

There"s a business there Badger!