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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 05 Jun 17 10.54am

Originally posted by Kermit8

Really? And here was me thinking all this time that most conflicts were because others had something that someone else wanted. Land, resources, mineral wealth, etc, that kind of thing. But it turns out according to our resident Hol historian that they came about because others spoke a different language, ate different food and they danced funny.

You analyse history through your Marxist perspective and, as with most Marxist analysis, it is b*ll***s.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 05 Jun 17 10.54am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Religion isn't evil at all per se as it's people that are evil and just use religion as an excuse to kill each other

This is a meaningless statement.

Religion and evil are human constructs. Humans are a complex bunch and we delude ourselves on a daily basis to make sense of things.
We have a specific practical problem right now and it requires practical solutions. Trying to complicate the situation with abstractions will not fix it.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 05 Jun 17 11.00am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by europalace

Imagine how peaceful Northern Ireland would have been without Christianity.

So pagans were peaceful?

I really don't understand people like you who want to divert from and fudge a situation.
We have to stop indulging in strategies to avoid taking action.
We are at war and the enemy are living among us.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 05 Jun 17 11.02am

Originally posted by 7mins

This is the cold hard truth

Whilst its clearly the case, and no one would make it otherwise, its important to note that 'terrorism' doesn't really have a universally shared meaning, even within countries.

For example, the US State Department in the 80s and 90s (possibly even still) didn't consider suicide bombings against the Israeli's in the occupied territory and settlements as terrorism - as it fell within the UN definition of the right to self defence against occupation. Similarly, Hezbollah, a known terrorist group, wasn't considered as a terrorist actor when acting in the Golan Heights or in defence of Lebanon, during Israeli incursions.

Even though the US constantly referred to these actions as terrorist activities, the State Departments definition was different to the White House.

Terrorist really is a political buzzword as well, that's very loaded. The Nazis referred to the SOE, Commandos and Resistance movements as terrorist, which the UN specifically separated out post war under the right of an occupied national to resist by any means.

Also a lot of what is considered 'Islamic terrorism' can often be more about regional politics. Whilst things like White Supremist in the US get a pass on being terrorist, despite being drawn along very religious lines.

Indeed the US didn't even consider domestic terrorism to be terrorism until the late 80s.

 


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7mins Flag In the bush 05 Jun 17 11.05am Send a Private Message to 7mins Add 7mins as a friend

Originally posted by europalace


The way of dealing with it in the best way was to leave these people and their countries alone in the first place. Once you start to punch people about the face, they're likely to get angry and try to punch back. Much more difficult to get out of a fight once you've started it.


Edited by europalace (05 Jun 2017 10.55am)

If that is true (it isn't). Why are Isis killing fellow Muslims in the Middle East? It's a death cult.

 

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steeleye20 Flag Croydon 05 Jun 17 11.06am Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

Originally posted by Lyons550


I certainly agree that more funding is now required...but it'd be interesting to see how many calling for it would then accuse her/Tories of making a U turn should it happen....

That's why she should go - she won't be able to mend things as it means her doing a u-turn.

 

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Kermit8 Flag Hevon 05 Jun 17 11.07am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

You analyse history through your Marxist perspective and, as with most Marxist analysis, it is b*ll***s.

I forgot to add 'power' to my list too. You think people go to full-on war because of cultural differences? Napolean - land/power, Hitler - land/power, Colonial conflicts - land, resources, wealth, any empire-building especially Rome - the same, Milosevic - land, Falklands - land, Iraq and the Gulf land, plus hundreds of the same MO other examples throughout history.

You carry on with your thoughts, though, no matter how irrefutably incorrect and blinkered. Place would be boring without deniers such as yourself.

 


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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 05 Jun 17 11.07am

Originally posted by hedgehog50

You analyse history through your Marxist perspective and, as with most Marxist analysis, it is b*ll***s.

You'd be wrong though, given that even right wing historians and apolitical accademics use the principles of Marxist Social Conflict theory.

Wars are usually about wealth, power, resources and geo-political influence. Or a response to another faction or countries attempts to increase their own.

Al-Qaeda at the point of the 9/11 attacks was a fading has been. It had money, but few members anymore, with most of its previous influence having be absorbed into the localised Mujahadeen, and returning fighters. Post-9/11 it was the premium world wide brand for Sunni Islamist terrorist groups.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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7mins Flag In the bush 05 Jun 17 11.13am Send a Private Message to 7mins Add 7mins as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Sympathise with terrorist attacks is an issue, and it needs to be addressed, but it does depend on what you mean by sympathetic. If it means willing to break the law and provide material support to terrorism, then yes.

But 4% of Muslims being sympathetic is surprisingly small compared to the kind of sympathetic support Loyalist and Republican terrorists had during the 70s, 80s and 90s.

4% said they have sympathy with using terror attacks to defend Islam.
My mum is Irish, I know all about sympathy and even financial support for terrorists. They are c***s also. Anyone that supports terrorism is a grade A c***... and I'll call em out on it, white/black/Irish/Islamic.., if you support terrorists.., you're scum.

The survey also gave a greater number (I think it was 9%) who wouldn't notify police if they knew someone planning to commit terrorist acts

 

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mezzer Flag Main Stand, Block F, Row 20 seat 1... 05 Jun 17 11.14am Send a Private Message to mezzer Add mezzer as a friend

Originally posted by europalace


The way of dealing with it in the best way was to leave these people and their countries alone in the first place. Once you start to punch people about the face, they're likely to get angry and try to punch back. Much more difficult to get out of a fight once you've started it.


Edited by europalace (05 Jun 2017 10.55am)

That's all very noble, saying what should have happened and speaking in the past tense, but we're talking about what needs to happen now. Today. Hindsight's great, I'd have all of my money invested in the Hindsight Fund if it existed, but it doesn't.

One of the reasons Northern Ireland went on for so long was because both sides kept quoting what had happened in previous centuries. The Omagh bomb gave all sides an excuse to talk about the here and now (then), regardless of who actually planted it, whether they were on the verge of running out of money etc.

NOTHING will happen until the communities from which these modern terrorists come start to exert pressure from within. Someone earlier pointed out how the audience at the Manchester concert last night didn't begin to reflect the social make-up of Manchester. However uncomfortable that observation is, it's true.

Nothing will happen overnight and others will die needlessly in this country and across the world soon, but pussyfooting about has to stop. If certain groups get offended, sobeit. Keep harking back and looking at the causes don't help any more. The terrorists have brought this very much into real life and real time.

Sadly, we probably haven't reached our Omagh moment yet, or our Liverpool 9-0 or Sunderland 4-0 at half time moments for that matter. Rock bottom, in other words.

 


Living down here does have some advantages. At least you can see them cry.

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 05 Jun 17 11.18am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by europalace


The way of dealing with it in the best way was to leave these people and their countries alone in the first place. Once you start to punch people about the face, they're likely to get angry and try to punch back. Much more difficult to get out of a fight once you've started it.


Edited by europalace (05 Jun 2017 10.55am)

Idealism.
On a finite planet people will never leave each other alone. Why indulge in this stuff. Face reality.

 

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Kermit8 Flag Hevon 05 Jun 17 11.19am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Originally posted by mezzer

That's all very noble, saying what should have happened and speaking in the past tense, but we're talking about what needs to happen now. Today. Hindsight's great, I'd have all of my money invested in the Hindsight Fund if it existed, but it doesn't.

One of the reasons Northern Ireland went on for so long was because both sides kept quoting what had happened in previous centuries. The Omagh bomb gave all sides an excuse to talk about the here and now (then), regardless of who actually planted it, whether they were on the verge of running out of money etc.

NOTHING will happen until the communities from which these modern terrorists come start to exert pressure from within. Someone earlier pointed out how the audience at the Manchester concert last night didn't begin to reflect the social make-up of Manchester. However uncomfortable that observation is, it's true.

Nothing will happen overnight and others will die needlessly in this country and across the world soon, but pussyfooting about has to stop. If certain groups get offended, sobeit. Keep harking back and looking at the causes don't help any more. The terrorists have brought this very much into real life and real time.

Sadly, we probably haven't reached our Omagh moment yet, or our Liverpool 9-0 or Sunderland 4-0 at half time moments for that matter. Rock bottom, in other words.

I dunno. Top right.

Manc.jpg Attachment: Manc.jpg (59.97Kb)

 


Big chest and massive boobs

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