It's an absolutely terrible comparison. But if you want to stick with it, the amount of time and energy scientists and engineers have put into making cars safer over the years is insane. Do you trust the work they've done to make you safer or do you insist on the airbags being removed from your car because you don't trust the science behind them?

I assume you also refuse to wear a seatbelt too because someone else told you to do so and this wasn't your own decision.

Do you honestly also believe that coronavirus only spreads from coughing into people's faces? I have some news for you about virus transmission if so.

If this was something that could not pass from person to person I couldn't give a flying f*ck if people wanted to get vaccinated or not. The whole point of this is because even though YOU could be fine, the people you pass it on to, and the people they pass it on to might not be. That's what it comes down to, whether you give a flying f*ck about that or not. People that don't want to get vaccinated obviously don't.

The vaccine will allow you, and everyone else, to get ALL their personal liberties back. Scientists have been working night and day to get the world back to that point. Please trust them.

Thanks maple.
Yes just the mrs atm and hopefully it stays that way. Masks and separation indoors is strange but certainly necessary. it was all a bit ironic really as She just had a little cough but the reason she rang 119 was because she had an alert on her phone to isolate which obviously was being near someone else; so followed it up. Rang at 3 and tested at 7.
I think because shes a key worker in a primary school she got the test that quickly.
I doubt she would have rang for a test if no alert had come. The cough was just like a cold so we never thought it could have been C19. The symptom of a tiny cough wasnt mentioned just a hacking cough, and it hasnt got any worse either since thursday. None of the other symptoms apart from a bit tired probably a bit stress related maybe and a little higher temperature.
It shows that track and trace works so I would encourage anyone to download it NOW. Imagine she had carried on at work. It doesnt bear thinking about. Tbh it could have been me or the boys asymptomatic that bought it home. The trace system may solve the question but at school she is so safe with masks,gloves,cleaners etc. Just shows how contagious it is.
This is why you need to be ultra careful. We should scrape through unscathed but sadly maple you are first hand that it doesnt always end without casualties. Long covid could bite her yet so heres hoping not.
Much best wishes to all x

Those brought up in the thalidomide era will have an inbuilt nervousness to vaccines given that was a drug that had already been declared safe.

The vaccines currently being developed are a new technology that is in its infancy. If you want to go shooting that up straight away then more power to you but I’m going to hang on for a bit and I don’t need someone telling me that I should be following the science.

After all they were the ones who said masks are useless and changed their mind to really important. I hope it’s not those scientists that are working on the vaccine in case they go, “it’s totally safe “ followed by “Doh!”

Once again, the comparison with cars concerns risk and our choice to take them. You appear here to be trying to make a point about trust instead. Well, the modifications made to make cars safer have been with us for many decades whereas these vaccines have been rushed through extremely quickly.....You can blindly trust the state....and I won't say you'd be wrong in this instance but you are certainly more trusting than I am....but this wasn't really my point.

Deary deary me.

We don't agree upon where the balance stands between the citizen and state on basic civil liberties.

I've always regarded the Swedish approach to this as being the best balance and I've seen nothing to change my mind.

I repeat, this is not the black death, this is a aliment with a low death rate and I've already shown that you are prepared to take risks with your life and the lives of others where you see fit.

I made the car comparison to illustrate risk....You wanted a contagious comparison. AIDs was contagious.....would you have banned sex because it was always going to contain the risk of transmission condoms or not?

Also you write about these vaccines as if they have been created for charity or something. No, it's pure capitalism and a race for profit. That's not a criticism as such but I regard your characterization as almost child-like.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Nov 2020 2.46pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

There are a lot of people who are very trusting of the state and officialdom. My trust has been eroded over these last twenty or so years....and I've worked for the state myself within educational institutions.

I have no doubt that the take up on the eventual offered vaccine(s) will be high. I also have little doubt that those in high risk categories will voluntarily also have high take up rates.

Those that take the vaccine or defer, take their own choice and associated risk. However, I find the idea that people would be punished in some way for not completely trusting officialdom almost bizarre.

It's been said before but we appear to continue on a path in society where some act like 1984 was a guide book rather than a warning.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Nov 2020 1.48pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Do have a flu jab?