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General Election 2017
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nickgusset  Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 12.12pm |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
They wouldn't say that, would they. So there is no evidence. Only that they've said Labour Reasonable management is the opposite of unmanaged.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 12.14pm |
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Originally posted by Cucking Funt
Of course the first reaction is to blame the politicians in charge of the affected government department but is it necessarily their fault that the heads of IT in a particular department are useless? Don't forget, the civil service is (supposedly) Independent'of government and makes appointments like this without reference to the minister - politicians don't normally even appoint the Permanent Secretary. The tradition is that the politicians are there to take all the credit but also to take the rap if things f*ck up. Hunt may be a grade A w@nker but I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have even been aware of the imminent obsolescence of computer operating systems. I seem to remember a lot of hoo haa about procurement of IT systems in the nhs. Hunt must have known as it was so high profile
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| hedgehog50 Croydon 13 May 17 12.25pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
So there is no evidence. Only that they've said Labour Reasonable management is the opposite of unmanaged. The electorate will read what they have said (and what they have said and done in the past) and draw the obvious conclusions and vote accordingly.
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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 susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 13 May 17 12.27pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
Keep on believing that, if you wish. The facts are that the only weapon Labour has in this weapon is resorting to sectarian populism and then using pie-in-the-sky policies to try and discredit the Tories. For example, it is very easy to say 'energy companies should be nationalised because of the prices they charge customers'. The reality is that a renationalised energy sector would create a monopoly and there would not be investment on the scale of what is happening now or planned for the future, for example Bradwell B or upgrades to the distribution grid. A renationalised energy sector would be a legal nightmare to create and with the civil service bound up for the next five years with Brexit, it is hard to see how Labour could get just one small part of their manifesto completed, not to mention the other items that would also suck bureaucrats and money. Also, these plans aren't costed. Nothing I have seen gives a costing and it appears that Labour has used reversing future lowering of capital gains tax to many for several projects, meaning that hey have already committed a sum for their manifesto policies about five times over. The planned riaiskng of corporation tax will only encourage companies to find 'tax efficient' ways to hide profits offshore, and despite all the tough talk of 'no swertheart deals' with corporations he corporations and heir tax advisers are a heck of a lot smarter than a bunch of Momentum droogs and will easily find loopholes in the system and then exploit other loopholes when and if government cottons on to the first loopholes. The Labour manifesto is to me a transparent work of populism, written in he same vein as UKIP's manifesto of banning the burqa and introducing medical checks for FGM. Corbyn and McDonnell know they won't win, they are losing ground in Wales having lost Scotland, and have penned this regressive tome in order to give hemselves long enough in charge of Labour to enact their legacy, amending Labours manifesto so that left leaning candidates are in power for perpetuity. And before some smart arse asks, I do disagree with their policies. Nationalisation was a disaster in this country and nothing suggests to me that Labour could make it a success his time around, inward investment would cease completely, corporations would simply leave Britain and Labour would hand power disproportionately to unions, ensuring that we would become a strike bound country. This I totally with you on as it was a mess and cost the government loads of money and you only have to look back at British Leyland what a fiasco that was.
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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 Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 13 May 17 12.32pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
I seem to remember a lot of hoo haa about procurement of IT systems in the nhs. Hunt must have known as it was so high profile Don't get me wrong - his department, therefore he must take executive responsibility. I have no doubt that budget cuts prevented the necessary upgrades being made. But I'm also suggesting that the IT department, out of their entire budget, failed to prioritise this very necessary upgrade. IT systems across government are dogsh*t. HMRC are still using legacy systems from the days of Customs & Excise and the Inland Revenue. There's virtually no cross-department integration anywhere. This has been an issue since Blair and Brown's time and no government, of any hue, has had the foresight or bravery to commit significant resources to it. Couple this to the fact that government IT employees are about the worst paid in the industry and that morale in the civil service is at an all time low and there you have the recipe for disaster. Successive governments have ignored this in favour of other, more "popular" projects for donkeys' years and now we're starting to see the results of that negligence.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 12.32pm |
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Originally posted by susmik
This I totally with you on as it was a mess and cost the government loads of money and you only have to look back at British Leyland what a fiasco that was. 1. The allegro. If you make s*** cars it doesn't help.
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| matt_himself Matataland 13 May 17 12.45pm |
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Originally posted by susmik
This I totally with you on as it was a mess and cost the government loads of money and you only have to look back at British Leyland what a fiasco that was. It destroyed the manufacturing industry in his country. The idiots view is that 'nationalisation equals profits going to government'. What the idiot doesn't comprehend is that state owned monopolies produce pisspoor management, next to zero innovation, over powered unions, poor products and next to zero investment. Anyone thinking of voting Labour for their nationalisation policies, I urge you read Michael Edwardes book 'Back from the Brink'. It is about Edwardes' time as CEO of British Leyland. It will bring tears to your eyes.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| hedgehog50 Croydon 13 May 17 12.56pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
1. The allegro. If you make s*** cars it doesn't help. The Unions used to see the nationalised industries as something of a soft touch. They knew that the state (ie: the taxpayer) was always there to bung yet more money in to satisfy ever increasing wage demands. Similar tactics did not work with the private sector as ultimately the companies could go bankrupt (although of course the more communist leaning union leaders didn't mind that either, as losing their members' jobs was a small price to pay for furthering their revolutionary aims).
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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| matt_himself Matataland 13 May 17 1.05pm |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
The Unions used to see the nationalised industries as something of a soft touch. They knew that the state (ie: the taxpayer) was always there to bung yet more money in to satisfy ever increasing wage demands. Similar tactics did not work with the private sector as ultimately the companies could go bankrupt (although of course the more communist leaning union leaders didn't mind that either, as losing their members' jobs was a small price to pay for furthering their revolutionary aims). The union leaders lost control and the hubris spread to individual wildcat strikes over which the unions had no control. You give these people an inch and they will take a mile.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 13 May 17 1.12pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
1. The allegro. If you make s*** cars it doesn't help. Trouble is Nick the unions today are going back to the "old days" and trying it on all ways. They pay millions into the Labour party so they can dictate what they want to the likes of Corbyn. The unions got him elected twice so they can keep a firm hold on things. Unions are not a good thing in my opinion as they have the wrong people in charge who are out for themselves.
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 1.29pm |
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Down with workers rights
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 1.31pm |
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Originally posted by susmik
Trouble is Nick the unions today are going back to the "old days" and trying it on all ways. They pay millions into the Labour party so they can dictate what they want to the likes of Corbyn. The unions got him elected twice so they can keep a firm hold on things. Unions are not a good thing in my opinion as they have the wrong people in charge who are out for themselves. I thought labour party members voted in Corbyn. Still
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| susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 13 May 17 1.44pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
I thought labour party members voted in Corbyn. Still Mass voting by the unions Nick got him , plus I helped him get in with the £25 I paid as with him he will never get into power I am afraid. You need someone like David Miliband who people respect. I think he would do a job for your party I really do..Unlike Corbyn who lives in the past and in dream world in my opinion.
Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky. |
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| hedgehog50 Croydon 13 May 17 1.56pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Down with workers rights
Where does it say that in my manifesto?
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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| matt_himself Matataland 13 May 17 2.51pm |
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Originally posted by Mstrobez
Regardless of your opinion on policies, the media have consistently said "Corbyn is a man of principle, that should count for something." In my opinion, it should count for everything. For every set of politics l, left and right there is usually a fair enough argument to go against it, politics will always swing and public conceptions will always change after a certain style of policies have caused certain problems, because essentially that's all anyone ever focuses on. That's why, for me, it's refreshing to come across a politician who I genuinely believe gives a s***, who goes to bed at night thinking of ordinary British people. I own my own business and I'm more than happy to pay a little bit of extra corporation tax if it means that when someone in my family becomes ill they won't be on a 6 month waiting list to see someone who probably won't have the time or resources to help them anyway. Think it's about time people stopped voting for whoever will give them an extra couple of quid and started thinking about those who simply haven't had the rub of the green that so many take for granted! If that makes me deluded so be it, I'd have Corbyn over the Tories any day of the week. Do you really believe that chucking more money at the NHS is the answer to its problems? Do you really believe that companies won't mind paying 40% corporation tax? Corbyn and his acolytes don't go to 'bed thinking of ordinary British people'. They detest ordinary British people. Emily Thornberry and the white van. THe Islington set and its disgust of working class peoples views. Lady Shami saying she didn't want to be left in Labour with Essex men. Don't be sucked in by their populist bulls***.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| matt_himself Matataland 13 May 17 2.51pm |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
Where does it say that in my manifesto? I'd vote for you.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 13 May 17 3.00pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
The NHS IT systems run on a unique platform which is supposed to be super secure. It is very dated making it hard for any aspect of NHS IT to get an upgrade. New systems don't talk properly to the old ones. The main system needs shedloads of work and the investment doesn't seem to have been made. As I recall there have been several failed attempts Piss awful project management from within. Millions wasted. They should have brought in an external consultancy to oversee the whole thing.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 13 May 17 3.06pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
Do you really believe that chucking more money at the NHS is the answer to its problems? Do you really believe that companies won't mind paying 40% corporation tax? Corbyn and his acolytes don't go to 'bed thinking of ordinary British people'. They detest ordinary British people. Emily Thornberry and the white van. THe Islington set and its disgust of working class peoples views. Lady Shami saying she didn't want to be left in Labour with Essex men. Don't be sucked in by their populist bulls***. Where did you get the 40% corporation tax from? It's complete bulls***.
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