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The Heritage Party

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 30 May 22 12.01pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

What is true is extremely important.

But it isn't for everybody.

Those who don't actually investigate for themselves but take the words of people with political learnings and animosities will fall for misdirection. Those people essentially fear monger and call others extremists when most of the people holding the views they demonise are hardly any different to the grassroots beliefs of conservatives thirty-forty years ago.

These activists are content to look to any opportunity to disfigure, and mislead people with exaggerated conjectures that don't actually hold any substance. They make suggestions they can't prove and point at individuals and claim they represent the whole. They aren't prepared to investigate themselves to actually understand whether their words have truth to them but they are prepared to label.

Yet when Corbyn was running the Labour party there was no demonisation of everyone who voted Labour. The guy who literally took the IRA into parliament wasn't attacked called an extremist by them. Most of their political kin would have voted for him.

However, the media took the same tack they do, I disagreed with that approach to Corbyn just as I disagree with the exaggeration and lies here.

They look to frighten people away from groups that, if they actually held power, would actually change this country in ways that most conservatives would prefer. In my view that is a heavy clue to the real intent.

Instead they want you to accept the same policies that have led you to exactly what we have now. Because the sicknesses of social liberalism are also theirs. You will notice that they complain about topics but whenever any policies are suggested that would change them they are instantly out on the attack.

I find the Heritage party to be well meaning in intent. I'm not someone who attacks their own side when I probably agree with ninety percent of its message.


Edited by Stirlingsays (30 May 2022 12.08pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 30 May 22 12.14pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

To follow up on Georges enemy within point' there are those from proscribed terror groups on the right, who do their not so subtle shuffle to whatever the next group they can infiltrate or alter, are certainly enemies of both decency and rule of law.

Even Tommy Robinson, well versed in shining a light on grooming, has recently attacked those who try to hijack his message for their own means and ends, and slip in extreme racism and barely concealed neo nazi perspective acceptance into the mix. Heavily russophile takes too (the anti neo nazi propoganda is just that). There will always be these types sullying or damaging those of peaceful and fair political intent on both the left and right. They're likely actually a weird mix of extreme types and government informants designed to act where the point is reached where violence is on the cards. The same with Islamic groups that walk a fine line.

Most of those lurching towards any political extreme are essentially authoritarians when it comes down to it. They just paint themselves as anything but until they are in a position to action their beliefs. At least the groups presented here look representable enough to keep these types out, hence they are above board and groups ordinary people can get behind and indeed vote for.

Stay well meaning in perspective and politics because in that position if someone takes issue with you, sod them. That applies to left and right. Be careful who you lend time and do your own homework with full and honest appraisals of groups people try to push. As I say, the ones here seem perfectly above board to me. I defend any party and leadship that 'legitimately' respects and represents benign beliefs and behaviour. That's democracy. It becomes more an issue of whether single issue or 'manifesto' is the way to go. Under the current system, single issue parties may be best positioned to make change.


Edited by BlueJay (30 May 2022 12.33pm)

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 30 May 22 12.16pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Fortunately I neither sweat nor smell. Due to the trauma I suffered in the jungles of Borneo.

. Have a pizza, that's see you right.

 

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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 30 May 22 12.31pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

What is true is extremely important.

Of course, it is. Unfortunately, though, what seems "true" for one person isn't for another. Perceptions matter. Context matters. Declaring anything to be "true" is often a statement of personal bias.

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I find the Heritage party to be well meaning in intent.

It would be far truer to say, "I find the Heritage party's words to appear to be well-meaning in intent."

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 30 May 22 12.37pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Of course, it is. Unfortunately, though, what seems "true" for one person isn't for another. Perceptions matter. Context matters. Declaring anything to be "true" is often a statement of personal bias.

There is a philosophical truth to this.

However, I was talking in the generally accepted meaning of the term.


Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

It would be far truer to say, "I find the Heritage party's words to appear to be well-meaning in intent."

Double quotes are American usage, single quotes are the English form.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 30 May 22 12.39pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle


Of course, it is. Unfortunately, though, what seems "true" for one person isn't for another. Perceptions matter. Context matters. Declaring anything to be "true" is often a statement of personal bias.

Precisely that. Some haven't found themselves at the pathetic political dead ends they have due to 'truth'. They're there due to scarred up emotional issues plastered over by the comfort of people saying what they want to hear. Sometimes truth extents beyond 'what benefits, comforts or agrees with me'. From dim web types to the twitter hysteria crowd, these types would do well to realise that. A framework that works for most, but is ideal for few is usually the unfortunate boring reality of what works for society. Any political movement that truly catches on and makes an impact has to be a broad church.

Edited by BlueJay (30 May 2022 12.42pm)

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 30 May 22 1.01pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

There are no 'enemies within' on the right, just what are they going to do exactly George?

You seem to spend most of your time attacking the right.

Fascism? You seem to think fascism just means authoritarianism.

Edited by Stirlingsays (30 May 2022 11.15am)

If you look at all my posts, you will see that I attack left, right and centre if I think they are in the wrong.
Supporters of Russia's aggresssion are in the wrong and what they are doing is undermining attempts to resist Russia.
I think I can recognise fascism when it is staring me in the face.

Edited by georgenorman (30 May 2022 1.01pm)

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 30 May 22 1.03pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by georgenorman

If you look at all my posts, you will see that I attack left, right and centre if I think they are in the wrong.
Supporters of Russia's aggresssion are in the wrong and what thaey are doing is undermining attempts to resist Russia.
I think I can recognise fascism when it is staring me in the face.

Credit to you. At least you have no issues with thinking for yourself and aren't a ticked box for this outlook or that. Not everyone is clambering for the 'package deal'.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 30 May 22 1.10pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by georgenorman

If you look at all my posts, you will see that I attack left, right and centre if I think they are in the wrong.
Supporters of Russia's aggresssion are in the wrong and what they are doing is undermining attempts to resist Russia.
I think I can recognise fascism when it is staring me in the face.

Edited by georgenorman (30 May 2022 1.01pm)

Well, I remember you being quite conservative when you started posting but recently you only appear to have it in for conservatives. Forgive me if this impression is wrong.

Anyway do you really think posts on Hol are undermining attempts to resist Russia?

Surely you don't seriously think that the views posted here just haven't been thought within media or levels of government but instead somehow require posts on football forums....come on George, I can understand you disagreeing but this isn't that big a deal.

Surely you aren't saying that views countering the current narrative shouldn't be aired? That would be very similar to Wisbech's view of how people should just fall in line with the establishment and I'm sure that isn't your intent.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 30 May 22 1.44pm Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Anyway do you really think posts on Hol are undermining attempts to resist Russia?


I like to think, in a way that is indisputably egotistical to a significant degree, that my posts might encourage people to explore beyond the conventional narrative.

I refuse to think of Russia as an 'enemy' of the UK. I see Putin as a politician who speaks a lot more frankly, and in line with many of my own views on all sorts, than many leading UK politicians but this idea that Russia is somehow an 'enemy' of the UK is beyond ludicrous.


 


In 1967, when Polish mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life, replied: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 30 May 22 1.46pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Well, I remember you being quite conservative when you started posting but recently you only appear to have it in for conservatives. Forgive me if this impression is wrong.

Anyway do you really think posts on Hol are undermining attempts to resist Russia?

Surely you don't seriously think that the views posted here just haven't been thought within media or levels of government but instead somehow require posts on football forums....come on George, I can understand you disagreeing but this isn't that big a deal.

Surely you aren't saying that views countering the current narrative shouldn't be aired? That would be very similar to Wisbech's view of how people should just fall in line with the establishment and I'm sure that isn't your intent.

HOL posts in isolation are of course not able to undermine attempts to resist Russia, but they are a part of a wider pro-Russia apologist attitude that seeks to excuse them and somehow blame the Ukrainians and NATO and the West in general. People of both the Left and the Right are engaged in this and are as bad as each other.
Of course people can air their misguided views as much as they want, as can I criticise them for it.

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag Chatham 30 May 22 1.46pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

I reckon they should get Eddie Murphy and Dan Akroyd involved.
Some will some won’t

 

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