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October 2 2022 6.09pm

9 year old girl shot and killed in Liverpool

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View kennybrowns leftfoot's Profile kennybrowns leftfoot Flag Reigate 27 Aug 22 7.13pm Send a Private Message to kennybrowns leftfoot Add kennybrowns leftfoot as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Policing should be seen.

It's not rocket science, you need a bloke or two in rough areas, who looks like he can handle himself walking a beat.

But the snowflakes turned Policing into an admin job that's more concerned about dancing with the 'oppressed' than it is dealing with real crime.

They also haven't kept their numbers up to anything that what would be realistically required.

Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Aug 2022 1.30am)

Stirling this is the best comment I've read!! When I joined in 2000 we still had homebeat officers. Generally they were old school coppers with a presence but most importantly they knew their beat and patch and knew everything that went on.

They were worth their weight in gold when it came to keeping a lid on things. I saw the homebeat officer removed over time. Coppers now have no idea who is doing what in what area. When I joined I was posted to New Addington on Croydon Borough.
I was quickly taught who to look out for and what they were doing. We kept a lid on things.
We policed a certain way and yes maybe we stretched the rules at times but it was for the greater good if that makes sense!!

We were a proactive Police Force back then and nipped things in the bud before they got out of control.

The Police are a completely reactive force and the attitude is 'let things happen and deal with it later'... I could see this happening in my last 5 years or so and it was so sad to see.
I was so glad to get out in the end and I've not missed it one bit... Genuinely not once!!

They don't want coppers like me anymore and as much as certain things have improved over the years I would take 80, 90s style Policing over what we have today in a heartbeat.

 


Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

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View kennybrowns leftfoot's Profile kennybrowns leftfoot Flag Reigate 27 Aug 22 7.16pm Send a Private Message to kennybrowns leftfoot Add kennybrowns leftfoot as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

I don't know the law but to me it is not just intent it is about consequences. Blindly firing into a house you may not intend to kill a 9yo but surely the consequences of such an irresponsible action are foreseeable and therefore murder. Anyway that is a commonsense view so probably wrong in the legal sense.

No you're right in what you've said. He went out with the intent to murder. The fact he didn't murder who he meant to is kind of irrelevant. His recklessness in how he acted still caused someone's death so is therefore murder. Although of course the defence will challenge that theory.

 


Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

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View eagleman13's Profile eagleman13 Flag On The Road To Hell & Alicante 27 Aug 22 7.53pm Send a Private Message to eagleman13 Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add eagleman13 as a friend

Originally posted by kennybrowns leftfoot

Stirling this is the best comment I've read!! When I joined in 2000 we still had homebeat officers. Generally they were old school coppers with a presence but most importantly they knew their beat and patch and knew everything that went on.

They were worth their weight in gold when it came to keeping a lid on things. I saw the homebeat officer removed over time. Coppers now have no idea who is doing what in what area. When I joined I was posted to New Addington on Croydon Borough.
I was quickly taught who to look out for and what they were doing. We kept a lid on things.
We policed a certain way and yes maybe we stretched the rules at times but it was for the greater good if that makes sense!!

We were a proactive Police Force back then and nipped things in the bud before they got out of control.

The Police are a completely reactive force and the attitude is 'let things happen and deal with it later'... I could see this happening in my last 5 years or so and it was so sad to see.
I was so glad to get out in the end and I've not missed it one bit... Genuinely not once!!

They don't want coppers like me anymore and as much as certain things have improved over the years I would take 80, 90s style Policing over what we have today in a heartbeat.

KB, this a sad indictment of where things are now, I, for one, had my collar & ear felt by a Bobby doing his job & we had RESPECT for them. The feral rats have NO respect for anyone or thing & if you so much as lay a hand on them, cry foul, snowflake & use the law to THEIR advantage, coz the Police are soft & as culpable as the justice system is. Sad, glad I don't live in UK anymore, that in its self is just as sad.

 


The Child Has Grown,
The Dream Is Gone, And,
I Have Become,
Comfortably Numb. . . .
[Link]

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View kennybrowns leftfoot's Profile kennybrowns leftfoot Flag Reigate 27 Aug 22 8.09pm Send a Private Message to kennybrowns leftfoot Add kennybrowns leftfoot as a friend

Originally posted by eagleman13

KB, this a sad indictment of where things are now, I, for one, had my collar & ear felt by a Bobby doing his job & we had RESPECT for them. The feral rats have NO respect for anyone or thing & if you so much as lay a hand on them, cry foul, snowflake & use the law to THEIR advantage, coz the Police are soft & as culpable as the justice system is. Sad, glad I don't live in UK anymore, that in its self is just as sad.

Yes you're absolutely right. I've always said the public must decide what they want from their Police Force... Do they want them to be Police officers, mental health workers, marriage guidance counsellors, teachers, locksmiths, social workers and whatever else??

Because that is impossible. Me personally I want them to keep law and order, solve crime and most importantly actively prevent crimes... And when the wheel comes off and there are riots on the streets I want my Police to be steaming in, cracking heads if necessary and taking the streets back.

Sometimes what our Police do can be viewed as unfair, over the top etc but at the same time I've always said that if you're a law abiding citizen then generally you won't come into contact with the Old Bill.

It's very sad to see what it's become really.

 


Don't waste your time with jealousy. Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind, the race is long. But in the end it's only with yourself!!

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View HKOwen's Profile HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 28 Aug 22 7.01am Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

If the stats on prosecution and conviction rates are anywhere near correct then there is no deterrent if the chances of being caught and convicted for serious crime are less than 5%.

So many stories where expensive property has been stolen and traced by the owner because of technology and the police, we are told, will not take any action.

KB, do you think this is the current state of affairs or just a few unsubstantiated stories.

Edited by HKOwen (28 Aug 2022 7.04am)

 


When the veneer of civility cracks and the abuse starts....sit back, smile and enjoy a point at Anfield

He reaching for the pocket....and it's a long overdue yellow

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 28 Aug 22 8.12am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by HKOwen

If the stats on prosecution and conviction rates are anywhere near correct then there is no deterrent if the chances of being caught and convicted for serious crime are less than 5%.

So many stories where expensive property has been stolen and traced by the owner because of technology and the police, we are told, will not take any action.

KB, do you think this is the current state of affairs or just a few unsubstantiated stories.

Edited by HKOwen (28 Aug 2022 7.04am)

A friend has a very nice house in Bromley (he's rich) one night there was a knock on the door and 2 masked men armed with guns pushed their way in and robbed them. You would think the police would be interested as it involved guns but apparently not.

Perhaps they should have told the police they were offended by a remark one of the men said on social media.

 


One more point

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Flag 28 Aug 22 8.44am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

Hi YT -
Mostly ranting - looking at your example of the NHS - (& I haven't gone looking for any statistics to support or discredit my original statement) I would have said that the population of the country probably rose quite considerably between 1960 & the modern day so an increase in staff was probably on the cards - as for the increase in GDP, the cost of introduction of the IT age & modern technology & its capability (air ambulances as just an example plucked out of the sky - no pun intended) would for sure increase the overall costs involved in the NHS - if I was being brutally honest my statement revolved more about the Media reporting of what was happening in the NHS- I was 20 in 1980 so by then & going forwards able to understand what was on the news & take some interest, whenever there were reports on the NHS it wasnt good news, regularly there were reports of NHS cuts, streamlining, facilities being closed etc - very few reports of new hospitals being opened, sizeable investments, improved patient care etc etc & on the occasions that I had to visit hospitals it seemed that the wards were always busier with fewer staff, doctors always seemed to have less time, waiting lists seemed to get longer - so without any strong statistical evidence to support it these experience's formed my views -

I dare say that anyone who has worked in the NHS or has spent a decent amount of time involved with it can probably produce a few pages of statistics to either illustrate that we have never had it so good or that its going down the toilet so I will leave that to anyone who wants to wade in -

As I say, it was just my general perception based on life experience growing up & the media reporting that I was exposed to.


Originally posted by YT

Are you sure of your facts there, or are you merely ranting? Taking the NHS as an example, in 1960 it employed just over 500,000 people. It now employs three times that number. Expenditure on the NHS was 5.1% of GDP in 1980 and was 11.9% of GDP in 2021.

 

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View ASCPFC's Profile ASCPFC Flag Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 28 Aug 22 2.30pm Send a Private Message to ASCPFC Add ASCPFC as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

I don't know the law but to me it is not just intent it is about consequences. Blindly firing into a house you may not intend to kill a 9yo but surely the consequences of such an irresponsible action are foreseeable and therefore murder. Anyway that is a commonsense view so probably wrong in the legal sense.

No doubt, this will be the central aspect of the case.

 


Patrick Vieira's
Red and Blue Army!

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag The garden of England 28 Aug 22 2.47pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

If they can pin TR as a terrorist or whatever then I’m sure these scum will get a long sentence. The law can work when it ‘wants’ to. !

 

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View YT's Profile YT Flag Oxford 29 Aug 22 8.18am Send a Private Message to YT Add YT as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle


Leaving aside the typical YT opening jibe the definition of murder is "the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another" and the prosecution will fall apart because he didn't premeditate killing the little girl at all


Says the expert in making jibes.

 


Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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View HKOwen's Profile HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 30 Aug 22 1.59am Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

and still no arrest, oh these cheeky happy-go-lucky scousers

 


When the veneer of civility cracks and the abuse starts....sit back, smile and enjoy a point at Anfield

He reaching for the pocket....and it's a long overdue yellow

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View HKOwen's Profile HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 30 Aug 22 2.01am Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

Originally posted by kennybrowns leftfoot

No you're right in what you've said. He went out with the intent to murder. The fact he didn't murder who he meant to is kind of irrelevant. His recklessness in how he acted still caused someone's death so is therefore murder. Although of course the defence will challenge that theory.

[Link]


Current CPS guidance, per this it would be a murder charge

 


When the veneer of civility cracks and the abuse starts....sit back, smile and enjoy a point at Anfield

He reaching for the pocket....and it's a long overdue yellow

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