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Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 31 May 18 8.25pm | |
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Originally posted by Rudi Hedman
I get the feeling a fair few of them will be in the main stand where they’re moaning about the price increase because of the refurbishments that are to benefit the club. I know of plenty of fans who took long-term STs in the Lower Holmesdale. They took from the club at another low point, then tried to take a moral high-ground of how they were trying to save the club.
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Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 31 May 18 8.27pm | |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
As I said I was on the ground to see a lot that went on you clearly was not and appear to look at few documents online and think you know it. Football league was corrupt on such a large scale and had it in for SJ because he said it how it is and didn't put up with there s**t. I think again you forget there was hardly any money for teams below Prem so all clubs would be losing money and the losses went on to SJ he was covering them. So you think the squad was not worth 24m rubbish people like Mosses could of gone for 5m+ and in fact they was about to be offered that before this stuff happened which resulted in him going for under 2m yeah great work from the Admin their next up was Clyne he went for peanuts. I see you not even bring up how the Hero fund screwed us over and they appeared to be in bed with Agilo as well plus the wage delays was because of hmr You claim the bank was not offering any support this is false again the bank was involved for the whole process before Agilo filed trying to offer them a deal but they wasn't interest other wise why wouldn't bank say enough is enough. HMRC was the reason for the wages being delayed again you do not mention this just like many things you are missing big chunks out almost like you have been reading a newspaper report. Grammar, spelling and punctuation (as well as a grasp of the English language) would greatly enhance your stance.
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robdave2k 31 May 18 8.34pm | |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
Edited by grumpymort (31 May 2018 8.27pm)
I'll draw this out in little words you can understand. WE WERE LOSING MONEY. THE ACCOUNTS BACKED THIS UP. HMRC WERE NOT BEING PAID ON TIME THE CLUB WAS BREACHING THE OVERDRAFT AGILO WANTED THEIR MONEY RIGHT OR WRONG SJ CLEARLY WAS NOT COVERING THE DEBTS AS HE COULD HAVE PAID AGILO OFF IF HE HAD THE CASH. However I think you have done more to highlight yourself as a complete simpleton than I or anyone else could ever hope to achieve. Now run along with your crayons, there's a good boy.
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ronbow Corby 31 May 18 8.52pm | |
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I'm enjoying this. Robdave2k clearly ahead on points and has just put his opponent on the canvas.
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grumpymort US/Thailand/UK 31 May 18 9.14pm | |
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Originally posted by robdave2k
I'll draw this out in little words you can understand. WE WERE LOSING MONEY. THE ACCOUNTS BACKED THIS UP. HMRC WERE NOT BEING PAID ON TIME THE CLUB WAS BREACHING THE OVERDRAFT AGILO WANTED THEIR MONEY RIGHT OR WRONG SJ CLEARLY WAS NOT COVERING THE DEBTS AS HE COULD HAVE PAID AGILO OFF IF HE HAD THE CASH. However I think you have done more to highlight yourself as a complete simpleton than I or anyone else could ever hope to achieve. Now run along with your crayons, there's a good boy. Looks like it has touched a nerve. Report the facts stop trying to leave full story out and pitch it only your way which isn't the truth. Yes there was money being lost this is standard go and have a look back then at all the books for the clubs in leagues below Prem its how they had to operate there was no fancy tv deal money and SP had to do the samething but you leave that out how covenant. HMRC was not you are correct but they did get paid which Agilo didn't like. What overdraft? almost all the debt was to SJ he had covered the club. Agilo suddenly changed the terms and switched which as stated SP was doing dirty things in the background people have even said he wanted Agilo to force Administration knowing full well SJ couldn't pay all that amount straight away. What about Hero fund? this would of cleared it and the deal was agreed but then they disappear and suddenly Agilo are threatening also both operating from same building. For some one who is claimed to work with money you do not appear to understand assets you expect people to just easily go and get 4m+ straight away no doesn't work like that. The same case would be if you now went to Manchester united and said well that 500m+ debt you have you will pay that back now in one large sum they wouldn't be able to do that. You have missed so many points another SP was around before the club went into Administration he was trying to cut deals and get inside info so he could of easily cleared that 4 million yet he wanted to play games. Last thing why was it none of the big companies wanted anything to do with administration even before it was filled when you are claiming it was so bad there with so much money lost then they would be jumping at the chance to handle it. Simple answer it shouldn't of ever happened it was under control and as pointed out dirty stuff going on in the background with parties including SP, Alexander Edited by grumpymort (31 May 2018 9.17pm)
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robdave2k 31 May 18 9.29pm | |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
Looks like it has touched a nerve. Report the facts stop trying to leave full story out and pitch it only your way which isn't the truth. Yes there was money being lost this is standard go and have a look back then at all the books for the clubs in leagues below Prem its how they had to operate there was no fancy tv deal money and SP had to do the samething but you leave that out how covenant. HMRC was not you are correct but they did get paid which Agilo didn't like. What overdraft? almost all the debt was to SJ he had covered the club. Agilo suddenly changed the terms and switched which as stated SP was doing dirty things in the background people have even said he wanted Agilo to force Administration knowing full well SJ couldn't pay all that amount straight away. What about Hero fund? this would of cleared it and the deal was agreed but then they disappear and suddenly Agilo are threatening also both operating from same building. For some one who is claimed to work with money you do not appear to understand assets you expect people to just easily go and get 4m+ straight away no doesn't work like that. The same case would be if you now went to Manchester united and said well that 500m+ debt you have you will pay that back now in one large sum they wouldn't be able to do that. You have missed so many points another SP was around before the club went into Administration he was trying to cut deals and get inside info so he could of easily cleared that 4 million yet he wanted to play games. Last thing why was it none of the big companies wanted anything to do with administration even before it was filled when you are claiming it was so bad there with so much money lost then they would be jumping at the chance to handle it. Simple answer it shouldn't of ever happened it was under control and as pointed out dirty stuff going on in the background with parties including SP, Alexander Edited by grumpymort (31 May 2018 9.17pm)
So I'll just cover one simple point. AGILO demanded their £4m and CPFC/SJ couldn't pay. That is the definition of insolvent. Being unable to pay your debts when they fall due. Unlike longer term debts, this was by its nature high risk finance. The balance sheet was overdrawn as well. Like the overdraft it can be called in on demand. If it was all under control AGILO wouldn't have been there. Oh and yes I did read a paper as in amongst other things. It's 317 pages long, on Companies House as a matter of public record and submitted to the DTI. You're whole argument contradicts itself - it's either a small sum of money in which case it should have been manageable, or it's a large sum which is unfair to expect people to have. If you buy a house using payday loans, don't complain if the payday loan company wants their money and couldn't give a crap about your assets. Then imagine that house is already mortgaged. CPFC in 2010 was buggered. It fell over. And no nerve hit. Too busy with my tongue up SP's backside.
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ronbow Corby 31 May 18 9.43pm | |
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Grumpymort I may be a bit biased (there's a clue in my credentials if you look very very carefully) but I know a coherent argument when I hear one and in this respect you need to up your game. One way in which you could do this is by using some elementary punctuation and grammar. I know you will think this is a petty remark but as it stands your posts amount to little more than ramblings. That said they would still be wrong!
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grumpymort US/Thailand/UK 31 May 18 10.03pm | |
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Originally posted by robdave2k
So I'll just cover one simple point. AGILO demanded their £4m and CPFC/SJ couldn't pay. That is the definition of insolvent. Being unable to pay your debts when they fall due. Unlike longer term debts, this was by its nature high risk finance. The balance sheet was overdrawn as well. Like the overdraft it can be called in on demand. If it was all under control AGILO wouldn't have been there. Oh and yes I did read a paper as in amongst other things. It's 317 pages long, on Companies House as a matter of public record and submitted to the DTI. You're whole argument contradicts itself - it's either a small sum of money in which case it should have been manageable, or it's a large sum which is unfair to expect people to have. If you buy a house using payday loans, don't complain if the payday loan company wants their money and couldn't give a crap about your assets. Then imagine that house is already mortgaged. CPFC in 2010 was buggered. It fell over. And no nerve hit. Too busy with my tongue up SP's backside.
Notice how I will use peoples names you always side step because you wasn't around at that time so you know jack s**t about any of it as I had stated before looking at some documents on internet thinking your the king those documents do not tell the full story.
You cant buy a house with payday loan so that is just plain up stupid to even suggest that. All your replies are selected i stated many things and simple one was when you attacked the money loss every year yet parish did the same you blanked that no mention of it.
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robdave2k 31 May 18 10.13pm | |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
Notice how I will use peoples names you always side step because you wasn't around at that time so you know jack s**t about any of it as I had stated before looking at some documents on internet thinking your the king those documents do not tell the full story.
You cant buy a house with payday loan so that is just plain up stupid to even suggest that. All your replies are selected i stated many things and simple one was when you attacked the money loss every year yet parish did the same you blanked that no mention of it.
I'll tell you what, let's let everyone judge based on what's written. On one hand there is a coherent, logical, puntuated piece. And on the other there is someone who started out by suggesting that I want to do things with Steve Parish. Might I suggest you read up on Insolvency and Tort Law. There is no way CPFC wasn't insolvent. I'm happy to state my credentials - I'm chartered accountant with 20+ years experience. I've done work with P&A and latterly Begbies Traynor who took them over. I've worked with Hedge Funds, mezzanine Finance, short term funding and purchase of assets from a liquidator. I've also worked on football club accounts. Feel free to state yours. Of course this could all be a conspiracy and you are correct. On the other hand it could be you are just woefully out of your depth.
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rikz Croydon 31 May 18 10.34pm | |
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So basically a great example of how capitalism has served us well. One business failing and another taking over and far surpassing the previous one. What's the problem ?
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grumpymort US/Thailand/UK 31 May 18 10.34pm | |
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Originally posted by robdave2k
I'll tell you what, let's let everyone judge based on what's written. On one hand there is a coherent, logical, puntuated piece. And on the other there is someone who started out by suggesting that I want to do things with Steve Parish. Might I suggest you read up on Insolvency and Tort Law. There is no way CPFC wasn't insolvent. I'm happy to state my credentials - I'm chartered accountant with 20+ years experience. I've done work with P&A and latterly Begbies Traynor who took them over. I've worked with Hedge Funds, mezzanine Finance, short term funding and purchase of assets from a liquidator. I've also worked on football club accounts. Feel free to state yours. Of course this could all be a conspiracy and you are correct. On the other hand it could be you are just woefully out of your depth.
The club should of never been in administration. I didn't suggest you do those things with Parish I said you did them it wouldn't surprise me if you have ties with him which is why you keep trying to repeat same stuff over again. You mention about myself brushing up on insolvency maybe you need to SJ would of had that 4m as stated many times you cant just say i want that all now yes you can say you want it all but you need to set a realistic time frame for it to be raised which there was going to be incoming money to cover it.
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robdave2k 31 May 18 10.46pm | |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
The club should of never been in administration. I didn't suggest you do those things with Parish I said you did them it wouldn't surprise me if you have ties with him which is why you keep trying to repeat same stuff over again. You mention about myself brushing up on insolvency maybe you need to SJ would of had that 4m as stated many times you cant just say i want that all now yes you can say you want it all but you need to set a realistic time frame for it to be raised which there was going to be incoming money to cover it. Right let's simplify this even further. I have no tie to SP. SJ borrowed money from a fund that lends to people who can't get credit. He signed the debenture. He agreed to the terms. They called it in, he couldn't pay. That's insolvent. He signed the terms and it was legally enforceable. Read the statement of affairs. That will highlight the issues. The season ticket money in advance was used to prop up the club. It's selling something in three years in advance to pay something for last year. He had the timeframe and shouldn't have borrowed from them. Don't shoot a wolf for being a wolf. b******s yes. Legal, yes. "Never go to court on a point of principle, go on a point of law. Points of principles are expensive" You know who said that? Simon Jordan.
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