I'd tend to disagree that nationalism and racism are subjective terms. There might well be an attempt to paint them as such by L/R in the current discourse but they're both easily definable by rational individuals.

Also as outlined above just because you're nationalist and racist doesn't make you a facist. If you believe in those things to extremes and support or act out violence in their name, then sure, that's the final piece of the facist puzzle.

There are no doubt individuals or factions within most groups that are facist by definition, whether that's Antifa, EDL, BDP, The New Red Brigades, Hammas...

As for Newquay, as a group they might not be, but who knows, there may be some individuals that could be tagged as such. Just like on this site.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

I'm not happy with what's happened here and what the direction of travel is. I'm just going to stop using the site as I can't be bothered with going through this again.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Sounds like Just Stop Oil.

I see that Durham University has recently discovered the Universe's largest Black Hole, 30 billions time the size of our Sun - perhaps they should call it Wisbech.

On the first point
To reiterate, I just don't agree with the view that the definitions of racism and nationalism are subjective. If your viewpoint is that those definitions are incorrect based on personal beliefs and feelings, then that is irrational, yes.

Maybe they are if you're looking through an ideological lens – people twist the definitions all the time on both sides of the debate. eg. the left crying racism at every opportunity and the right constantly denying any mention of it. That's applied subjectivity to definitions that aren't subjective. Much like making a statement that 'not all nationalists are racists.' But that doesn't mean that no nationalists are racists. Similarly facism is rather obviously not exclusive to the right. It's pretty obvious when something or someone is definably racist, for example, as the action or statements will neatly match the definitions.

It only becomes subjective when, for example, someone who holds definable views (such as racism or nationalism for the sake of continuity) chooses not to be open about it. In that scenario you couldn't definitively say they were or were not, but you could hypothesise that they were based on those views being carefully leaked into conversation without going over the line. Dangerous game on both sides though, the accuser and the accused.

The second point
As above, I don't think you could say anyone definitively is a facist on here as unless there's a smoking gun post. Maybe the closest I've seen is the 'give the migrant a good kicking' one from a while back, and there's certainly been plenty of views posted that skirt close to the line/arouse suspicion but even then that's not enough. Implied, but not definitive. No pointing fingers without definitive proof. It's also defamatory.

What one can do, though, is debate and give people a chance to respond accordingly. Otherwise the failure to do that makes those responsible start to look like the facist.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

Disagree.

I'll repeat the statement again and highlight the key words for you.

'There are no doubt individuals or factions within most groups that are facist by definition, whether that's Antifa, EDL, BDP, The New Red Brigades, Hammas...As for Newquay, as a group they might not be, but who knows, there may be some individuals that could be tagged as such. Just like on this site.'

It's absolutely what I meant, and I don't think it's particularly controversial to extend the wider point to this site. It would be controversial and defamatory (not to mention highly personal and unnecessary) to start naming names or pointing fingers without definative evidence. As before, it would be unhelpful and defamatory.

As I said, the closest I've seen is the 'kicking a migrant' post. It's also only tailoring evidence if it's aimed at someone. Neither of which apply here, as per my post that was clearly including a wide range of groups as examples and making the rather obvious point that if you get a large enough group of people, of which I'd suggest this site is one such group, there's going to be a few facists in there somewhere.

Ironically through your responses you are in fact the one inadvertently narrowing it down.

Care to reply to my response re. definitions? Or are you going to 'wriggle' your way out of that one via elaborate jazz handing.

Edited by SW19 CPFC (29 Mar 2023 6.52pm)

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.