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The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)


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Invalid user 2019 Flag 24 Oct 19 4.09pm

Despite the endless can kicking I think we're on course for a December or January GE now. I can see the Conservatives gaining a majority based on both polls, and the Labour and Lib Dem vote split. It could be argued that the Conservatives vote will be split too of course, but plenty of Brexit party voter will hold their noses for the sake of getting Brexit in one form or another over the line.

 

the silurian Flag The garden of England.(not really) 24 Oct 19 4.13pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Are you confusing Wissy with normal people?

apparently I was, sorry!!

 

the silurian Flag The garden of England.(not really) 24 Oct 19 4.16pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

You can decide on whatever basis you like. That's your choice and your right. What you get though is an individual MP and not a lobby sheep, so your impression is wrong.

I understand the argument that those who think if MPs change parties they ought to resign and that it is a widely held opinion. My view, which is I think shared by most MPs, is if it ever became mandatory, or even habitual, for an MP to do so then the whole basis of our Parliamentary democracy would change. Every MP would then be totally controlled by their party and it would relegate their roles to being mere functionaries. It would mean the party outside of Parliament dictating what the MPs must do. We want our MPs deciding.

You might want the party in control but think of the future. Imagine a Labour government controlled by a Labour Party taken over by Marxists.

you would say black was white if I or anyone who doesnt agree with your bizzare views said something was black....

 

Maine Eagle Flag USA 24 Oct 19 4.20pm

Originally posted by mezzer

You say they lied more, so that's a majority of lies. Not 50/50? Or do majorities only count when they suit your argument?

Yes 50/50 is not a majority.

I learnt that early on in school.

Not sure I get your point here.

I admitted remain lied. Both sides lied.

Ergo, the previous referendum was built on a pack of lies.

Many of those lies have been debunked.

Ergo, have a new vote.

 


Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha.

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 24 Oct 19 4.58pm

Originally posted by the silurian

you would say black was white if I or anyone who doesnt agree with your bizzare views said something was black....

That's just silly.

Many people I know agree with me, although often not until they really think about it. The intuitive response is to think that an MP changing party should resign but if you look beyond the obvious then the impact of our Parliamentary democracy begins to change minds. There is nothing bizzare in seeking to protect our system, flawed as it is, from something far worse.

The only thing black and white here is the inflexible views held by the ultra leavers who populate this site. Totally set in their ways, and impervious to reason, once they have had their first thought then that's it. It's their last thought too.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Midlands Eagle Flag 24 Oct 19 5.17pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

The only thing black and white here is the inflexible views held by the ultra leavers who populate this site. Totally set in their ways, and impervious to reason, once they have had their first thought then that's it. It's their last thought too.

Here we go again with yet more subtle insults

 

Eaglecoops Flag CR3 24 Oct 19 5.57pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Here we go again with yet more subtle insults

Also, what the hell has having a genuine belief that leaving is the correct course of action got to do with inflexibility?

It is of course because Wisbech cannot accept that he might just be wrong and therefore anyone who doesn’t agree with him is inflexible.

I respect his views but he should in turn respect others.

 

the silurian Flag The garden of England.(not really) 24 Oct 19 6.11pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

That's just silly.

Many people I know agree with me
, although often not until they really think about it. The intuitive response is to think that an MP changing party should resign but if you look beyond the obvious then the impact of our Parliamentary democracy begins to change minds. There is nothing bizzare in seeking to protect our system, flawed as it is, from something far worse.

The only thing black and white here is the inflexible views held by the ultra leavers who populate this site. Totally set in their ways, and impervious to reason, once they have had their first thought then that's it. It's their last thought too.

cant help yourself can you, every post an insult appears!
Just as many disagree with you, totally set in your ways impervious to reason
As I said before, I have more to lose from Brexit than most on here, BUT the vote was leave so I have to accept that...

Edited by the silurian (24 Oct 2019 6.14pm)

Edited by the silurian (24 Oct 2019 6.15pm)

 

Badger11 Flag Beckenham 24 Oct 19 6.28pm

Boris offers Labour more time to debate the bill and get it passed before a GE on Dec 12.

Let's see what excuses Corbyn comes up to avoid voting for the deal and or a GE.

 


One more point

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 24 Oct 19 6.29pm

Originally posted by Maine Eagle

Yes 50/50 is not a majority.

I learnt that early on in school.

Not sure I get your point here.

I admitted remain lied. Both sides lied.

Ergo, the previous referendum was built on a pack of lies.

Many of those lies have been debunked.

Ergo, have a new vote.

What utterly loopy logic.

The same liars would be in charge of a second campaign and most of the scaremongering nonsense came from and still keeps on coming from Remain.

 

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards robdave2k Flag 24 Oct 19 7.07pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

That's just silly.

Many people I know agree with me, although often not until they really think about it. The intuitive response is to think that an MP changing party should resign but if you look beyond the obvious then the impact of our Parliamentary democracy begins to change minds. There is nothing bizzare in seeking to protect our system, flawed as it is, from something far worse.

The only thing black and white here is the inflexible views held by the ultra leavers who populate this site. Totally set in their ways, and impervious to reason, once they have had their first thought then that's it. It's their last thought too.


Without a hint of irony too.

Impressive.

 

jeeagles Flag 24 Oct 19 7.10pm

Back to defecting MP’s.

Whilst they probably should resign and stand for a bi election I’m not convinced this is something the party they defected from would generally want.

Bi elections are expensive and high profile compared to a campaign to win a single constituency in a general election.

Defecting MPs are embarrassing for the party the leave and probably highlight major flaws in policy. The party they are defecting from is likely to want the event to have as lower profile as possible. They’ll play lip service to saying the MP should resign, but in reality, they’ll just want to move on from a bad news day with as little fuss as possible.

If the MP then doesn’t right, they can use it to take the high ground in the next GE. Play the long game.

 

jeeagles Flag 24 Oct 19 7.14pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

What utterly loopy logic.

The same liars would be in charge of a second campaign and most of the scaremongering nonsense came from and still keeps on coming from Remain.

Do you really think a second vote will win for remain? Go back to the first two posts on this thread. There have not been 200,000 job losses, house prices have slowed. Wages are up.

Plus Germany are in recession, the EU are in denial, the only thing keeping them together is brexit and they have done nothing since the referendum to make reform or make people want to stay.

 

steeleye20 Flag Croydon 24 Oct 19 7.39pm

Originally posted by Badger11

Boris offers Labour more time to debate the bill and get it passed before a GE on Dec 12.

Let's see what excuses Corbyn comes up to avoid voting for the deal and or a GE.

Napoleon is kicking up so we will have to wait and see on the extension.

Johnson giving more time is a power he does not possess, parliament will take as long as they need.

Corbyn is entirely consistent that with 'no deal' still possible there will be no election.

That may include the hidden 'no deal' exits in the withdrawal bill itself.

The tories Fixed Parliament Act is coming back to bite them, like it.

How does Johnsons proroguing of parliament look now that he is out of time .....

 

Badger11 Flag Beckenham 24 Oct 19 8.25pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Napoleon is kicking up so we will have to wait and see on the extension.

Johnson giving more time is a power he does not possess, parliament will take as long as they need.

Corbyn is entirely consistent that with 'no deal' still possible there will be no election.

That may include the hidden 'no deal' exits in the withdrawal bill itself.

The tories Fixed Parliament Act is coming back to bite them, like it.

How does Johnsons proroguing of parliament look now that he is out of time .....

Actually that was a requirement from the Lib Dems to join Cameron in government but yes it has come back to haunt us all. I would like to see it gone but would prefer a bit more thought before they do so.

 


One more point

chris123 Flag hove actually 24 Oct 19 8.38pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Well, little choice when you are bounced like that.

Abstention is ok, the government still doesn't get your vote.

He will have not seen the legal text, but the governments information, that will have shown that workers rights had been omitted.

Deep in Michael Foot country according to Radio 4 yesterday morning.

 

chris123 Flag hove actually 24 Oct 19 8.50pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Also, what the hell has having a genuine belief that leaving is the correct course of action got to do with inflexibility?

It is of course because Wisbech cannot accept that he might just be wrong and therefore anyone who doesn’t agree with him is inflexible.

I respect his views but he should in turn respect others.

A lot of remainers want to know how we'll be better off by leaving. For a lot of leavers, like me, it's the increased, post Maastrict, federalism. Only the question was binary.

 

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 24 Oct 19 8.51pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Here we go again with yet more subtle insults

It seems you are once again confusing observations with insults. You are, of course, free to disagree with those observations but if you really want to see some insults try reading some of the things directed at me.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

martin2412 Flag Living The Dream 24 Oct 19 9.04pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

As this thread has developed a little since I wrote that maybe you ought to read it all.

Essentially why they vote as they do is their choice but the result is always an individual MP as their, and everyone else in the constituency's, representative. Not a party.


Unlike you it seems, I don't spend my life glued to this site, otherwise I would have responded before the 'thread developed'.


Of course the result is an individual MP, but you can't even concede that certain areas would vote for certain parties no matter who was representing them.

Peter Sutcliffe could run for Labour in areas of the north and win, likewise Ian Huntley as a Conservative in Horsham.

FFS take the blinkers off.

 

Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 24 Oct 19 9.16pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Also, what the hell has having a genuine belief that leaving is the correct course of action got to do with inflexibility?

My comment was about the ultra leavers and their attitudes on this site. Try reading a few of them and perhaps you will realise why I think that. I have no idea what they might be like away from the keyboard.

It is of course because Wisbech cannot accept that he might just be wrong and therefore anyone who doesn’t agree with him is inflexible.

Of course I can be wrong. I certainly don't think everyone who disagrees with me are inflexible. Many people can change their minds

I respect his views but he should in turn respect others.


 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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