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nickgusset  Shizzlehurst 08 Mar 15 1.25pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 1.12pm
Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 12.19pm
I haven't actually said I support mass immigration, what I have said is that it's facile to blame it for the country's woes.
You have had masses and masses of opportunities to speak out about it.....But instead you haven't. No one is saying it affects those other than the British poor......For the middle classes and higher who live in nicely unaffected areas or rich areas of London its a useful benefit to them. Those on the left who recognitise the obvious problem...They either just don't talk about their failure of the poor or they stick their head in the sand and make excuses....Like saying that 'more money' is the real problem. 'More money....more money'....'more money'.....It's the connection you lot have to bankers. You lot opened the gates.....What you don't complain about you....by definition accept. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 1.13pm) Who are 'my lot'
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 Stirlingsays 08 Mar 15 1.43pm |
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Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 1.25pm
That lot.....You don't speak out against the policy. You can't have it both ways.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| legaleagle 08 Mar 15 2.29pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 1.12pm
Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 12.19pm
I haven't actually said I support mass immigration, what I have said is that it's facile to blame it for the country's woes.
You have had masses and masses of opportunities to speak out about it.....But instead you haven't. No one is saying it affects those other than the British poor......For the middle classes and higher who live in nicely unaffected areas or rich areas of London its a useful benefit to them. Those on the left who recognitise the obvious problem...They either just don't talk about their failure of the poor or they stick their head in the sand and make excuses....Like saying that 'more money' is the real problem. 'More money....more money'....'more money'.....It's the connection you lot have to bankers. You lot opened the gates.....What you don't complain about you....by definition accept. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 1.13pm) You appear to have overlooked the second part of Nick G's post above,the pertinent part.The part I understand you to vehemently disagree with. Just on a point of accuracy,one of the people who was responsible for the onset of large scale immigration into this country in modern times (and the many benefits overall we have gained from it, something I'm sure you would accept,Stirling),was the Secretary of State for Health in the Tory Macmillan government, a little known minister by the name of..... Enoch Powell. An early and big proponent of the expansion of the EU eastwards was a little known Tory Prime Minister, one Margaret Thatcher. Edited by legaleagle (08 Mar 2015 2.59pm)
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| Stirlingsays 08 Mar 15 7.33pm |
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Quote legaleagle at 08 Mar 2015 2.29pm
You appear to have overlooked the second part of Nick G's post above,the pertinent part.The part I understand you to vehemently disagree with. Just on a point of accuracy,one of the people who was responsible for the onset of large scale immigration into this country in modern times (and the many benefits overall we have gained from it, something I'm sure you would accept,Stirling),was the Secretary of State for Health in the Tory Macmillan government, a little known minister by the name of..... Enoch Powell. An early and big proponent of the expansion of the EU eastwards was a little known Tory Prime Minister, one Margaret Thatcher. Edited by legaleagle (08 Mar 2015 2.59pm)
As for the rest of your post legal....Again, you confuse my issues with the EU's freedom of movement with some kind of disagreement with the concept of immigration. I've no issue with previous immigration issues from fifty/forty years....which quite amazingly you describe as 'large scale' (they simply aren't in the same ball park to the last ten years). None of those immigrations occurred with the government having no control over the numbers coming in. There is no comparison and it's tiresome to even have to type that. EU freedom of movement was expanded to include no transitional controls for incoming low income countries by Labour.....This was good for business but terrible for the poorest amongst us and continues to be....They and all of the left who support the concept are the ones I blame for worsening the conditions of the working classes in the affected areas.....It's resulted in support for UKIP......Which is completely what the left deserve. UKIP will change the dynamic.....The vast majority of the left support doing feck all.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 Mar 15 8.15pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 7.33pm
Quote legaleagle at 08 Mar 2015 2.29pm
You appear to have overlooked the second part of Nick G's post above,the pertinent part.The part I understand you to vehemently disagree with. Just on a point of accuracy,one of the people who was responsible for the onset of large scale immigration into this country in modern times (and the many benefits overall we have gained from it, something I'm sure you would accept,Stirling),was the Secretary of State for Health in the Tory Macmillan government, a little known minister by the name of..... Enoch Powell. An early and big proponent of the expansion of the EU eastwards was a little known Tory Prime Minister, one Margaret Thatcher. Edited by legaleagle (08 Mar 2015 2.59pm)
As for the rest of your post legal....Again, you confuse my issues with the EU's freedom of movement with some kind of disagreement with the concept of immigration. I've no issue with previous immigration issues from fifty/forty years....which quite amazingly you describe as 'large scale' (they simply aren't in the same ball park to the last ten years). None of those immigrations occurred with the government having no control over the numbers coming in. There is no comparison and it's tiresome to even have to type that. EU freedom of movement was expanded to include no transitional controls for incoming low income countries by Labour.....This was good for business but terrible for the poorest amongst us and continues to be....They and all of the left who support the concept are the ones I blame for worsening the conditions of the working classes in the affected areas.....It's resulted in support for UKIP......Which is completely what the left deserve. UKIP will change the dynamic.....The vast majority of the left support doing feck all.
British people would not work for such low wages, however the employers knew that foreigners would. I remember driving to a studio in South Thoresby (your neck of the woods I believe Stirling) and seeing a minibus full of what appeared to be eastern Europeans. I'd imagine, though may not be correct, that these people were being taken to, or from one of the many market gardens in the area for work. The irony? The minibus was covered in UKIP stickers! Whose fault is it that 'gangmasters' pay/paid such low wages?
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on me shed son  Krakow 08 Mar 15 8.25pm |
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Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 8.15pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 7.33pm
Quote legaleagle at 08 Mar 2015 2.29pm
You appear to have overlooked the second part of Nick G's post above,the pertinent part.The part I understand you to vehemently disagree with. Just on a point of accuracy,one of the people who was responsible for the onset of large scale immigration into this country in modern times (and the many benefits overall we have gained from it, something I'm sure you would accept,Stirling),was the Secretary of State for Health in the Tory Macmillan government, a little known minister by the name of..... Enoch Powell. An early and big proponent of the expansion of the EU eastwards was a little known Tory Prime Minister, one Margaret Thatcher. Edited by legaleagle (08 Mar 2015 2.59pm)
As for the rest of your post legal....Again, you confuse my issues with the EU's freedom of movement with some kind of disagreement with the concept of immigration. I've no issue with previous immigration issues from fifty/forty years....which quite amazingly you describe as 'large scale' (they simply aren't in the same ball park to the last ten years). None of those immigrations occurred with the government having no control over the numbers coming in. There is no comparison and it's tiresome to even have to type that. EU freedom of movement was expanded to include no transitional controls for incoming low income countries by Labour.....This was good for business but terrible for the poorest amongst us and continues to be....They and all of the left who support the concept are the ones I blame for worsening the conditions of the working classes in the affected areas.....It's resulted in support for UKIP......Which is completely what the left deserve. UKIP will change the dynamic.....The vast majority of the left support doing feck all.
British people would not work for such low wages, however the employers knew that foreigners would. I remember driving to a studio in South Thoresby (your neck of the woods I believe Stirling) and seeing a minibus full of what appeared to be eastern Europeans. I'd imagine, though may not be correct, that these people were being taken to, or from one of the many market gardens in the area for work. The irony? The minibus was covered in UKIP stickers! Whose fault is it that 'gangmasters' pay/paid such low wages?
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| Stirlingsays 08 Mar 15 8.30pm |
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Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 8.15pm
Whose fault is it that 'gangmasters' pay/paid such low wages? I remember when my parents first moved here to Wisbech. I was seventeen. I went and did fruit picking and carrot topping. The money wasn't great as it was piece meal work but the work was there for me. 'The British won't work' mantra is atypical of the fact that no one should work under exploitation. The fact is now it's 'the British can't work' because employers won't take them as they have a steady steam of EU jokers working for peanuts. If the immigrants weren't here in such numbers then more British youngsters would be doing those jobs and the pay would be better......Yeah there would be less jobs than now but most of those jobs are purely exploitation anyway. Like I said, good for business, bad for the working class......But never mind eh.....As long as none of your lefty mates call you a bigot. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 8.31pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 Mar 15 8.33pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 8.30pm
Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 8.15pm
Whose fault is it that 'gangmasters' pay/paid such low wages? I remember when my parents first moved here to Wisbech. I was seventeen. I went and did fruit picking and carrot topping. The money wasn't great as it was piece meal work but the work was there for me. 'The British won't work' mantra is atypical of the fact that no one should work under exploitation. The fact is now it's 'the British can't work' because employers won't take them as they have a steady steam of EU jokers working for peanuts. If the immigrants weren't here in such numbers then more British youngsters would be doing those jobs and the pay would be better......Yeah there would be less jobs than now but most of those jobs are purely exploitation anyway. Like I said, good for business, bad for the working class......But never mind eh.....As long as none of your lefty mates call you a bigot. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 8.31pm) So go after the exploitative employers then.
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| Stirlingsays 08 Mar 15 8.47pm |
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Quote nickgusset at 08 Mar 2015 8.33pm
So go after the exploitative employers then.
The support for freedom of movement for lower income EU countries allowed the exploitation to happen.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| legaleagle 08 Mar 15 10.36pm |
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Stirling,don't always overlook 2 things in your mantra about immigration being the root of present problems and it being down to the EU. See the link. You have to look at net EU/UK migration. You also need to look at the actual immigration statistics (allowing for lies,lies and damned statistics,I know!).Foreign born population in UK,c 8 million (the largest national group of which are Irish, and note that more than 161,000 Polish people lived here as long ago as 1951),of which c 2.3 million were born in the EU (and from the links above you will note an estimated 2.2 million Brits have left the UK to live in other EU counties,with an estimated 5 Million living worldwide).So,to the extent that you see immigration as a number one problem issue, it has primarily flowed from policies within UK government control,not simply as a result of EU freedom of movement and the net migration figures bring a greater sense of perspective in an era of globalisation of goods,services,communications and people. But don't expect any such subtleties from political parties in search of votes on the back of emotive and simplistic slogans. Edited by legaleagle (08 Mar 2015 10.55pm)
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| Stirlingsays 08 Mar 15 11.08pm |
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Quote legaleagle at 08 Mar 2015 10.36pm
Stirling,don't always overlook 2 things in your mantra about immigration being the root of present problems and it being down to the EU. See the link. You have to look at net EU/UK migration. You also need to look at the actual immigration statistics (allowing for lies,lies and damned statistics,I know!).Foreign born population in UK,c 8 million (the largest national group of which are Irish, and note that more than 161,000 Polish people lived here as long ago as 1951),of which c 2.3 million were born in the EU (and from the links above you will note an estimated 2.2 million Brits have left the UK to live in other EU counties,with an estimated 5 Million living worldwide).So,to the extent that you see immigration as a number one problem issue, it has primarily flowed from policies within UK government control,not simply as a result of EU freedom of movement and the net migration figures bring a greater sense of perspective in an era of globalisation of goods,services,communications and people. But don't expect any such subtleties from political parties in search of votes on the back of emotive and simplistic slogans.
Why should I give a feck about UK workers going aboard? I'm not a cheer leader for people sodding off and paying tax to another state. How does that help the working classes here? The vast majority of our youngsters don't wish to or have the skills needed to work aboard. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 11.10pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 Mar 15 11.30pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 08 Mar 2015 11.08pm
Quote legaleagle at 08 Mar 2015 10.36pm
Stirling,don't always overlook 2 things in your mantra about immigration being the root of present problems and it being down to the EU. See the link. You have to look at net EU/UK migration. You also need to look at the actual immigration statistics (allowing for lies,lies and damned statistics,I know!).Foreign born population in UK,c 8 million (the largest national group of which are Irish, and note that more than 161,000 Polish people lived here as long ago as 1951),of which c 2.3 million were born in the EU (and from the links above you will note an estimated 2.2 million Brits have left the UK to live in other EU counties,with an estimated 5 Million living worldwide).So,to the extent that you see immigration as a number one problem issue, it has primarily flowed from policies within UK government control,not simply as a result of EU freedom of movement and the net migration figures bring a greater sense of perspective in an era of globalisation of goods,services,communications and people. But don't expect any such subtleties from political parties in search of votes on the back of emotive and simplistic slogans.
Why should I give a feck about UK workers going aboard? I'm not a cheer leader for people sodding off and paying tax to another state. How does that help the working classes here? The vast majority of our youngsters don't wish to or have the skills needed to work aboard. Edited by Stirlingsays (08 Mar 2015 11.10pm) If UKIP want to stop the flow from the EU or send em back, then I'm sure those Brits in the EU would need to be repatriated meaning pretty much no overall difference in numbers here.
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