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The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)


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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 16 12.39pm

I'm still laughing from the assertion that the rise in right wing values is all down to the left.

I'm still confused as to why Corbyn is an anti semite, but the bloke in the U.S who Trump is planning to put into high office isn't reported as such when he said he doesn't want his kids to go to a Jewish school.

What really confuddles me are that the biggest moaners are the ones who voted for brexit.

 

Hoof Hearted 14 Nov 16 12.42pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!


Ask the victims of the paedo ring.

Exactly.

Their complaints to the police were initially met with complete disdain because of the UK's malaise over political correctness towards Asian communities and not wanting to upset them.

 

jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 14 Nov 16 12.59pm

Originally posted by Cucking Funt

How would you describe it?

I've been to Burnley, if I lived there I would take advantage of the Freedom of Movement. And I'm not fussy, bus, train or bicycle....

Victims of immigration, like there was some golden age in which Burnley was a shining paradise where people danced in the street and had everything they ever wanted.

Burnley has always been a s**thole, even before an single migrant arrived in the 1960s. What spoiled Burnley, was building it

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 14 Nov 16 1.01pm

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

Exactly.

Their complaints to the police were initially met with complete disdain because of the UK's malaise over political correctness towards Asian communities and not wanting to upset them.

Ah the old police excuse, its always someone else's fault we didn't do our jobs. Same as they were intimidated by Saviles media power. The police have a terrible history for trying to avoid having to pursue sex crimes, decade on decade.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Nov 16 1.31pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

I'm still laughing from the assertion that the rise in right wing values is all down to the left.

I'm still confused as to why Corbyn is an anti semite, but the bloke in the U.S who Trump is planning to put into high office isn't reported as such when he said he doesn't want his kids to go to a Jewish school.

What really confuddles me are that the biggest moaners are the ones who voted for brexit.

Yeah, keep on laughing while we lurch more and more to the right.

It's sad that you can't see that the liberal left and voices from minorities that constantly shut down debate on these subjects are fueling the shift. The majority will not be silenced and they are becoming more angry and more right wing as a result.

You keep laughing.

 

silvertop Flag Portishead 14 Nov 16 1.58pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Yeah, keep on laughing while we lurch more and more to the right.

It's sad that you can't see that the liberal left and voices from minorities that constantly shut down debate on these subjects are fueling the shift. The majority will not be silenced and they are becoming more angry and more right wing as a result.

You keep laughing.

I can't quite fathom your politics Hrolf, but I agree the point you make entirely.

It isn't the lunatic skin-headed fringes you have to worry about; it isn't even Jihadi nut jobs; it's the mass ranks of hitherto apathetic white Middle Englanders getting tired of being told they can't do this or say that as it is "unacceptable".

History will not repeat itself. The pieces are not there for a resurgence of either polar extreme of the last century. However, prejudices we thought long consigned to the dustbin of horrible history are not only going to resurface; they are going to inform populist policy.

 

Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 14 Nov 16 2.06pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

I've been to Burnley, if I lived there I would take advantage of the Freedom of Movement. And I'm not fussy, bus, train or bicycle....

Victims of immigration, like there was some golden age in which Burnley was a shining paradise where people danced in the street and had everything they ever wanted.

Burnley has always been a s**thole, even before an single migrant arrived in the 1960s. What spoiled Burnley, was building it

Whether it's a sh*thole or not is really beside the point. The point is that it's had its cultural demographic destroyed without the locals actually having been asked. It is a hotbed of BNP support for very good reasons.

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

Nest Flag 14 Nov 16 2.09pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Yeah, keep on laughing while we lurch more and more to the right.

It's sad that you can't see that the liberal left and voices from minorities that constantly shut down debate on these subjects are fueling the shift. The majority will not be silenced and they are becoming more angry and more right wing as a result.

You keep laughing.

There is truth in this but its not so much the Left but the centrist views of both parties and liberal media over many years becoming lazy and taken the public and office for granted, professional politicians, not for any ideology because its the same, they have lost touch and have been very naive. They have no experience of any of whats going on now because they forgot {or dont know their history) that politics can so much more than petty debates

 

Part Time James Flag 14 Nov 16 3.05pm

Originally posted by silvertop

I can't quite fathom your politics Hrolf, but I agree the point you make entirely.

It isn't the lunatic skin-headed fringes you have to worry about; it isn't even Jihadi nut jobs; it's the mass ranks of hitherto apathetic white Middle Englanders getting tired of being told they can't do this or say that as it is "unacceptable".

History will not repeat itself. The pieces are not there for a resurgence of either polar extreme of the last century. However, prejudices we thought long consigned to the dustbin of horrible history are not only going to resurface; they are going to inform populist policy.

A good post and I particularly feel that my current political beliefs began in the exact circumstances you describe. I think I became a UKIP supporter around 2010 when I felt like Nigel Farage (yeah I know, opinions will be divided on my next few words) actually seemed to be a light at the end of the tunnel of increasingly restrictive and somewhat patronising rule system about how to live our lives.

I get into a lot of arguments because I don't really consider myself right wing. I hold a lot of left wing views and right wing views (but to neither extreme) and if anything a lot of the UKIP professed plans and policies that I feel I associate with, I'd go as far as to say feel quite left wing to me (I actually take issue with the concept of left/right wing and also don't fully buy into party politics being mapped to some kind of linear extreme left to extreme right chart).

Personally, and I could admit my education in politics isn't sufficient to feel assured in this, but I have always felt that leaving the EU would help to deliver improvements to this country that do not for one second sound "right wing" to my ears. Of course, they have policies which I disagree with too, but I think most people blindly defending every policy of one political party are perhaps a bit blinkered.

So in summary, I have quite passionately backed Leave.EU, UKIP and defended some things which people have decided right wing, but I feel that a lot of that comes as a backlash against the Orwellian world I felt we were voluntarily crashing into.

Either the above will be read as an honest assessment or the words of a total prat. My history on here as the latter might pre-dispose you to lean that way!

Edited by Part Time James (14 Nov 2016 3.06pm)

 




Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Nov 16 3.06pm

Originally posted by silvertop

I can't quite fathom your politics Hrolf, but I agree the point you make entirely.

It isn't the lunatic skin-headed fringes you have to worry about; it isn't even Jihadi nut jobs; it's the mass ranks of hitherto apathetic white Middle Englanders getting tired of being told they can't do this or say that as it is "unacceptable".

History will not repeat itself. The pieces are not there for a resurgence of either polar extreme of the last century. However, prejudices we thought long consigned to the dustbin of horrible history are not only going to resurface; they are going to inform populist policy.

Mine is the politics of common sense.

The liberal mentality has been to use the sins of the past to create a self hating attitude among post war, post empire generations. The very worthy effort to promote equality has been used to place the needs of the few over the needs of the many. The few include ethnic minorities and the ruling classes. The latter uses the former for personal gain and the liberal left are totally blinkered only seeing the plight of the minority,shutting down debate,rejecting democracy and putting their heads in the sand. The backlash was inevitable with the rise of mass migration.
The media is full of these "liberal" tenancies, so it is no surprise that the majority in Britain and US have responded in the only way that they can, through the ballot box.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2016 3.08pm)

 

nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 16 3.11pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Mine is the politics of common sense.

The liberal mentality has been to use the sins of the past to create a self hating attitude among post war, post empire generations. The very worthy effort to promote equality has been used to place the needs of the few over the needs of the many. The few include ethnic minorities and the ruling classes. The latter uses the former for personal gain and the liberal left are totally blinkered only seeing the plight of the minority,shutting down debate,rejecting democracy and putting their heads in the sand. The backlash was inevitable with the rise of mass migration.
The media is full of these "liberal" tenancies, so it is no surprise that the majority in Britain and US have responded in the only way that they can, through the ballot box.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2016 3.08pm)

Or, more honestly...I've got a s***ty life so I'll use the nearest scapegoat that the media offer up to deflect from the real reason your life is so s***ty.

 

We are goin up! Flag Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 3.13pm

Originally posted by Part Time James

A good post and I particularly feel that my current political beliefs began in the exact circumstances you describe. I think I became a UKIP supporter around 2010 when I felt like Nigel Farage (yeah I know, opinions will be divided on my next few words) actually seemed to be a light at the end of the tunnel of increasingly restrictive and somewhat patronising rule system about how to live our lives.

I get into a lot of arguments because I don't really consider myself right wing. I hold a lot of left wing views and right wing views (but to neither extreme) and if anything a lot of the UKIP professed plans and policies that I feel I associate with, I'd go as far as to say feel quite left wing to me (I actually take issue with the concept of left/right wing and also don't fully buy into party politics being mapped to some kind of linear extreme left to extreme right chart).

Personally, and I could admit my education in politics isn't sufficient to feel assured in this, but I have always felt that leaving the EU would help to deliver improvements to this country that do not for one second sound "right wing" to my ears. Of course, they have policies which I disagree with too, but I think most people blindly defending every policy of one political party are perhaps a bit blinkered.

So in summary, I have quite passionately backed Leave.EU, UKIP and defended some things which people have decided right wing, but I feel that a lot of that comes as a backlash against the Orwellian world I felt we were voluntarily crashing into.

Either the above will be read as an honest assessment or the words of a total prat. My history on here as the latter might pre-dispose you to lean that way!

Edited by Part Time James (14 Nov 2016 3.06pm)


Great post. The left/right thing is unbelievably outdated and also wrong. It is incredibly frustrating to hear the media peddle the "left is compassionate, right is nasty" line. Left should mean protectionist and interventionist, right should mean less government and less wealth redistribution.

Why, for example, Marine Le Pen's National Front party are called "far-right" when they believe in tax rises for the wealthy and huge welfare is beyond me.

Hitler called himself a socialist, the Nazi party stood for "The National Socialist German Workers' Party". But they were apparently far right? How? They believed in the power of the state.

What this causes is people to feel that being slightly right wing is somehow undesirable, which is why they don't shout about it until they get into the privacy of a polling booth.

 


The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

Nest Flag 14 Nov 16 3.15pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Or, more honestly...I've got a s***ty life so I'll use the nearest scapegoat that the media offer up to deflect from the real reason your life is so s***ty.

Or, more honestly...I've got a s***ty life so I'll vote for something that may produce real change

 

jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 14 Nov 16 3.28pm

Originally posted by Cucking Funt

Whether it's a sh*thole or not is really beside the point. The point is that it's had its cultural demographic destroyed without the locals actually having been asked. It is a hotbed of BNP support for very good reasons.

Probably because the BNP have been exploiting the local issues in the wake of New Labour's betrayal of the UK working classes. Of course the BNP seems to be very much last years NF, as the far right seems to grow a new 'cause celeb' every few years (EDL, Britain First etc).

But its not the liberal left that's the issue, its the failure of any political party to actually give a s**t about people in general, who aren't either in 'key political battleground areas' or upper working class / lower middle class. Both the BNP, UKIP, Class War and Momentum have all capitalised on this (as has the Green Party).

Its got nothing really to do with culture - its about jobs, wages and incomes. People aren't fundamentally worried about a crisis in culture, and so vote BNP.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 16 3.35pm

Originally posted by Nest

Or, more honestly...I've got a s***ty life so I'll vote for something that may produce real change

Good idea, maybe we can all pose for photos in our gold lift like these two who are definitely not part of the establishment we are kicking against.


Or maybe we'll just direct our ire against a politician who really does want to make things better by making it look like he's dancing at the cenotaph in cropped photos, and put it on the front pages.

trumpfarage.jpg Attachment: trumpfarage.jpg (116.93Kb)

 

Part Time James Flag 14 Nov 16 3.45pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Good idea, maybe we can all pose for photos in our gold lift like these two who are definitely not part of the establishment we are kicking against.


Or maybe we'll just direct our ire against a politician who really does want to make things better by making it look like he's dancing at the cenotaph in cropped photos, and put it on the front pages.

Do you get many top politicians from a working class background with little to no education that wander about in jeans and a t-shirt and look sufficiently like the man on the street?

You're going to say Corbyn aren't you? He's probably sufficiently scruffy for me to say touche if you do.

 




Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Nov 16 3.48pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Or, more honestly...I've got a s***ty life so I'll use the nearest scapegoat that the media offer up to deflect from the real reason your life is so s***ty.

You live in a fantasy world as do so many these days.

The average liberal/left devotee has become everything that they hate in others.

 

Nest Flag 14 Nov 16 3.52pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Good idea, maybe we can all pose for photos in our gold lift like these two who are definitely not part of the establishment we are kicking against.


Or maybe we'll just direct our ire against a politician who really does want to make things better by making it look like he's dancing at the cenotaph in cropped photos, and put it on the front pages.

Its the press who have been directing an assault on Corbyn not the poor. Its the divide in wealth and the non-stop put down from the establishment who have caused this, their own naivity and blindness that everything is running along nicely. When it is obviously ******* not!

 

Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Nov 16 3.57pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Probably because the BNP have been exploiting the local issues in the wake of New Labour's betrayal of the UK working classes. Of course the BNP seems to be very much last years NF, as the far right seems to grow a new 'cause celeb' every few years (EDL, Britain First etc).

But its not the liberal left that's the issue, its the failure of any political party to actually give a s**t about people in general, who aren't either in 'key political battleground areas' or upper working class / lower middle class. Both the BNP, UKIP, Class War and Momentum have all capitalised on this (as has the Green Party).

Its got nothing really to do with culture - its about jobs, wages and incomes. People aren't fundamentally worried about a crisis in culture, and so vote BNP.


You can add crime to that list and the feeling of anxiety about a rapidly changing cultural and political landscape.

The liberals and minority voices are not the root cause of this but they are the noisy face of it that people encounter on TV, the internet and written press. They are the disproportionate antagonism if you like.

 

jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 14 Nov 16 4.05pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger


You can add crime to that list and the feeling of anxiety about a rapidly changing cultural and political landscape.

The liberals and minority voices are not the root cause of this but they are the noisy face of it that people encounter on TV, the internet and written press. They are the disproportionate antagonism if you like.

Problem with liberals, is that they've increasingly switched Liberalism with being a Liberal Democrat. There is nothing wrong with Liberalism, its the cornerstone of British cultural heritage and political progress.

The problem really comes when it becomes about being a Liberal over understanding Liberalism from a political point of view.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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