Ched Evans saga part ???
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 glazedallover  Allier 10 Jan 15 10.14pm |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 10 Jan 2015 8.37pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 10 Jan 2015 7.50pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 10 Jan 2015 11.23am
Why so touchy? If she was so drunk how would she know what she was getting up to? I've seen girls on nights out getting up to stuff they would be ashamed of in the morning, but thought it was hilarious at the time. Ched Evans insists it was consensual and proceeded on that basis. The girl may well have led him on once he appeared in the room which she may have suggested he do earlier in the evening. No one knows for sure what was said or done and all I'm doing is pointing out possible scenarios or explanations. I don't understand why my comments are regarded by you as loathsome........ you seem to float between Mr Jack the lad to Mr Prude/Unreasonable at the flick of a switch these days mate. If she was raped and he did it, she has my sympathy and support, but it seems a bit complex to prove without any lingering doubt.
There's no smoking gun just speculation and interpretation being present4d as facts that prove guilt beyond reasonable doubt. Not for me.
I really don't understand why people get so animated either? I've just played Devil's Advocate by suggesting other viewpoints/opinions..... hardly loathsome? Still... Palace have won and nothing is going to ruin that feelgood factor tonight! She must have been asking for it then. A UKIP policy no doubt.
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Stirlingsays  11 Jan 15 8.03am |
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Quote glazedallover at 10 Jan 2015 10.14pm
She must have been asking for it then. A UKIP policy no doubt. Enjoy your stereotypes do you?
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Hoof Hearted 11 Jan 15 10.59am | |
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Quote glazedallover at 10 Jan 2015 10.14pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 10 Jan 2015 8.37pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 10 Jan 2015 7.50pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 10 Jan 2015 11.23am
Why so touchy? If she was so drunk how would she know what she was getting up to? I've seen girls on nights out getting up to stuff they would be ashamed of in the morning, but thought it was hilarious at the time. Ched Evans insists it was consensual and proceeded on that basis. The girl may well have led him on once he appeared in the room which she may have suggested he do earlier in the evening. No one knows for sure what was said or done and all I'm doing is pointing out possible scenarios or explanations. I don't understand why my comments are regarded by you as loathsome........ you seem to float between Mr Jack the lad to Mr Prude/Unreasonable at the flick of a switch these days mate. If she was raped and he did it, she has my sympathy and support, but it seems a bit complex to prove without any lingering doubt.
There's no smoking gun just speculation and interpretation being present4d as facts that prove guilt beyond reasonable doubt. Not for me.
I really don't understand why people get so animated either? I've just played Devil's Advocate by suggesting other viewpoints/opinions..... hardly loathsome? Still... Palace have won and nothing is going to ruin that feelgood factor tonight! She must have been asking for it then. A UKIP policy no doubt.
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You'll be claiming that Nigel Farage was dogging the scene outside the window next!| Stirlingsays 11 Jan 15 2.55pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 10 Jan 2015 9.37pm
Other than the conviction beyond reasonable doubt, the evidence is stacked against him, and demonstrates a) he had sex b) she couldn't give consent c) he had no basis on which to credibly claim he could have believed consent was given. That's beyond reasonable doubt, not just in my opinion, but in the consensus of British law. There isn't really a scenario where by he has a defence, unless he can present evidence that is a) new b) disputes those three key factors. What happened in the room is irrelevant, once he admitted to having sex with her. But other than that, yeah. Edited by jamiemartin721 (10 Jan 2015 9.39pm)
There is a massive difference of opinion between us as too what consent is. You say it doesn't matter what happens when the door is closed. I completely disagree with you and I view it as fundamental. You feel that the level of evidence against this man is 'reasonable' to call him a rapist......Well, I'd say its sufficient to call him a t*** and a possible rapist.....But there's too much doubt existing for me to be comfortable. A lot of people have an issue with this conviction and the story isn't finished yet. Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Jan 2015 2.56pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 11 Jan 15 5.25pm |
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Quote Stirlingsays at 11 Jan 2015 2.55pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 10 Jan 2015 9.37pm
Other than the conviction beyond reasonable doubt, the evidence is stacked against him, and demonstrates a) he had sex b) she couldn't give consent c) he had no basis on which to credibly claim he could have believed consent was given. That's beyond reasonable doubt, not just in my opinion, but in the consensus of British law. There isn't really a scenario where by he has a defence, unless he can present evidence that is a) new b) disputes those three key factors. What happened in the room is irrelevant, once he admitted to having sex with her. But other than that, yeah. Edited by jamiemartin721 (10 Jan 2015 9.39pm)
There is a massive difference of opinion between us as too what consent is. You say it doesn't matter what happens when the door is closed. I completely disagree with you and I view it as fundamental. You feel that the level of evidence against this man is 'reasonable' to call him a rapist......Well, I'd say its sufficient to call him a t*** and a possible rapist.....But there's too much doubt existing for me to be comfortable. A lot of people have an issue with this conviction and the story isn't finished yet. Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Jan 2015 2.56pm) Only in this case. Once the prosecution have established that she was too drunk to consent, it becomes about whether its reasonable for him to have believed consent was valid. I don't think a single person can claim that by way of his actions, Evans behaviour prior to having sex could be reasonable to suggest sufficiently that he could reliably have judged her capable of consent. Indeed, its more reasonable to think that from the moment that he received the text from Mcdonald, that he had decided to have sex with the girl, before interacting with her. What the prosecution failed to prove beyond reasonable doubt was that Evans conspired with Donaldson to procure a woman for him (which seems likely to me, given that Evans paid for the room and Donaldson informed him that he'd 'gotten a bird', which led to Evans turning up, with two mates, to have sex with her, before sneaking out.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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the despotic banana  Dept. of Baboon Maintenance 16 Jan 15 4.50pm |
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Aaand: [Link]
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| Stuk Top half 05 Oct 15 2.02pm |
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The case is going to the court of appeal.
Optimistic as ever |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 05 Oct 15 3.13pm |
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Quote Stuk at 05 Oct 2015 2.02pm
The case is going to the court of appeal. New evidence or information not heard by the jury. Should be interesting to see what that actually is, and why it wasn't introduced at the time.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| Old Chap Orpington 05 Oct 15 8.16pm |
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I'm sure he had the best legal council he (or his girlfriends father) could obtain. So why didn't they raise it?
Trivial fact - Palace used to win 5-1 at least once a season, maybe next season? |
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| MochMon Croydon 05 Oct 15 10.36pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 05 Oct 2015 3.13pm
Quote Stuk at 05 Oct 2015 2.02pm
The case is going to the court of appeal. New evidence or information not heard by the jury. Should be interesting to see what that actually is, and why it wasn't introduced at the time. Lots of rumours about before the case went to court, remember Rhyl is a small town but this is what I heard/read it may be true or not but the "victim" had previously accused a rugby player (a pro) of raping/assaulting her. Ched Evans guilty or not has no morals, decorum or integrity.
Nid oes Bradwr yn y ty hwn |
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| dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Oct 15 9.15am |
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I said from the start this had all the markers of a fit up. On facebook day after bosting about what car she was going to buy with the money she would get. Evans is an unscroupulous dick head, and an unlikebale billy big bolliks, how ever I firmly believe in this instance he has been well and truly stiched up.
"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Oct 15 3.56pm |
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Quote MochMon at 05 Oct 2015 10.36pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 05 Oct 2015 3.13pm
Quote Stuk at 05 Oct 2015 2.02pm
The case is going to the court of appeal. New evidence or information not heard by the jury. Should be interesting to see what that actually is, and why it wasn't introduced at the time. Lots of rumours about before the case went to court, remember Rhyl is a small town but this is what I heard/read it may be true or not but the "victim" had previously accused a rugby player (a pro) of raping/assaulting her. Ched Evans guilty or not has no morals, decorum or integrity. If that was the case, then Ched Evens should also be suing his defense council, because that's the kind of thing they should be submitting as evidence at trial. Whilst you can 'delete' something off facebook, you can still subpoena evidence from the log files that will retain the information (people generally don't realize that hitting the delete key in IT generally just moves things to different folders. A half decent forensic data expert could easily recall that information in about 10 minutes Same applies with text messages - It would have been remarkably easy for the defense to demonstrate she had sent texts whilst in the room. Its not like his family haven't conducted a 'criminal social media' campaign. Sounds like it might have been either something the prosecution omitted or a new witness.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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