Bias against Trump

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Stirlingsays Online 03 May 19 2.10pm
Originally posted by dollardays A very conversative estimate of the value of proceeds of crime, assets and so on, from Paul Manafort alone is million, so the investigation either cost nothing or made a sizeable profit for the treasury. I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort. If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

03 May 19 2.10pm

Originally posted by dollardays

A very conversative estimate of the value of proceeds of crime, assets and so on, from Paul Manafort alone is million, so the investigation either cost nothing or made a sizeable profit for the treasury.

I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort.

If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.15pm
Originally posted by Jimenez You are permanantly on here mate !!! Permanently logged in, yes! Reading something on the site, daily. Reading this thread, not for a week or two. Sorry to disappoint! For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.15pm

Originally posted by Jimenez

You are permanantly on here mate !!!

Permanently logged in, yes! Reading something on the site, daily. Reading this thread, not for a week or two. Sorry to disappoint!

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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deleted user 03 May 19 2.21pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort. If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean. And yet he seems to have breezed through his entire life without any such thing happening until he entered the eye of the storm. My point was that if we're going to have a mantra about the cost of something, it useful to state that it's a very incomplete reading of the cost in real terms. But that's what politics of absolutely all shades is now, picking sides and omitting information. We don't live in a time where a nuanced reading of anything is seen as something that gets you anywhere and so people don't bother.
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deleted user

03 May 19 2.21pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort.

If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean.

And yet he seems to have breezed through his entire life without any such thing happening until he entered the eye of the storm.

My point was that if we're going to have a mantra about the cost of something, it useful to state that it's a very incomplete reading of the cost in real terms.

But that's what politics of absolutely all shades is now, picking sides and omitting information. We don't live in a time where a nuanced reading of anything is seen as something that gets you anywhere and so people don't bother.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.31pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort. You don't persecute criminals like Manafort. You prosecute them. What was discovered about him was an important side shoot of the main investigation. He could have alleviated his pain by keeping to the deal he struck, but he decided to renege on it. Whether because of an understanding he reached with Trump, or because of the code of silence that exists around high level criminals, we will probably never know. If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean. The FBI do care. Caring, knowing the truth and proving things in a Court of law and beyond any reasonable doubt to ensure conviction, are all different. You have only to remember Al Capone to understand that. I am glad though that you agree that $30 million would be cheap to achieve it as I sincerely hope Trump finds out in due course. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.31pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm very much of the view that you don't require the Mueller investigation to persecute Paul Manafort.

You don't persecute criminals like Manafort. You prosecute them. What was discovered about him was an important side shoot of the main investigation. He could have alleviated his pain by keeping to the deal he struck, but he decided to renege on it. Whether because of an understanding he reached with Trump, or because of the code of silence that exists around high level criminals, we will probably never know.

If the FBI cared about criminality amongst the business class thirty million would be a drop in the ocean.

The FBI do care. Caring, knowing the truth and proving things in a Court of law and beyond any reasonable doubt to ensure conviction, are all different. You have only to remember Al Capone to understand that. I am glad though that you agree that $30 million would be cheap to achieve it as I sincerely hope Trump finds out in due course.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Stirlingsays Online 03 May 19 2.36pm
Originally posted by dollardays And yet he seems to have breezed through his entire life without any such thing happening until he entered the eye of the storm. My point was that if we're going to have a mantra about the cost of something, it useful to state that it's a very incomplete reading of the cost in real terms. But that's what politics of absolutely all shades is now, picking sides and omitting information. We don't live in a time where a nuanced reading of anything is seen as something that gets you anywhere and so people don't bother. Yep, that's true, but you kind of did this yourself with the Manafort point as I'm sure I do all the time myself. Your point about people's lack of objectivity is also true. However, wouldn't you consider true objectivity as an impossibility anyway? As all opinion is subject to inherent biases and subjectivity isn't it better to recognize that 'truth' and 'right' or 'wrong' are perspective constructs and hence the idea that we can have a universal commentary on anything...outside of sheer blind statistics..... is flawed. Hence I've grown to accept the adversary system as probably the better way to see the world. It leads to conflict that's true but that is a truer reflection of human nature than the misplaced concept of a 'truth'. So I say 'pick a side' but just try to be as fair about it as you personally can be.....pretending that there is this impartial fence that we can sit on is illusionary. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 2.38pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

03 May 19 2.36pm

Originally posted by dollardays

And yet he seems to have breezed through his entire life without any such thing happening until he entered the eye of the storm.

My point was that if we're going to have a mantra about the cost of something, it useful to state that it's a very incomplete reading of the cost in real terms.

But that's what politics of absolutely all shades is now, picking sides and omitting information. We don't live in a time where a nuanced reading of anything is seen as something that gets you anywhere and so people don't bother.

Yep, that's true, but you kind of did this yourself with the Manafort point as I'm sure I do all the time myself.

Your point about people's lack of objectivity is also true. However, wouldn't you consider true objectivity as an impossibility anyway?

As all opinion is subject to inherent biases and subjectivity isn't it better to recognize that 'truth' and 'right' or 'wrong' are perspective constructs and hence the idea that we can have a universal commentary on anything...outside of sheer blind statistics..... is flawed.

Hence I've grown to accept the adversary system as probably the better way to see the world. It leads to conflict that's true but that is a truer reflection of human nature than the misplaced concept of a 'truth'.

So I say 'pick a side' but just try to be as fair about it as you personally can be.....pretending that there is this impartial fence that we can sit on is illusionary.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 2.38pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Maine Eagle USA 03 May 19 2.42pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Announced for Biden? How can anyone announce for Biden, are you talking about the democratic candidacy? Personally I kind of hope that the Democrats choose Biden.....it'll be a lot of fun. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 12.45pm) Calling Mueller a never Trumper is just a bald faced Trumpian lie. He is a career republican. He never once criticized Trump or treated him unfairly throughout the entire process. Calling Mueller a never Trumper is lazy and totally false. Announced for Biden meaning the firefighters union has.........announced for Biden: [Link] Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha.
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Maine Eagle

USA 03 May 19 2.42pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Announced for Biden? How can anyone announce for Biden, are you talking about the democratic candidacy?

Personally I kind of hope that the Democrats choose Biden.....it'll be a lot of fun.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 12.45pm)

Calling Mueller a never Trumper is just a bald faced Trumpian lie. He is a career republican. He never once criticized Trump or treated him unfairly throughout the entire process. Calling Mueller a never Trumper is lazy and totally false.

Announced for Biden meaning the firefighters union has.........announced for Biden:

[Link]

Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.46pm
Originally posted by cryrst Trump has made america great again. Trump has divided America like no other before him. America was always great and has remained so despite Trump, although he has made it the current laughing stock of the developed world. Wish we had a strong leader like that. Iam very glad we don't! Trump isn't strong! He is narcissistic, obsessive, sociopath who appeals to a certain type of unsophisticated, unworldly American and those in the wealthy classes who can benefit from them. The last one was maggie. Thatcher was a mixed blessing but compared to Trump she was a paragon of virtue. No-one, how ever much they disliked her politics, would ever have accused her of being immoral, a criminal, a constant liar, etc, etc . For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 03 May 19 2.46pm

Originally posted by cryrst

Trump has made america great again.

Trump has divided America like no other before him. America was always great and has remained so despite Trump, although he has made it the current laughing stock of the developed world.

Wish we had a strong leader like that.

Iam very glad we don't! Trump isn't strong! He is narcissistic, obsessive, sociopath who appeals to a certain type of unsophisticated, unworldly American and those in the wealthy classes who can benefit from them.

The last one was maggie.

Thatcher was a mixed blessing but compared to Trump she was a paragon of virtue. No-one, how ever much they disliked her politics, would ever have accused her of being immoral, a criminal, a constant liar, etc, etc .

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Stirlingsays Online 03 May 19 2.51pm
Originally posted by Maine Eagle Calling Mueller a never Trumper is just a bald faced Trumpian lie. He is a career republican. He never once criticized Trump or treated him unfairly throughout the entire process. Calling Mueller a never Trumper is lazy and totally false. Announced for Biden meaning the firefighters union has.........announced for Biden: [Link] The link doesn't appear to work. Anyway, 'never Trumper' or not, Mueller and co just pulled a nice little earner off the tax payer for a couple of years. Same old, same old. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

03 May 19 2.51pm

Originally posted by Maine Eagle

Announced for Biden meaning the firefighters union has.........announced for Biden:

[Link]

The link doesn't appear to work.

Anyway, 'never Trumper' or not, Mueller and co just pulled a nice little earner off the tax payer for a couple of years.

Same old, same old.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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dannyboy1978 03 May 19 3.01pm
Well done Donald, I can hear the trump haters now. But but but he is a horrible man....blahhhh BBC News - US jobless rate at lowest since 1969 [Link]
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dannyboy1978

03 May 19 3.01pm

Well done Donald, I can hear the trump haters now. But but but he is a horrible man....blahhhh
BBC News - US jobless rate at lowest since 1969
[Link]

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deleted user 03 May 19 4.06pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Yep, that's true, but you kind of did this yourself with the Manafort point as I'm sure I do all the time myself. In a sense but it would seem that it's relevant so was worth pointing out. It adds more completeness than it removes. Quote Your point about people's lack of objectivity is also true. However, wouldn't you consider true objectivity as an impossibility anyway? As all opinion is subject to inherent biases and subjectivity isn't it better to recognize that 'truth' and 'right' or 'wrong' are perspective constructs and hence the idea that we can have a universal commentary on anything...outside of sheer blind statistics..... is flawed. Hence I've grown to accept the adversary system as probably the better way to see the world. It leads to conflict that's true but that is a truer reflection of human nature than the misplaced concept of a 'truth'. So I say 'pick a side' but just try to be as fair about it as you personally can be.....pretending that there is this impartial fence that we can sit on is illusionary. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 2.38pm) I see your point in that at an extreme of being objective, it could be said that it'd be hard to really strive for anything on a national level, politically. That approach at extremes could even be vaguely spiritual. Then again, circumspect types often wield a decent amount of power and influence because inevitably nations find themselves very split down the middle. Even in ultra polarised countries like the US you get the popular Joe Rogan types, people who refuse to fully opt in to an us vs them outlook and are rightly attributed a level of authenticity due to that. Values based primarily on a human level hold true in unstable political moments where many are more inclined to lose touch with core values in order to push for preferred political outcome. The more politically polarised and amendment people are, the more willing they are to treat good people that are not aligned with them badly. The same applies to religion really.
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deleted user

03 May 19 4.06pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Yep, that's true, but you kind of did this yourself with the Manafort point as I'm sure I do all the time myself.

In a sense but it would seem that it's relevant so was worth pointing out. It adds more completeness than it removes.

Quote

Your point about people's lack of objectivity is also true. However, wouldn't you consider true objectivity as an impossibility anyway?

So I say 'pick a side' but just try to be as fair about it as you personally can be.....pretending that there is this impartial fence that we can sit on is illusionary.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 May 2019 2.38pm)

I see your point in that at an extreme of being objective, it could be said that it'd be hard to really strive for anything on a national level, politically. That approach at extremes could even be vaguely spiritual. Then again, circumspect types often wield a decent amount of power and influence because inevitably nations find themselves very split down the middle.

Even in ultra polarised countries like the US you get the popular Joe Rogan types, people who refuse to fully opt in to an us vs them outlook and are rightly attributed a level of authenticity due to that. Values based primarily on a human level hold true in unstable political moments where many are more inclined to lose touch with core values in order to push for preferred political outcome. The more politically polarised and amendment people are, the more willing they are to treat good people that are not aligned with them badly. The same applies to religion really.

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deleted user 03 May 19 4.13pm
Originally posted by dannyboy1978 Well done Donald, I can hear the trump haters now. But but but he is a horrible man....blahhhh BBC News - US jobless rate at lowest since 1969 [Link] One of the more interesting aspects of his presidency is the spanner in the works effect. Looking again at trade agreements and the like was unlikely to be something any other president would've done in a hurry. The USD being the world's reserve currency isolates them in a way giving more leeway to call the shots. Better to try to explore these possibilities now than a future where China may be top of the pile.
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deleted user

03 May 19 4.13pm

Originally posted by dannyboy1978

Well done Donald, I can hear the trump haters now. But but but he is a horrible man....blahhhh
BBC News - US jobless rate at lowest since 1969
[Link]

One of the more interesting aspects of his presidency is the spanner in the works effect. Looking again at trade agreements and the like was unlikely to be something any other president would've done in a hurry. The USD being the world's reserve currency isolates them in a way giving more leeway to call the shots. Better to try to explore these possibilities now than a future where China may be top of the pile.

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 03 May 19 5.07pm
-Unemployment rate at lowest point since 1969 -Record low African American/Hispanic/Asian unemployment -Lowest unemployment rate for women since 1953 -Quickest wage growth for workers in 10 years
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 03 May 19 5.07pm

-Unemployment rate at lowest point since 1969

-Record low African American/Hispanic/Asian unemployment

-Lowest unemployment rate for women since 1953

-Quickest wage growth for workers in 10 years

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