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Bias against Trump

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 24 Apr 20 8.50pm Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Dr Eugene Gu, a politically active physician with a large social media following, tweeted bluntly that “Injecting disinfectant into your body will kill you.

“While it feels completely unnecessary to even say this, people drank fish tank cleaner containing chloroquine because of what they heard from rumors about the substance. We must fight deadly misinformation no matter how stupid.”

Dr Gu’s reference to fish tank cleaner concerns an Arizona man who died after he and his wife drank chloroquine, which they mistook for hydroxychloroquine – a drug aggressively pushed as a coronavirus treatment by Mr Trump and Fox News. Both sources have now pivoted away from the drug since the release of a study that showed no positive effect.''

Hmm, President Trump said quite a lot about Hydroxychloroquine as I remember, got very excited. Just like a small boy really

 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Flag Chatham 24 Apr 20 9.04pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Yes

Also you should swallow a torch

What could possibly go wrong

UV light is vitamin d. Fortunately I'm on them by prescription so having it large.

 

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View Forest Hillbilly's Profile Forest Hillbilly Flag in a hidey-hole 24 Apr 20 9.15pm Send a Private Message to Forest Hillbilly Add Forest Hillbilly as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

UV light is vitamin d. Fortunately I'm on them by prescription so having it large.

I think Mapletree was probably referring to the batteries, which would no doubt bring the swallower much unpleasantness.

Trump did himself no favours by "winging it". Disinfectants make no distinction between good and bad organisms. They kill a very high percentage of everything.

That is the point of trying to develop a vaccine. It is more discriminating in what it kills.

On the forthcoming US election, the Democrats seem to be not very quick off the mark. If the CV virus is on a steep decline by the time voting is near (and I'm only going by the UK media), it would seem Trump would be the stand-out winner again.

 


,.,.,..,

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 24 Apr 20 9.19pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

UV light is vitamin d. Fortunately I'm on them by prescription so having it large.

It kind of makes sense traditionally as normal winter time viruses tend to get knocked down in the warmer months when the sun beats down.

Still, if this were true for the chop fluey then why were Italy and Spain suffering so much?....we know the inter-generational housing point but those are the sunniest countries in Europe and warm even in winter.

Still....what are we? Six weeks in....if the weather is irrelevant and the flu follows the 'Spanish flu' pattern it will start reducing rapidly in numbers in about two weeks.

I've heard the opinion that this virus will follow the same pattern regardless of what you do.

herdimmunity.JPG Attachment: herdimmunity.JPG (178.27Kb)

 


'I can't stand innuendo. If I see one in a script I whip it out immediately.' (Kenneth Williams)

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View SavoyTruffle's Profile SavoyTruffle Flag 24 Apr 20 9.24pm Send a Private Message to SavoyTruffle Add SavoyTruffle as a friend

Turns out jokes is on everyone else, actually Trump just said a really painfully idiotic thing to see what would happen and how the press would respond by pointing out the painfully idiotic thing... as being painfully idiotic.

The man is playing 4D chess...

Would almost be funny if there weren’t thousands of people dying in his country and he wasn’t almost certainly going to win re-election in November.

 

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View gazzerp's Profile gazzerp Flag Newry, Maine 24 Apr 20 9.41pm Send a Private Message to gazzerp Add gazzerp as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You seem like a sensible Democrat....which if that's true would make you quite politically lonely.

I think Trump being criticised for his recent airhead comments is fair enough. That said, lots of the criticism is written as though he was telling people to use these methods, which isn't accurate.

Still, I favour a Trump victory for quite a few reasons....not least a Biden presidency would mean higher taxes, sucking up to China and the Green new deal....all of which aren't directions I agree with anyway.....Trump's foreign and trade policy has been far better for the US than the weakness that Obama displayed....I remember his last trip to China where they disrespected him so much they didn't even get the red carpet out.....Plus that embarrassing hand to Iran, which they ignored while taking the millions Obama gave them for nothing more than delaying weapon programmes.

That allied to the fact that Trump annoys all the people I really dislike the idea of a Trump second term sits ok with me.

Trump is hated so much by the Democrats that him winning would be fun just if for nothing to watch those mentalists go ape.

And if Biden wins....well, that would still be fun....just in a kind of 'Reagan's last year but not with it' kind of way.

Edited by Stirlingsays (24 Apr 2020 6.36pm)

Ironically, most of my life I've leaned to the right. But, these days, a "sensible Democrat" is an assessment I can live with.

I emigrated from London in '81 but only became a citizen in 2015. My welcome gift? Voting in 2016. Crooked Hillary or The Buffoon. I couldn't stomach an 'x' for either so, I voted for Gary Johnson. In retrospect, I shouldn't have; it ended up being a vote for Cheetos. My mistake, and I've been living it every day.

It's all about him. Not so much what he's done/hasn't done. He's just a repugnant individual... I could go on, but I'd merely be repeating everything that's been said of him. At the end of the day, though, he's unhinged. We live in fear that sooner or later, he'll have a tantrum and will take the country (the World) to war.

The political system over here is a nightmare and is fueled by the media.

.5 billion was spent on the last election... .5 billion...

When Reagan tore down the FCC Fairness Doctrine in 1987, Murdoch rose to power with Fox and so began the media manipulation of the masses. With the advent of internet-based media, "informing" to the masses that can't think beyond their next Instagram post/like has added nothing but fuel to the level of ignorance in this country. Nothing will change until that Act is restored and, while I'm complaining, rider-based and pork barrel legislation must be eliminated. I'm all for a little cooperation here and there but this country can't pass a simple bill that's less than three feet thick with a hundred "related" amendments attached to it.

Here's what the media manipulation has produced: millions of idiots - most of whom can vote. A friend of mine was having unavoidable banter on Facebook yesterday with a MAGA fan and he (the MAGA fan) was touting Trump's achievements since taking office. "I had to cash out money from my IRA when the Dow was at 6500, and gas was .50 a gallon... now look where things are, all thanks to Trump."

He believes Trump has single-handedly taken the Dow up from 4500 and brought gas down to where it is today. He would NOT concede that when Trump took office in January 2017 gas was .27/avg. a gallon and the Dow was 19,827.25. These are the kind of people there's no reasoning with. Fox feeds them absolute nonsense and they eat it up, day after day.

I agree with you , though, that leaving Trump in office until such time there's a better option may well be better for the country. If only he would stay in his office... He won't do that, of course, and I can't bear the thought of four more years. It's 2016 all over, for me: can't stomach any of my choices.

Edited by gazzerp (24 Apr 2020 9.49pm)

 

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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 24 Apr 20 9.53pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by SavoyTruffle

Turns out jokes is on everyone else, actually Trump just said a really painfully idiotic thing to see what would happen and how the press would respond by pointing out the painfully idiotic thing... as being painfully idiotic.

The man is playing 4D chess...

Would almost be funny if there weren’t thousands of people dying in his country and he wasn’t almost certainly going to win re-election in November.

Anyone who actually saw Trump make those remarks, and the reaction of those around him, knows for certain that there was no sarcasm involved at all. All he is doing today is giving his mega dumb base a lifeline to cling to, something everyone knows isn't true but that they will, because he says it's true.

Let's hope that in the intervening 24 hours no-one has actually swallowed any bleach or IPA or laid under a sun lamp with their mouth open.

Whether Trump gets a second term is really up in the air. The bookies have him and Biden almost at evens right now, with Biden a marginal favourite. I think three things will make the difference. 1) If the US economy nosedives, as seems likely whenever the lockdown is relaxed, then Trump will suffer. 2) If the lockdown is released too early and a second wave comes early, Trump will be blamed and the economy suffer even more. 3) If Biden fails to stand up to pressure and the attacks from the right he could be weakened significantly. (My own hope is if the DNC see that happening then he will be "retired" on health grounds and a charismatic replacement nominated.)

If I was a betting man then I would lump a lot on Trump losing. I think there is too much piling up against him.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 24 Apr 20 10.03pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by gazzerp

Ironically, most of my life I've leaned to the right. But, these days, a "sensible Democrat" is an assessment I can live with.

I emigrated from London in '81 but only became a citizen in 2015. My welcome gift? Voting in 2016. Crooked Hillary or The Buffoon. I couldn't stomach an 'x' for either so, I voted for Gary Johnson. In retrospect, I shouldn't have; it ended up being a vote for Cheetos. My mistake, and I've been living it every day.

It's all about him. Not so much what he's done/hasn't done. He's just a repugnant individual... I could go on, but I'd merely be repeating everything that's been said of him. At the end of the day, though, he's unhinged. We live in fear that sooner or later, he'll have a tantrum and will take the country (the World) to war.

The political system over here is a nightmare and is fueled by the media.

.5 billion was spent on the last election... .5 billion...

When Reagan tore down the FCC Fairness Doctrine in 1987, Murdoch rose to power with Fox and so began the media manipulation of the masses. With the advent of internet-based media, "informing" to the masses that can't think beyond their next Instagram post/like has added nothing but fuel to the level of ignorance in this country. Nothing will change until that Act is restored and, while I'm complaining, rider-based and pork barrel legislation must be eliminated. I'm all for a little cooperation here and there but this country can't pass a simple bill that's less than three feet thick with a hundred "related" amendments attached to it.

Here's what the media manipulation has produced: millions of idiots - most of whom can vote. A friend of mine was having unavoidable banter on Facebook yesterday with a MAGA fan and he (the MAGA fan) was touting Trump's achievements since taking office. "I had to cash out money from my IRA when the Dow was at 6500, and gas was .50 a gallon... now look where things are, all thanks to Trump."

He believes Trump has single-handedly taken the Dow up from 4500 and brought gas down to where it is today. He would NOT concede that when Trump took office in January 2017 gas was .27/avg. a gallon and the Dow was 19,827.25. These are the kind of people there's no reasoning with. Fox feeds them absolute nonsense and they eat it up, day after day.

I agree with you , though, that leaving Trump in office until such time there's a better option may well be better for the country. If only he would stay in his office... He won't do that, of course, and I can't bear the thought of four more years. It's 2016 all over, for me: can't stomach any of my choices.

Edited by gazzerp (24 Apr 2020 9.49pm)

An interesting post.

When I look at politics seriously....which isn't that often. I think essentially the directional travel in America is of increasing balkanization and state disconnection. Both parties seem to talk different languages...in the case of the Democrats literally Spanish.

I don't see the polarisation reducing and I don't see anything really putting the genie back in the bottle....Social media over-rides it and unless the state starts repression and social credit systems the path is set.

So eventual conflict/secession or a dystopian controlled state. The US is an oil tanker set on its path and it's going to be very hard to alter the course regardless of who is president....because 50 percent of the country will reject them.

All roads lead to sh1tesville.....You might as well enjoy it while you can.

Edited by Stirlingsays (24 Apr 2020 10.07pm)

 


'I can't stand innuendo. If I see one in a script I whip it out immediately.' (Kenneth Williams)

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 25 Apr 20 12.15am Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

It kind of makes sense traditionally as normal winter time viruses tend to get knocked down in the warmer months when the sun beats down.

Still, if this were true for the chop fluey then why were Italy and Spain suffering so much?....we know the inter-generational housing point but those are the sunniest countries in Europe and warm even in winter.

Still....what are we? Six weeks in....if the weather is irrelevant and the flu follows the 'Spanish flu' pattern it will start reducing rapidly in numbers in about two weeks.

I've heard the opinion that this virus will follow the same pattern regardless of what you do.

There are opinions along every scale to do with this virus. I think we’ll be following the lead of Germany or Spain and Italy depending on how they weigh up which and when. What we’ll do is make it look like it’s data driven. I don’t blame government for doing this because if we keep it based on medical findings then we won’t be out of lockdown for a long time. I don’t believe Grant Schapps when he said lockdown decisions will be purely medical decisions.

Herd immunity relies on natural immunity to last during the time it takes for the herd immunity they reach that level. With this virus there’s no evidence of that natural immunity.

On Trump. Before all this I’d be content. He’s having a bad war and is embarrassing himself. I suppose you expect this when morons face more dynamics they’re used to. The concerning thing is the influence he has on twitter before thinking and doesn’t have anything to go by or copy his policies from and is showing no consistency from day one.

 


COYP

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View SavoyTruffle's Profile SavoyTruffle Flag 25 Apr 20 12.29am Send a Private Message to SavoyTruffle Add SavoyTruffle as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Anyone who actually saw Trump make those remarks, and the reaction of those around him, knows for certain that there was no sarcasm involved at all. All he is doing today is giving his mega dumb base a lifeline to cling to, something everyone knows isn't true but that they will, because he says it's true.

Let's hope that in the intervening 24 hours no-one has actually swallowed any bleach or IPA or laid under a sun lamp with their mouth open.

Whether Trump gets a second term is really up in the air. The bookies have him and Biden almost at evens right now, with Biden a marginal favourite. I think three things will make the difference. 1) If the US economy nosedives, as seems likely whenever the lockdown is relaxed, then Trump will suffer. 2) If the lockdown is released too early and a second wave comes early, Trump will be blamed and the economy suffer even more. 3) If Biden fails to stand up to pressure and the attacks from the right he could be weakened significantly. (My own hope is if the DNC see that happening then he will be "retired" on health grounds and a charismatic replacement nominated.)

If I was a betting man then I would lump a lot on Trump losing. I think there is too much piling up against him.

I wouldn’t get your hopes up too much, if the DNC has shown anything historically it’s that they aren’t too bothered putting up weak candidates. For all the fervour and outrage of the supposed ‘liberal’ media Washington Post types and DNC, ultimately the people that run them are multi millionaires and while Trump may offend their sensibilities occasionally, when the inevitable next round of tax cuts come round they won’t be too sad about it.

Only thing I can see stopping Trump winning in November is if the virus really takes hold in the red states and a lot of his base are effected first hand. While the virus is still predominantly effecting metropolitan, Democratic leaning, densely populated cities his unwavering base won’t falter. With that being said, I obviously don’t want to see the above scenario as it means more unnecessary death.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 25 Apr 20 2.50am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

There are opinions along every scale to do with this virus. I think we’ll be following the lead of Germany or Spain and Italy depending on how they weigh up which and when. What we’ll do is make it look like it’s data driven. I don’t blame government for doing this because if we keep it based on medical findings then we won’t be out of lockdown for a long time. I don’t believe Grant Schapps when he said lockdown decisions will be purely medical decisions.

What can I say I think our approach has been wrong. I've been pretty consistent about my contention that the Swedish model was the correct one.

What I can say is that it's a difficult decision for anyone. I also recognise that taking the 'herd immunity' pathway would have come under huge and constant criticism. A political party that cares about how it is portrayed wasn't seriously going to stick with herd immunity. The Tories are obsessed with keeping their newly obtained northern labour voters and and it all factors in and so are hyper sensitive to the lame 'uncaring' charge.

The way British culture works, a desperate feminized 'save lives' mantra is basically the default message. The reasoning that life is risk management and always has been is thrown out the window in place of a modern individualistic form of hysteria....a pandemic of panic if you will....something akin to the salem witch trial reactions where parties all convince each other that their perceptions are accurate.

Yet all these officialdom reactions....from my point of view, appear to be based upon covering their own arses. Initially they were going with herd immunity....until they get a model suggesting a huge death toll, a model that presented a very unlikely outcome. Then, just as with extinction rebellion...this very unlikely worst case scenario is taken as realistic with nothing more than the inputs into a statistical model as evidence.

So the result is we have spent billions and wrecked economies on what amounts to guesswork.

So the way society is now, this 'save lives', 'save the NHS' message can be maintained for a long time with very little discussion or pushback in the mainstream media. Perhaps by the time a more rational and balanced analysis is published the public will have moved on so much that it'll be ignored.....Indeed, it won't be in the media's interest to focus on a message that directly attacks its behaviour during this period.....I've already noted the media self consciously defending itself under the guise that no other position was realistic....well yeah...but that's partly because of the media itself and the societal culture it endorses.


Originally posted by Rudi Hedman


Herd immunity relies on natural immunity to last during the time it takes for the herd immunity they reach that level. With this virus there’s no evidence of that natural immunity.

Shouldn't that be the other way around?

Herd immunity (a term I dislike because 'immunity' doesn't exist) is the default way nature deals with viruses. I keep hearing people cast doubts however they don't cite anything, it's all anecdotal.

If you're on your last legs and your immune system is weakened then of course your ability to fight off a virus is reduced even with anti bodies depending upon just how much infection load is around you....from how I understand it....it's like a really good defence not an infallible one.....swarm it enough for long enough and you're going to get through eventually.

If indeed the Kung flu ignores the anti bodies from a previous infection or partially ignores them....I'd wager that the claims for it being a 'natural virus' would be weakened. I wager what is far more likely in cases like this is reinfection from a different strain in a weakened system....not that common.

My current position....subject to evidence otherwise....is that this virus is natural in nature, though the accidental release theory is plausible.

If this was a designed virus deliberately released to wreck havoc why would its kill ratio be so low and why would it be released in China itself.....Yeah, we can state that the CCP are incredibly heartless even to their own people but there's simply no need to self harm first.

That said, the reality that designed viruses are being worked on is just a no brainer....of course they are.

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

On Trump. Before all this I’d be content. He’s having a bad war and is embarrassing himself. I suppose you expect this when morons face more dynamics they’re used to. The concerning thing is the influence he has on twitter before thinking and doesn’t have anything to go by or copy his policies from and is showing no consistency from day one.

While the anti Trump press and commentators have lied about what Trump said the truth is that it was a stupid message to put out there.

What on earth was he doing? To me, it's classic Trump and can be put down to the surface way he absorbs information. However, it essentially comes down to which administration do you trust running America.

As a person, I'm quite fatalistic in nature as it doesn't matter what we think. However, if I were American and had a vote I'd stick with the republicans...at least until the Democrats went back to some kind of sanity.

Still, on the other hand I realise that it doesn't really matter as America is on its path either way.


Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2020 5.23am)

 


'I can't stand innuendo. If I see one in a script I whip it out immediately.' (Kenneth Williams)

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 25 Apr 20 11.22am Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

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