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October 20 2020 12.32pm

Antifa call black man a Nazi and Racist

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 08 Jun 20 12.19pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

I agree with both of you it should be in a museum. Again, this was attempted many times years ago but it was ignored or put at the bottom of the in-tray over and over again so Iím not particularly fussed. I agree itís vandalism. But am I that bothered? No. It makes little difference on other statues because theyíve been vandalised since last week. Itís those in power that decide whether they arenít defaced or torn down. Defend them properly and they wonít be.

 


COYP

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 08 Jun 20 12.26pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Slight difference is this statue is celebrating someone who hugely benefited from slavery. Iím just not that bothered by it. If it means that much to them for it not to be on public view then itís a small price to pay Iíd say. When you say where does it all end, Iíd say when are the police going to get the batons out? Thatís how you put a stop to things. Law enforcement. They havenít gone in early to fall into a trap so now they can get equipped and stand for no more liberties being taken.

Iíve heard quite a few people from Bristol speak. I havenít heard anyone say it should remain there. Only people dotted around the country whoíve probably never seen or noticed it but stand by the principle that nothing historical ever gets moved. I heard about the moves to have it moved years ago and I thought it had been. Instead they were ignored. Loads of people think it should have been moved years ago, including conservatives. Iím far more concerned with police leaving statues of heroic figures of independence to be defaced than a statue a lot of people werenít even aware of until yesterday. Iím all a bit meh about this one. Itís a small victory. The real issue is law and order where theyíre half trying to enforce it.

We differ on this.

I have no care about a Bristol figure related to its past and I can understand why a percent will be against this statue.

I am also against certain statues but I would never support mob rule in a democratic state.....Has state control broken down?

In a democratic state, there are legal processes that are required and hence this is a criminal act and I'd restore this statue under armed guard if required.

If enough people in Bristol want this statue removed they must do it legally.

If the legal processes fail, well then the losers have to suck it up as that is the point of a democracy.

If they succeed fine.....again, that's democracy.

 

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 08 Jun 20 12.38pm Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by ASCPFC

Just a little side point here. I kind of agree that Colston should have been removed some time ago. However, the statue should be in a museum, university, council building or something - in a back room yet preserved. Not all history can be 'good' or ethically 'correct' for today's standards. Ripping things down and chucking them in a river is not a decent way to go about things, in my book.
Slave trading was abolished early 1800s by Britain. They still turned a blind eye, however, in some circumstances.
Nevertheless, have you ever noticed you never really hear about slaves working in England or Britain as a whole? Well, Henry VII (father of Henry VIII) had actually decreed that bonds men and serfdom of any type was illegal in England (the other countries either didn't count or weren't in the union, whichever way you look at it) and that all bonded men had to be freed. That law was never removed and meant that having slaves in Britain was, essentially, illegal.
I know BLM won't care, but I thought someone might be interested. I never hear about it in the slavery narrative/debate so I thought I'd share.

Absolutely agree. Should be in a museum.

 

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 08 Jun 20 12.47pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

We differ on this.

I have no care about a Bristol figure related to its past and I can understand why a percent will be against this statue.

I am also against certain statues but I would never support mob rule in a democratic state.....Has state control broken down?

In a democratic state, there are legal processes that are required and hence this is a criminal act and I'd restore this statue under armed guard if required.

If enough people in Bristol want this statue removed they must do it legally.

If the legal processes fail, well then the losers have to suck it up as that is the point of a democracy.

If they succeed fine.....again, that's democracy.

This is where we go round in circles because the attempts at a democratic decision were ignored.

I can imagine the reaction to riot police dealing with this statue removal yesterday. As I said, itís a small victory theyíre willing to let go because they probably also donít feel itís necessary he statue is there. Like you, Iím not that fussed about it and I reckon nobody will be in time either. Itís about more than this statue and this is my concern. When the young black people who are just like low income white people next have a reason to go on a rampage. Plenty have ability, glass ceilings, face subtle racist problems etc and thatís fine to deal with. The problem is when I hear about not having a father or an education.

 


COYP

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 08 Jun 20 12.54pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

This is where we go round in circles because the attempts at a democratic decision were ignored.

I can imagine the reaction to riot police dealing with this statue removal yesterday. As I said, itís a small victory theyíre willing to let go because they probably also donít feel itís necessary he statue is there. Like you, Iím not that fussed about it and I reckon nobody will be in time either. Itís about more than this statue and this is my concern. When the young black people who are just like low income white people next have a reason to go on a rampage. Plenty have ability, glass ceilings, face subtle racist problems etc and thatís fine to deal with. The problem is when I hear about not having a father or an education.

So when democracy doesn't deliver what you want you go out and destroy property?
Sure you want to run with that idea?

One needs to separate arguments about the suitability of statues and mindless vandalism.

 

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Online Flag 08 Jun 20 1.07pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

[Link]

As previously posted this should be of more concern than a statue. Even if these figures are wrong by 50% they are still shocking.

 

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View elgrande's Profile elgrande Flag bedford 08 Jun 20 1.17pm Send a Private Message to elgrande Add elgrande as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Slight difference is this statue is celebrating someone who hugely benefited from slavery. Iím just not that bothered by it. If it means that much to them for it not to be on public view then itís a small price to pay Iíd say. When you say where does it all end, Iíd say when are the police going to get the batons out? Thatís how you put a stop to things. Law enforcement. They havenít gone in early to fall into a trap so now they can get equipped and stand for no more liberties being taken.

Iíve heard quite a few people from Bristol speak. I havenít heard anyone say it should remain there. Only people dotted around the country whoíve probably never seen or noticed it but stand by the principle that nothing historical ever gets moved. I heard about the moves to have it moved years ago and I thought it had been. Instead they were ignored. Loads of people think it should have been moved years ago, including conservatives. Iím far more concerned with police leaving statues of heroic figures of independence to be defaced than a statue a lot of people werenít even aware of until yesterday. Iím all a bit meh about this one. Itís a small victory. The real issue is law and order where theyíre half trying to enforce it.

Personally I don't think the statue should have been erected in the first place,however they had a referendum (we love those don't we children),and 11000 people said it should be taken down,the population of Bristol is over half a million...what's that 2%.
They had their chance to do it and blew it

 


always a Norwood boy, where ever I live.

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 08 Jun 20 1.26pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by elgrande

Personally I don't think the statue should have been erected in the first place,however they had a referendum (we love those don't we children),and 11000 people said it should be taken down,the population of Bristol is over half a million...what's that 2%.
They had their chance to do it and blew it

There's that pesky democracy again. It's soooo unfair when they don't get their way.

 


One more point

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View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 08 Jun 20 1.35pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

How do you all feel about this history being destroyed?

[Link]

 


Tw@tter:

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View Eaglecoops's Profile Eaglecoops Flag CR3 08 Jun 20 1.36pm Send a Private Message to Eaglecoops Add Eaglecoops as a friend

The news last night (BBC), they asked a girl about why she was protesting and all she could come up with is, ďwe canít take this racism any longer and we are oppressed and itís wrongĒ and ďstop and search is wrongĒ. Really, is that the kind of thoughts running through peopleís minds that makes them want to protest and riot. I would have thought there might be something a little more complex than this.

I would say 90% of protestors have absolutely no idea what they want or how something can be done to improve things. Just shouting racism is bad is going to achieve f all and then rioting to enforce it is just going to make the majority of this country switch off to their plight. We like a minority or an underdog if you like in this country, someone or groups of people that beat the odds, we always have. What we donít like is being told en mass that we are all fundamentally racist and that we must change. That attitude will never work.

I look at the Indian, pakistani, Chinese, Bangladeshi and others who work so hard to make their place in British Society and I donít see them rioting about racism or injustice.

I wish the black people who feel they have been so hard done by tell us why they feel like this. Maybe then we can try to understand what the problem is.

 

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 08 Jun 20 1.47pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Tbf if you asked one of these kids you arenít going to get a sensible or even sometimes coherent answer. If you listen on the radio you will get some fair and valid issues raised from black people. As I said, my concern is in the future when young black people similar to white low earners have another reason to riot.

 


COYP

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 08 Jun 20 1.50pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

How do you all feel about this history being destroyed?

[Link]

Brilliant. As usual, a completely different situation which bears no relation to the discussion.

If people are going to keep using history to indoctrinate new generations with past grievances then perhaps it would be better if we buried it.

It is being used by political groups to sow disharmony where very little actually exists.

 

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