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Labour Party Supporters: Should Corbyn Step Down?

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 23 Sep 19 12.48pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

How exactly can Labour introduce a 32 hour working week, especially when productivity needs increasing?

 


COYP

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Online Flag Chatham 23 Sep 19 12.59pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

How exactly can Labour introduce a 32 hour working week, especially when productivity needs increasing?

Policy and vote winners are two different things.
Whatever most parties put in their manifesto doesnt happen on all sides.
Put 20 proposals in a manifesto and do 3 of them.
Havent lied, just done the bare minimum.
We all break promises to a degree.
This is just on a larger scale.

 

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View Midlands Eagle's Profile Midlands Eagle Flag 23 Sep 19 1.07pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

How exactly can Labour introduce a 32 hour working week, especially when productivity needs increasing?

On their proposed minimum wage of £10 per hour too

 

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Flag Croydon 23 Sep 19 1.29pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

On their proposed minimum wage of £10 per hour too

Aren't we actually working too long for less productivity?

And wages permanently depressed?

 

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 23 Sep 19 2.21pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Buying votes.

More bank holidays.

32 hour weeks on the same pay. Er, how? Iíd predict job losses mortgage defaults galore. Maybe even the other way round as they couldnít enforce the latter.

I knew this conference would be a bit of a joke. Havenít got o to Brexit yet.

 


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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 23 Sep 19 2.23pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

Aren't we actually working too long for less productivity?

And wages permanently depressed?

It cannot be done on the same weekly and monthly pay. Do you not understand the implications of a 20% pay rise for everyone? Look it up in history. Try the Ď70s. What a coincidence.

 


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View jeeagles's Profile jeeagles Flag 23 Sep 19 2.32pm Send a Private Message to jeeagles Add jeeagles as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Do we support private fire brigades or private armies? We do have private security - people should and do take control of their own affairs when the state offering is doesn't cover what is required & they can afford it.

This essentially comes down to what we think is best served via communal effort and what we understand is best served via private ownership.

Private schools are elitist.....I see the benefit of them but it's essentially a benefit for a few. I think this is a rather short sighted approach, lead by politics of envy.

Every child in a private school is a £5k a year funding saving for cash strapped local authorities. The average person is meant to earn around £25k a year and pay £5k in tax. Those who can afford private schools are more likely to pay higher tax, which can go on, taking their child out of the state system reduces the burden on the tax payer.

It is sad that some children get better opportunities than others, but, most private schools offer scholarships (I think Boris was on one). Certainly, more parents could afford it than you think, just live in a smaller house, don't buy a new car every year, cut back on holidays to Disneyland/Skiing every year, massive TV's in every room of the house (I know not everyone can afford these, but a lot of parents of private school kids do put ALL their money into private education.

Having an elite education system does give an unfair advantage to the children who get it over the children that don't, but everyone should have the right to invest in their children's future. It also arguably produces better a better educated population than the state system can afford, which does benefit the entire population.

I see some weaknesses within my own position as well.....I mean if we ban private schools we surrender a plank of meritocracy where the supposed best minds are housed and educated together (when in reality it's more often the richest)....the idea being that we have the best in the most important positions.

Private schools aren't tied to the national curriculum and are fiercely competitive in every way which helps drive up the standards of education, reducing bureaucracy and looking for better ways of doing things. State schools are essentially exam factories measure on simplistic metrics. Worryingly Labour also want to get rid of Ofsted too, thus removing competition and evaluation from the school system.
But...errrr.

Look at what the products from these schools and later universities have been doing to this country over the last fifty years.

So f**k them.

In some cases. Not all, look at all proportion of Olympic medal winners produced by private schools, the same success is reflected in other industries, you just never hear people say - Richard Branson, Private School Boy and entrepreneur, because it isn't a popular narrative unless they fail

Come swim in the pool you created.

On the subject of pools, most of these schools rent their facilities out to the public when ever they can to generate extra income, normally at a lower rate than private gyms etc could charge, thus providing facilities to the general public which wouldn't otherwise be their.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Sep 2019 9.58am/)

Most worrying of all is the grab of private sector assets. Argentina started doing this under Fernandez, and investors lost all confidence in their economy. It's a dangerous precedent

 

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View jeeagles's Profile jeeagles Flag 23 Sep 19 2.35pm Send a Private Message to jeeagles Add jeeagles as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Buying votes.

More bank holidays.

32 hour weeks on the same pay. Er, how? Iíd predict job losses mortgage defaults galore. Maybe even the other way round as they couldnít enforce the latter.

I knew this conference would be a bit of a joke. Havenít got o to Brexit yet.

Wouldn't be against shorter working hours or 4 more bank holidays. The UK works far too hard compared to Europe, the 3 day week showed this wouldn't necessarily impact productivity. More free time could increase spending in the economy. Increased time to train and study, potentially lower unemployment, potential health benefits to the workforce.

 

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 23 Sep 19 2.44pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by jeeagles

Wouldn't be against shorter working hours or 4 more bank holidays. The UK works far too hard compared to Europe, the 3 day week showed this wouldn't necessarily impact productivity. More free time could increase spending in the economy. Increased time to train and study, potentially lower unemployment, potential health benefits to the workforce.

A lot of businesses have the current pay rates factored into their business model with employees already working at their peak. Supermarkets are azprime example. You want to not work as hard as now when a lot of businesses rely on the output at the current level.

As you can see, Iím lost on the logic here. It might work in jobs where thereís a lot of downtime, like in career office professional jobs but in manual jobs or where employees are essentially just a number then I donít see how this works or makes any sense. Youíre just increasing the highest cost in a business by 20%. In the end the U.K. would just be less competitive.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (23 Sep 2019 2.47pm)

 


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View dollardays's Profile dollardays Flag 23 Sep 19 2.48pm Send a Private Message to dollardays Add dollardays as a friend

I'm not a Labour supporter, but poll after poll of late appear to paint him as the most unpopular leader of a major party OF ALL TIME. Based on that fact, I'd say that anyone would be better than Corbyn. Regardless of any positives or negatives that there are with a leader and their policies, if the brand becomes that toxic to the general public you're fighting a losing battle.

The only feasible plus side I can see with him is that 'if' (huge if) he did find himself in power, it's next to impossible for him to become less popular than he already is, and so a potential upside emerges depending on how the reality stacks up against the perception.

 

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View W12's Profile W12 Flag 23 Sep 19 2.54pm Send a Private Message to W12 Add W12 as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Do we support private fire brigades or private armies?

This essentially comes down to what we think is best served via communal effort and what we understand is best served via private ownership.

Private schools are elitist.....I see the benefit of them but it's essentially a benefit for a few.

I see some weaknesses within my own position as well.....I mean if we ban private schools we surrender a plank of meritocracy where the supposed best minds are housed and educated together (when in reality it's more often the richest)....the idea being that we have the best in the most important positions.

But...errrr.

Look at what the products from these schools and later universities have been doing to this country over the last fifty years.

So f**k them.

Come swim in the pool you created.


Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Sep 2019 9.58am)

I came from a sink estate in South London (one of the worse) and through hard work now have two children in private school. Recently I've been complaining to one of the schools that my son is being forced to attend an "Individuals in Society" lesson including every crappy social justice topic you can imagine - yes clearly left wing indoctrination involved. But the problem here is the government now mandate this anyway.

I would still rather they were in private education as apart from anything else they are physically safer and have a better pupil / student ratio. My heart goes out to most people that have to use state schools although I know there are a few good ones (although generally hogged by the middle classes).

I didn't create the pool you mention and have been actively campaigning to swim away from it. I would agree though that with most of the parents there is only one specific type of politics they will tolerate. James O'Brien is one of the other parents at the school for example.

It's not a very "diverse" school by the way.


 

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View cryrst's Profile cryrst Online Flag Chatham 23 Sep 19 4.00pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by jeeagles

Wouldn't be against shorter working hours or 4 more bank holidays. The UK works far too hard compared to Europe, the 3 day week showed this wouldn't necessarily impact productivity. More free time could increase spending in the economy. Increased time to train and study, potentially lower unemployment, potential health benefits to the workforce.

More free time to do what.
Worry about your employment status.
Which in turn stresses you out.
Maybe that's it; more stress; more death; reduced population.
This is TIC but c'mon how is this affordable to us and business.
Worrying times if you feel socialism is not good.
Private schools ; snatch all assets and share around.
Next is private properties, snatch and share the wealth.
Then cars
The list is endless.
Socialism is fine,until you run out of other peoples money.
Check Venezuela and rhodesia for examples.

 

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