2020 US Presidential Election. (LOCKED)
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 Maine Eagle  USA 04 Nov 20 3.40pm |
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Originally posted by Matov
If Biden gets more electoral college seats should Trump concede? Yes. That is the way democracy works. Have the Democrats, with their Deep State backers, gamed this election? Then without a shadow of a doubt. These postal votes stink, they really do but unless large, wide scaled fraud can be proved (and to be fair, I think any claims do need to be stress tested through the courts) then the result has to stand. All I do know is that if large states like Texas and Florida can collect and then count their votes and give a result on the day, then I struggle to comprehend why others cannot. Covid is just a BS excuse. And in any other 'normal' election cycle, Trump would have strolled this election. Biden will probably be President. But with a Senate that is dominated by Republicans. He is a lame duck leader presciding over a country riven in half with some serious questions to be asked about the tactics that got him into the job. NOBODY emerges from this with any kind of credit. And with the biggest irony of all being that the most maligned and slated group of people in 2020 aka White males, are the ones who perhaps have defeated Trump with his share of the vote in almost every other category actually increasing. Which when you think for a man who has been constantly derided as being both sexist and racist is not a bad legacy. Democracy is the real loser today, no matter what the outcome. Trump has built up an almost cult like following and they will not take this result lightly. A shocking election and perhaps a lesson for all of us. With those who did their best to over turn the Brexit result from 2016 along with cheering on the fruitless attempts to somehow impeach Trump over the last four years no doubt crowing about 'democracy'. Do any of us honestly care anymore about a truly 'fair' outcome? Or are we all so twisted up in the cylce of fear and loathing stoked by all sides in our political process, allied with a Social Media industry who care for nothing else other than click bait that we have simply abandoned the notion of agreeing to not agree but to do so in a civilised manner? Guilty as charged here. Have to admit that. Need to change that. I have seen what a real civil war looks like. Stood in charred ruins, still able to smell the fire in the air they destroyed the roof (you want to 'cleanse' a village or town of people you don't like then you drive them out of their homes, set fire to their roofs and let nature do the rest. Nobody is every setting foot back in that property again). We are heading that way. We truly are. Unless we somehow all pull back from the brink and accept the results of elections, even if we do not agree with them. Postal votes dont stink. There is zero proof of that. Trump even created a committee after 2016 to prove widescale fraud, and staffed it with partisan hacks, and they found absolutely nothing. Covid has increased mail in voting exponentially, which anyone can understand will make changes to processes and cause delays. Different counties in England really dont have different approaches but each State here has a lot of autonomy for how they do this. Some started counting millions of mail in votes 2 weeks ago, some started last night, its just the way it is here. Some decent points here, matov, but we need to evidence and prove things like postal votes "stinking". The world is generally moving in a direction of division, not unity, and social media and specifically facebook has a lot to answer for. If Biden wins he will be the president of everyone. Trump performs for his base only. Trump is an ENORMOUS part of many of the problems and issues you are talking about.
Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha. |
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| Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 04 Nov 20 3.50pm |
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I think what Trump is concerned about is the possibility of fraudulant postal votes entering the system 'after the event'. I heard him say somewhere the other day that he was aware of postal votes arriving that hadn't got a posted date on the outside. The system would presumably count these if they arrived on or before Election Day but somebody could intercept the system and add additional postal votes (without a posted date) today or tomorrow depending on the situation. This is where I think his concern is.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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| The Dolphin 04 Nov 20 3.52pm |
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Great post Matov.
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| The Dolphin 04 Nov 20 4.08pm |
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Maine - I can't see your point on Biden being President of everyone I'm afraid.
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| The Dolphin 04 Nov 20 4.08pm |
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Or he will be if he wins!
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| IMpalace London 04 Nov 20 4.15pm |
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Originally posted by Matov
Do any of us honestly care anymore about a truly 'fair' outcome? Or are we all so twisted up in the cylce of fear and loathing stoked by all sides in our political process, allied with a Social Media industry who care for nothing else other than click bait that we have simply abandoned the notion of agreeing to not agree but to do so in a civilised manner? Guilty as charged here. Have to admit that. Need to change that. A depressing feature of the modern world - a mindset whereby changing your mind based on new information or someone else's opinion somehow makes you weak or the loser. Is there anything stupider than not updating your views based on new information? So deeply entrenched are people in their views that they think their opinion is fact. "The only way my view cannot be the majority is through foul play". Unbelievable arrogance. As you say, a major threat to democracy.
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| Maine Eagle USA 04 Nov 20 4.23pm |
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Originally posted by The Dolphin
Maine - I can't see your point on Biden being President of everyone I'm afraid. Biden will damn well be more people's president than Trump, who panders only to his right wing base. Biden is a working class guy from Scranton. Trump is a billionaire. Ask yourself how a draft dodging billionaire NYC real estate developer who has given massive tax cuts to the elites, is somehow fighting for the little guy. Its a myth. Sorry but people have been duped. His policies are not bringing the coal industry back. His policies are not helping farmers. His policies are shutting car factories and manufacturing plants. It is true that more educated people are generally democrats, whereas less educated people are generally republicans. Make of that what you will. A PhD doesnt mean you are able to tell right from wrong, but living in a trailer believing QAnon bollocks means you are probably a f***ing idiot and sure doesnt make you right.
Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha. |
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| Maine Eagle USA 04 Nov 20 4.30pm |
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Originally posted by Behind Enemy Lines
I think what Trump is concerned about is the possibility of fraudulant postal votes entering the system 'after the event'. I heard him say somewhere the other day that he was aware of postal votes arriving that hadn't got a posted date on the outside. The system would presumably count these if they arrived on or before Election Day but somebody could intercept the system and add additional postal votes (without a posted date) today or tomorrow depending on the situation. This is where I think his concern is. Trump is concerned about losing. He will do anything, illegal, legal, precedented or unprecedented to avoid losing. Part of that is he hates to lose and is so insecure that he cannot show a weakness or a loss publicly. He is the original schoolyard bully. Punch him in the nose in front of everyone and he cries like a bitch. Another part of it is he is going to be in jail soon if he loses. Regarding mail in votes each state has different rules, some allow mail in votes to come in 3 days late, with no post mark, such as Pennsylvania. There is NO evidence whatsoever of any systemic fraud or issues with mail in ballots. Many states ONLY support mail in ballots and have for years. It is a Trump smokescreen because he knows Biden is more popular with people who take covid seriously, and therefore decided to mail their vote. Its not rocket science. The GOP is trying to steal the election by claiming that mail in ballots are somehow invalid or fraudulent. There is no evidence of that whatsoever at any level. Sadly for Trump Biden is getting 70% of the mail in vote, so he wants them to not count. Each American is allowed to vote, unfortunately for Trump.
Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha. |
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| SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 04 Nov 20 4.35pm |
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Originally posted by Maine Eagle
Postal votes dont stink. There is zero proof of that. Trump even created a committee after 2016 to prove widescale fraud, and staffed it with partisan hacks, and they found absolutely nothing. Covid has increased mail in voting exponentially, which anyone can understand will make changes to processes and cause delays. Different counties in England really dont have different approaches but each State here has a lot of autonomy for how they do this. Some started counting millions of mail in votes 2 weeks ago, some started last night, its just the way it is here. Some decent points here, matov, but we need to evidence and prove things like postal votes "stinking". The world is generally moving in a direction of division, not unity, and social media and specifically facebook has a lot to answer for. If Biden wins he will be the president of everyone. Trump performs for his base only. Trump is an ENORMOUS part of many of the problems and issues you are talking about. This Seems people are forgetting this is how the postal voting system works. Nothing new. Dem voters tend to be the ones that use the postal system more – republican voters probably don't because of the trump narrative that they're dodgy, then use the over weighting as evidence of a conspiracy. The machine really does feed itself. Also, as has been pointed out, Trump is only contesting the states where he was ahead and is now in danger of being behind or losing. 'Magically disappearing this lead'. Didn't see him complaining when he magically disappeared Bidens lead during last nights counts when he was down in quite a lot of key states. He's a complete moron, antagonistic and dirty as hell when it comes to doing anything he can to prevent losing. Which is fine in business, although one could argue it's not served him well what with him being in at least 1bn of debt starting to come due next year. But to deliberately antagonise and make an inordinate amount of baseless claims to try to disrupt the integrity of the entire democratic process for his own agenda? Bellend. As I said earlier, I'd rather neither of them won and two new candidates with some element of integrity (and I'd accept a low level, doesn't take much to better Trump) fought it out. Complete nonsense
Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons. |
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| SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 04 Nov 20 4.40pm |
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Originally posted by Maine Eagle
Trump is concerned about losing. He will do anything, illegal, legal, precedented or unprecedented to avoid losing. Part of that is he hates to lose and is so insecure that he cannot show a weakness or a loss publicly. He is the original schoolyard bully. Punch him in the nose in front of everyone and he cries like a bitch. Another part of it is he is going to be in jail soon if he loses. Regarding mail in votes each state has different rules, some allow mail in votes to come in 3 days late, with no post mark, such as Pennsylvania. There is NO evidence whatsoever of any systemic fraud or issues with mail in ballots. Many states ONLY support mail in ballots and have for years. It is a Trump smokescreen because he knows Biden is more popular with people who take covid seriously, and therefore decided to mail their vote. Its not rocket science. The GOP is trying to steal the election by claiming that mail in ballots are somehow invalid or fraudulent. There is no evidence of that whatsoever at any level. Sadly for Trump Biden is getting 70% of the mail in vote, so he wants them to not count. Each American is allowed to vote, unfortunately for Trump. Indeed. People can lap up the strategic decision to attack the postal voting system, but that's all it is, a strategy to delay, distract and deflect. It's the last cheesey gasps and bloated thrashes of a campaign that appears to be faltering. Do the republicans actually believe postal fraud is a widespread issue? Undoubtably no. It's a strategic play. If you can't understand that, you're an idiot.
Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons. |
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| matthau South Croydon 04 Nov 20 4.46pm |
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Teddy Eagle  04 Nov 20 4.48pm |
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Originally posted by Maine Eagle
Biden will damn well be more people's president than Trump, who panders only to his right wing base. Biden is a working class guy from Scranton. Trump is a billionaire. Ask yourself how a draft dodging billionaire NYC real estate developer who has given massive tax cuts to the elites, is somehow fighting for the little guy. Its a myth. Sorry but people have been duped. His policies are not bringing the coal industry back. His policies are not helping farmers. His policies are shutting car factories and manufacturing plants. It is true that more educated people are generally democrats, whereas less educated people are generally republicans. Make of that what you will. A PhD doesnt mean you are able to tell right from wrong, but living in a trailer believing QAnon bollocks means you are probably a f***ing idiot and sure doesnt make you right. How much will Biden be able to affect if the Republicans retain control of the Senate?
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