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June 6 2023 11.35am

Letís celebrate the left

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MrWhyNot Flag 13 Jan 23 1.12am

I find, after many years around the block and following indepth discussions galore, that it really is Armada talk that gets people going.

Edited by MrWhyNot (13 Jan 2023 1.30am)

 

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Flag 13 Jan 23 1.25am Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by MrWhyNot

I find, after many years around the block and following indepth discussions galore, that is really is Armada talk that gets people going.

That's the Charles Howard fan club for you.

 

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MrWhyNot Flag 13 Jan 23 1.30am

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

That's the Charles Howard fan club for you.

. Indeed!

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 13 Jan 23 7.42am Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by MrWhyNot

I find, after many years around the block and following indepth discussions galore, that it really is Armada talk that gets people going.

Edited by MrWhyNot (13 Jan 2023 1.30am)

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

 

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 13 Jan 23 8.19am Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

People who hate our history and historical figures aren't needed here.

Most of them aren't us or don't align themselves with us seeing themselves as more 'citizens of the world'. As was said earlier they instinctively look to criticise and pull down what we are. These people end up being a problem for most countries.

There's a border, they can cross it.

But they just won't go.
Tells you everything you need to know.

Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Jan 2023 1.07am)

And that is how you would view Josia Wedgwood or destalinisation in the USSR. You really hate change and also the truth finally coming out.

Whilst from what I have seen all types of people have been involved in requesting the removal of certain statues and icons, for some reason you focus on those that arenít us. Your racism is less overt than Hrolf. Your meaning, however, is clear.

Edited by Mapletree (13 Jan 2023 8.29am)

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 13 Jan 23 8.51am Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

And that is how you would view Josia Wedgwood or destalinisation in the USSR. You really hate change and also the truth finally coming out.

Whilst from what I have seen all types of people have been involved in requesting the removal of certain statues and icons, for some reason you focus on those that arenít us. Your racism is less overt than Hrolf. Your meaning, however, is clear.

Edited by Mapletree (13 Jan 2023 8.29am)

What destalinisation?
What, the Judean People's Front, the People's Front of Judea and the Judean Popular People's Front?

Edited by georgenorman (13 Jan 2023 9.07am)

 

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View Spiderman's Profile Spiderman Online Flag Horsham 13 Jan 23 8.56am Send a Private Message to Spiderman Add Spiderman as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

So those that then bought the slaves are innocent? Same rationale as prostitution and ivory trade. Make a market and merchants will feed it.

Has anyone on here said they were innocent? I canít recall that. The point was that, initially the slaves were captured and sold by, predominantly, Africans. Very rarely do you here outrage against black slave traders

 

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View Spiderman's Profile Spiderman Online Flag Horsham 13 Jan 23 9.00am Send a Private Message to Spiderman Add Spiderman as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Stupid post. Just tell the story as objectively as possible. Including Elizabethís dodgy deals with Drake. Looks like he took after his father. Probably learned at his knee.

Thanks for your kind words

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 13 Jan 23 9.13am Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Stupid post. Just tell the story as objectively as possible. Including Elizabethís dodgy deals with Drake. Looks like he took after his father. Probably learned at his knee.

What was Drake's father guilty of then? Or is it just some woke use of personal pronouns?

Edited by georgenorman (13 Jan 2023 9.16am)

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 13 Jan 23 9.19am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

It is also notable what happened to the British sailors during and after the engagement. Left to rot on ships riven with disease. Eventually sent home, mostly sick, with no pay. That is a major part of the real history. Airbrushed out as an inconvenient truth.

Iceni Rebellion (Failure confirmed Roman rule in Britain)
1066 (Failure confirmed Norman rule)
Bannockburn (English kicked out of Scotland)
Dunkirk (Allies defeated but brought home to the public this was total war and stiffened morale).

To name just a few, all defeats not airbrushed because of the significant consequences.

If it happen last week the English Armada would be newsworthy when you are looking at 3000 years of English history it's not.

 


One more point

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 13 Jan 23 9.28am Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

Iceni Rebellion (Failure confirmed Roman rule in Britain)
1066 (Failure confirmed Norman rule)
Bannockburn (English kicked out of Scotland)
Dunkirk (Allies defeated but brought home to the public this was total war and stiffened morale).

To name just a few, all defeats not airbrushed because of the significant consequences.

If it happen last week the English Armada would be newsworthy when you are looking at 3000 years of English history it's not.

You left out the 2014 World Cup.

 

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View Nicholas91's Profile Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 13 Jan 23 9.40am Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

What grinds my gears on this is not the actions here themselves but rather the inspiration or driving force behind it and therefore general tone.

I still maintain this is not a racial thing at all, it's a cultural thing which has little to do with ethnicity and more to do with the empowerment of failures today. It's people who have little else to hang an identity they can take pride in on and therefore seen as an 'easy win' to martyr themselves or acquire some sort of status within this community. Doesn't matter whether you come from a 'BAME' background or some white kid who was bullied at school, it's the same sentiment and we see the whole spectrum of these types.

There's a difference between objectively looking to review the narrative to provide a factual and balanced representation of somebody and just attacking whomever you can as you think this validates your existence. I can't be the only one who was told 'stop moaning' as a youngster (particularly on the football pitch for me, often around the criticism of the belief in 'throwing the ball down the line' - why???) but I understand why as an adult even if I didn't then.

Slavery was an awful, truly unimaginable by today's society, part of history however it is part of history, aligned to many cultures, geographical regions and peoples. That should be acknowledged. I'm not saying we have to deify such people but to try and remove them from history for a fault assigned to them by the standards of today when their initial place was due to their achievements and contributions to build the society we now have is quite unbalanced and ungrateful IMHO. It's a bit like a child, whether biological or adopted, attacking a parent who provided them a fantastic life, and an inheritance to live well now, on the basis they were 'a bit of a prick at work' after scrutinising their biography. I also think to claim outrage, injustice and social reform off the back of the suffering of others is quite repugnant too. There's plenty of people, from all walks of life and backgrounds, who can and may acknowledge these things but for whom actually building something with their own lives is far more important than tearing down others. That needs to be acknowledged for balance too.

I do understand the 'attack on British heritage' stance, even if I don't think it's as cut and dry to be completely labelled as that. If there was a well intended and balanced approach perhaps rename after somebody, from a plentiful lot to choose from, who did contribute to British and World history with a cleaner record instead of a couple trees out front? There would appear to be no intention to do that however, it is solely for many to enjoy the most arrogant possible belief: that they as individuals are ushering in some sort of Utopia as they are the very best a human can and ever has been and therefore have the right to set the world straight. A world they've probably contributed little to I will add.


 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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