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June 25 2022 3.42am

Starmer & Rayner

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View Forest Hillbilly's Profile Forest Hillbilly Flag in a hidey-hole 21 May 22 7.40am Send a Private Message to Forest Hillbilly Add Forest Hillbilly as a friend

Seemingly, a bit of an odd pairing. Like fire and ice. Or stir-fried chilli ginger and slightly tepid water.
Starmer has had plenty to get his teeth into, but seemed to wave the white flag over Covid and Ukraine, in order to let the Government "get on with the job".
Starmer's legal background appears to be a hinderance to be an effective critic of anything Government does. Rayner seems a mis-match because she wants to call things out with language that is so borderline as to take attention from the subject at hand , to focus on the ferocity of her linguistics.

 


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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 21 May 22 9.02am Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly

Seemingly, a bit of an odd pairing. Like fire and ice. Or stir-fried chilli ginger and slightly tepid water.
Starmer has had plenty to get his teeth into, but seemed to wave the white flag over Covid and Ukraine, in order to let the Government "get on with the job".
Starmer's legal background appears to be a hinderance to be an effective critic of anything Government does. Rayner seems a mis-match because she wants to call things out with language that is so borderline as to take attention from the subject at hand , to focus on the ferocity of her linguistics.

Starmer and Rayner are not a 'partnership'. There is no sense of synergy about them. Think of it as a marriage of convenience in which they don't even live in the same house, let alone share a bed.

She is there to placate the left of the party. That's it. Meant to be their 'voice' in the senior leadership.

And whilst I think Starmer is everything you probably do, let's not forget that Covid has been the great disrupter. History changing. Even defining the next 20 years or so, just like the September 11th attacks in 2001 did for the next couple of decades. There was no correct way of handling it on any political level, merely just trying to ensure that as little s*** as possible landed on you and trying to survive the fallout.

Plus Ukraine. The people who Starmer answers too are the ones most vocal in backing it. With Johnson on the same side as them. What can more can he do to 'oppose' it?

Ironically, Corbyn's economic policies are probably more popular than ever. 2017. 40% of the vote. Never forget that. Then Starmer decided to get himself a standing ovation at the 2018 Labour party conference and the rest is history.

We do not live in a time in which any conventional political metric seems to matter anymore. The game is now played by different rules. We just have to play catch up.

 


In 1967, when Polish mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life, replied: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 21 May 22 10.52am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Chatting to my Danish neighbour about life over there and came to this conclusion.

Socialism in this country is all about helping the poor whilst taxing the better off. (I am trying to be fair).

Socialism in Scandinavia has the same aim however in order to make it more acceptable to the people who will be paying for it everybody is entitled to the same level of benefits.

I do not understand how Labour have not accepted this. If you want the tax paying middle classes to vote for you offer them a carrot.

After 30 years of paying the higher rate of tax I was briefly unemployed for 6 weeks. The oik at the job centre told me I was not entitled to anything. You can imagine how I felt that others who have never paid anything get "theirs" whilst I was told to go whistle.

If I was a Labour supporter I would be arguing for universal benefits.

Edited by Badger11 (21 May 2022 10.53am)

 


One more point

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 21 May 22 11.00am Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

Chatting to my Danish neighbour about life over there and came to this conclusion.

Socialism in this country is all about helping the poor whilst taxing the better off. (I am trying to be fair).

Socialism in Scandinavia has the same aim however in order to make it more acceptable to the people who will be paying for it everybody is entitled to the same level of benefits.

I do not understand how Labour have not accepted this. If you want the tax paying middle classes to vote for you offer them a carrot.

After 30 years of paying the higher rate of tax I was briefly unemployed for 6 weeks. The oik at the job centre told me I was not entitled to anything. You can imagine how I felt that others who have never paid anything get "theirs" whilst I was told to go whistle.

If I was a Labour supporter I would be arguing for universal benefits.

Edited by Badger11 (21 May 2022 10.53am)

Universal benefits, a simplified tax system which is applied across the board on all income, ideas that have validity. But we have a political class who are not interested in making things simple. To many vested interests in the complexity. This is the ultimate failure of our modern democracy.

 


In 1967, when Polish mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life, replied: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."

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View Jacey's Profile Jacey Flag 01 Jun 22 10.15am Send a Private Message to Jacey Add Jacey as a friend

A pitiful Government and an even worse Opposition.
Is it any wonder that many are leaving the UK to find pastures new with a rather weak,ineffective Starmer likely to become our PM in the next couple of years??

[Link]

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 01 Jun 22 10.33am Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

Chatting to my Danish neighbour about life over there and came to this conclusion.

Socialism in this country is all about helping the poor whilst taxing the better off. (I am trying to be fair).

Socialism in Scandinavia has the same aim however in order to make it more acceptable to the people who will be paying for it everybody is entitled to the same level of benefits.

I do not understand how Labour have not accepted this. If you want the tax paying middle classes to vote for you offer them a carrot.

After 30 years of paying the higher rate of tax I was briefly unemployed for 6 weeks. The oik at the job centre told me I was not entitled to anything. You can imagine how I felt that others who have never paid anything get "theirs" whilst I was told to go whistle.

If I was a Labour supporter I would be arguing for universal benefits.

Edited by Badger11 (21 May 2022 10.53am)

I don't get this - Labour are not a socialist party and are not suggesting a socialist government. They have done everything they can to distance themselves from the Corbyn left of the party and economically they are basically centre-right under Starmer.

Starmer's Labour seem more wedded to austerity politics than the Tories.

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 01 Jun 22 11.35am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Dick Dastardly & Muttley?

 

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View ASCPFC's Profile ASCPFC Flag Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 01 Jun 22 11.52am Send a Private Message to ASCPFC Add ASCPFC as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

Dick Dastardly & Muttley?

Not quite Penelope Pitstop anyway.

 


Patrick Viera's
Red and Blue Army!

He decked a bin dipper - respect.

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View Fatherken's Profile Fatherken Flag 01 Jun 22 12.02pm Send a Private Message to Fatherken Add Fatherken as a friend

I think with these two in charge Labour will not get elected , even if Boris is in charge for the Tories .

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 01 Jun 22 12.15pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

I don't get this - Labour are not a socialist party and are not suggesting a socialist government. They have done everything they can to distance themselves from the Corbyn left of the party and economically they are basically centre-right under Starmer.

Starmer's Labour seem more wedded to austerity politics than the Tories.

Exactly. During the pandemic all we got from Labour is "we'd do the same only better."

I think this is a missed opportunity in the past Labour have talked about Scandinavian socialism but they have never been serious about it. It means higher taxes but also universal benefits.

 


One more point

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View croydon proud's Profile croydon proud Flag Any european country i fancy! 01 Jun 22 3.48pm Send a Private Message to croydon proud Add croydon proud as a friend

Originally posted by Jacey

A pitiful Government and an even worse Opposition.
Is it any wonder that many are leaving the UK to find pastures new with a rather weak,ineffective Starmer likely to become our PM in the next couple of years??

[Link]

Perhaps , or perhaps they are leaving britain now because of a weak, ineffective Boris as actual pm now?

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 01 Jun 22 4.43pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by croydon proud

Perhaps , or perhaps they are leaving britain now because of a weak, ineffective Boris as actual pm now?

No, no - it must be the hypothetical Starmer government in 3 years.

 

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