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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.14am
Originally posted by becky If all votes in the House were secret, and not recorded for public access, how would any of us know what stance our MP took on matters of importance to us, so we could assess at the next election whether or not he is serving what we see as our best interests or what he/she regards as best for their constituents? How would we then know who to vote for? You wouldn't. You would have to decide on character and what they have done for you locally. How they have behaved and what arguments they make for and against things. As I have said many times they are representatives and not delegates. Your own vote is secret. You decide that for yourself and no-one has any right to know it. The same should apply to an MP, who should be free of all pressures to use only their best judgement and conscience to decide what is the best course of action. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.14am

Originally posted by becky

If all votes in the House were secret, and not recorded for public access, how would any of us know what stance our MP took on matters of importance to us, so we could assess at the next election whether or not he is serving what we see as our best interests or what he/she regards as best for their constituents? How would we then know who to vote for?

You wouldn't. You would have to decide on character and what they have done for you locally. How they have behaved and what arguments they make for and against things. As I have said many times they are representatives and not delegates.

Your own vote is secret. You decide that for yourself and no-one has any right to know it. The same should apply to an MP, who should be free of all pressures to use only their best judgement and conscience to decide what is the best course of action.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.17am
Originally posted by cryrst Put prediction in your search bar and that's the definition. It returns "forecast". For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.17am

Originally posted by cryrst

Put prediction in your search bar and that's the definition.

It returns "forecast".

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.25am
Originally posted by YT Wrong, I'm afraid. The Queen's Speech is held at the start of each session of parliament. The current queen has delivered around 60 of them. Of course but not by a minority government which is pressing for a GE. This was a blatant political manoeuvre which took advantage of the Queen. I bet she is "not pleased". For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.25am

Originally posted by YT

Wrong, I'm afraid. The Queen's Speech is held at the start of each session of parliament. The current queen has delivered around 60 of them.

Of course but not by a minority government which is pressing for a GE. This was a blatant political manoeuvre which took advantage of the Queen. I bet she is "not pleased".

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.30am
Originally posted by Badger11 When Parliament returned most pundits expected Corbyn to call for a vote of no confidence in the government. If Corbyn had done that and defeated the government he and Johnson could have agreed a GE timetable so the Benn act would not have been required. I noticed your condemnation of the Queens's speech is an almost word for word repeat of what Corbyn said yesterday. I think we know where your politics lie. Edited by Badger11 (15 Oct 2019 7.45am) Untrue. Many people were sceptical of the timing and suggesting that nothing was certain. Corbyn himself needed some convincing but that's because he isn't always a clear strategic thinker. If there is any similarity in what I said and what Corbyn did then it is either purely co-incidental or 100% true. I didn't copy him and I doubt if he reads the HOL. So you decide. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 10.30am

Originally posted by Badger11

When Parliament returned most pundits expected Corbyn to call for a vote of no confidence in the government. If Corbyn had done that and defeated the government he and Johnson could have agreed a GE timetable so the Benn act would not have been required.

I noticed your condemnation of the Queens's speech is an almost word for word repeat of what Corbyn said yesterday. I think we know where your politics lie.

Edited by Badger11 (15 Oct 2019 7.45am)

Untrue. Many people were sceptical of the timing and suggesting that nothing was certain. Corbyn himself needed some convincing but that's because he isn't always a clear strategic thinker.

If there is any similarity in what I said and what Corbyn did then it is either purely co-incidental or 100% true. I didn't copy him and I doubt if he reads the HOL. So you decide.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 15 Oct 19 10.37am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle You wouldn't. You would have to decide on character and what they have done for you locally. How they have behaved and what arguments they make for and against things. As I have said many times they are representatives and not delegates. Your own vote is secret. You decide that for yourself and no-one has any right to know it. The same should apply to an MP, who should be free of all pressures to use only their best judgement and conscience to decide what is the best course of action. But they are elected by people to serve their constituents. Not to do whatever they please in their ivory towers. The public who vote have a right to privacy but your argument is complete rubbish for MPs. They have to be under scrutiny. You are getting them mixed up with the best of the best - which they are not. As someone once said, they are not really that good. Red and Blue Army!

ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 15 Oct 19 10.37am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

But they are elected by people to serve their constituents. Not to do whatever they please in their ivory towers. The public who vote have a right to privacy but your argument is complete rubbish for MPs. They have to be under scrutiny. You are getting them mixed up with the best of the best - which they are not. As someone once said, they are not really that good.

Red and Blue Army!

Hrolf The Ganger 15 Oct 19 11.05am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Of course they aren't. They are refusing to allow one yet. Until the threat of a "no deal" Brexit has been removed. Calling one now and allowing Johnson to determine, or benefit from, the timing would be beyond stupid. It would be irresponsible. How often is it necessary to point out to you that however people originally voted the opposition is now to a "no deal" exit. Once that has been secured we can see how best we can go ahead. Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Oct 2019 9.45pm) You obviously support Labour despite your claims. You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit. You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject. Are you a Palace fan or an activist?

Hrolf The Ganger

15 Oct 19 11.05am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Of course they aren't.

They are refusing to allow one yet. Until the threat of a "no deal" Brexit has been removed.

Calling one now and allowing Johnson to determine, or benefit from, the timing would be beyond stupid. It would be irresponsible.

How often is it necessary to point out to you that however people originally voted the opposition is now to a "no deal" exit. Once that has been secured we can see how best we can go ahead.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Oct 2019 9.45pm)

You obviously support Labour despite your claims.
You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit.

You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject.

Are you a Palace fan or an activist?

YT Oxford 15 Oct 19 11.16am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Of course but not by a minority government which is pressing for a GE. This was a blatant political manoeuvre which took advantage of the Queen. I bet she is "not pleased". So you admit that your original post was wrong then, do you? Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

Oxford 15 Oct 19 11.16am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Of course but not by a minority government which is pressing for a GE. This was a blatant political manoeuvre which took advantage of the Queen. I bet she is "not pleased".

So you admit that your original post was wrong then, do you?

Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

johnno42000 15 Oct 19 11.16am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You obviously support Labour despite your claims. You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit. You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject. Are you a Palace fan or an activist? Couldn't that be true for a lot of posters? 'Lies to the masses as are like fly's to mollasses...they want more and more and more'

johnno42000

15 Oct 19 11.16am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You obviously support Labour despite your claims.
You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit.

You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject.

Are you a Palace fan or an activist?

Couldn't that be true for a lot of posters?

'Lies to the masses as are like fly's to mollasses...they want more and more and more'

Hrolf The Ganger 15 Oct 19 11.19am
Originally posted by johnno42000 Couldn't that be true for a lot of posters? For example?

Hrolf The Ganger

15 Oct 19 11.19am

Originally posted by johnno42000

Couldn't that be true for a lot of posters?

For example?

robdave2k 15 Oct 19 1.35pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Untrue. Many people were sceptical of the timing and suggesting that nothing was certain. Corbyn himself needed some convincing but that's because he isn't always a clear strategic thinker. If there is any similarity in what I said and what Corbyn did then it is either purely co-incidental or 100% true. I didn't copy him and I doubt if he reads the HOL. So you decide. Loosely translated as he has splinters in his arse due to the fence sitting and will fall on the side the wind is blowing at a particular moment. At least no one can accuse you of having splinters in your backside.

robdave2k

15 Oct 19 1.35pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Untrue. Many people were sceptical of the timing and suggesting that nothing was certain. Corbyn himself needed some convincing but that's because he isn't always a clear strategic thinker.

If there is any similarity in what I said and what Corbyn did then it is either purely co-incidental or 100% true. I didn't copy him and I doubt if he reads the HOL. So you decide.

Loosely translated as he has splinters in his arse due to the fence sitting and will fall on the side the wind is blowing at a particular moment.

At least no one can accuse you of having splinters in your backside.

dannyboy1978 15 Oct 19 1.37pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle What on earth are you talking about? Forecasts and opinions can be wrong, but that doesn't mean they are guesses. Nor does it mean that when politicians make campaign pledges that they are necessarily based on forecasts. Just as Johnson did yesterday they are much more often just wish lists offered as carrots to donkeys. Edited by Wisbech Eagle (15 Oct 2019 10.21am) You know excactly what I'm talking about, and it prooved your point mute that's why you want on the defensive. Experts/ experience lol Why would anyone keep listening to the same people who predict things wrong. Do the same thing get the same results! Edited by dannyboy1978 (15 Oct 2019 1.40pm)

dannyboy1978

15 Oct 19 1.37pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

What on earth are you talking about?

Forecasts and opinions can be wrong, but that doesn't mean they are guesses.

Nor does it mean that when politicians make campaign pledges that they are necessarily based on forecasts. Just as Johnson did yesterday they are much more often just wish lists offered as carrots to donkeys.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (15 Oct 2019 10.21am)

You know excactly what I'm talking about, and it prooved your point mute that's why you want on the defensive. Experts/ experience lol
Why would anyone keep listening to the same people who predict things wrong. Do the same thing get the same results!

Edited by dannyboy1978 (15 Oct 2019 1.40pm)

Lyons550 Shirley 15 Oct 19 2.28pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle I see. So it’s not refusing to allow an election when it’s in our best interest. Nothing to do with thinking they might not win. Its like having a conversation with a deaf uncle isnt it Edited by Lyons550 (15 Oct 2019 2.29pm) The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

Lyons550

Shirley 15 Oct 19 2.28pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

I see. So it’s not refusing to allow an election when it’s in our best interest. Nothing to do with thinking they might not win.

Its like having a conversation with a deaf uncle isnt it

Edited by Lyons550 (15 Oct 2019 2.29pm)

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

Lyons550 Shirley 15 Oct 19 2.38pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops Well said. The architects of a poor or no deal are actually the remainers within the government. If they had all got behind a deal from the start and allowed us to hardball the negotiations with Brussels this would all be done and dusted now and we would be well into a new era. I have to say I agree wholeheartedly with this The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

Lyons550

Shirley 15 Oct 19 2.38pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Well said. The architects of a poor or no deal are actually the remainers within the government. If they had all got behind a deal from the start and allowed us to hardball the negotiations with Brussels this would all be done and dusted now and we would be well into a new era.

I have to say I agree wholeheartedly with this

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

Hrolf The Ganger 15 Oct 19 4.19pm
Originally posted by Lyons550 I have to say I agree wholeheartedly with this So you want to blame a small amount of Tories who are now out of the picture and not Labour, Liberals and SNP with their Benn Act, court cases and continuous obstruction?

Hrolf The Ganger

15 Oct 19 4.19pm

Originally posted by Lyons550

I have to say I agree wholeheartedly with this

So you want to blame a small amount of Tories who are now out of the picture and not Labour, Liberals and SNP with their Benn Act, court cases and continuous obstruction?

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 4.46pm
Originally posted by ASCPFC But they are elected by people to serve their constituents. Not to do whatever they please in their ivory towers. The public who vote have a right to privacy but your argument is complete rubbish for MPs. They have to be under scrutiny. You are getting them mixed up with the best of the best - which they are not. As someone once said, they are not really that good. They serve their constituents as their representatives and do that by using their best judgement to decide what is in their, and the country's best interests. They cannot do that when keeping one eye on whether their party managers will decide to dump them if they stray from the pen. Allowing them to vote in secret would ensure that their votes followed their true beliefs and not those that of an agenda determined at the centre who are then subjected to the influences of pressure and interest groups and not the people. I want to remove the influence of interest groups and free the MPs to decide for themselves. Only by it being a legal requirement that their votes are secret and never disclosed can that be achieved. I don't want the Unions dictating policy to a Labour government anymore than I want the CBI dictating it to a Tory government. Or Murdoch dictating it to either of them because of the influence he holds. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 4.46pm

Originally posted by ASCPFC

They serve their constituents as their representatives and do that by using their best judgement to decide what is in their, and the country's best interests. They cannot do that when keeping one eye on whether their party managers will decide to dump them if they stray from the pen. Allowing them to vote in secret would ensure that their votes followed their true beliefs and not those that of an agenda determined at the centre who are then subjected to the influences of pressure and interest groups and not the people.

I want to remove the influence of interest groups and free the MPs to decide for themselves. Only by it being a legal requirement that their votes are secret and never disclosed can that be achieved.

I don't want the Unions dictating policy to a Labour government anymore than I want the CBI dictating it to a Tory government. Or Murdoch dictating it to either of them because of the influence he holds.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 4.51pm
Originally posted by YT So you admit that your original post was wrong then, do you? Not really. The point being made was about yesterday's "big occasion" formal Queen's speech being held for political gain. That each session features a less formal one is beside the real point, but if you want to nit pick carry on! For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 4.51pm

Originally posted by YT

So you admit that your original post was wrong then, do you?

Not really. The point being made was about yesterday's "big occasion" formal Queen's speech being held for political gain. That each session features a less formal one is beside the real point, but if you want to nit pick carry on!

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 5.07pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You obviously support Labour despite your claims. You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit. You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject. Are you a Palace fan or an activist? I most certainly don't support Labour, especially under Corbyn. My priority, like that of Parliament, is to stop a "no deal" Brexit. After that it will be up to the MPs to decide when to hold a GE and whether they want to consult the people again. I can begin to see a good argument being made to cancel Brexit altogether which might gain sufficient support in the country as a whole to actually succeed. The SNP threatening to leave the UK if we Brexit might well change a few minds. I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly. I have supported Palace since 1952 and followed them from near and far ever since. As a kid I cycled to the ground and left my bike on the Holmesdale Rd. Was there when we lost to Real Madrid 3-4, when we first gained promotion to the 1st Div and for our first game in it. Hundreds of games over the years. I have watched them in the middle of the night over the net whilst on the other side of the world. So I am not just a fan. I am a fanatic. But I am also politically active! For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 15 Oct 19 5.07pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You obviously support Labour despite your claims.
You would say anything that supports the halting of Brexit.

You arrive here from nowhere and spend your every moment on this subject.

Are you a Palace fan or an activist?

I most certainly don't support Labour, especially under Corbyn. My priority, like that of Parliament, is to stop a "no deal" Brexit. After that it will be up to the MPs to decide when to hold a GE and whether they want to consult the people again.

I can begin to see a good argument being made to cancel Brexit altogether which might gain sufficient support in the country as a whole to actually succeed. The SNP threatening to leave the UK if we Brexit might well change a few minds.

I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly.

I have supported Palace since 1952 and followed them from near and far ever since. As a kid I cycled to the ground and left my bike on the Holmesdale Rd. Was there when we lost to Real Madrid 3-4, when we first gained promotion to the 1st Div and for our first game in it. Hundreds of games over the years. I have watched them in the middle of the night over the net whilst on the other side of the world. So I am not just a fan. I am a fanatic. But I am also politically active!

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

cryrst The garden of England 15 Oct 19 5.41pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle It returns "forecast". Or prophecy and as we know wissy. You are the ultimate sooth sayer.

cryrst

The garden of England 15 Oct 19 5.41pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

It returns "forecast".

Or prophecy and as we know wissy.
You are the ultimate sooth sayer.

cryrst The garden of England 15 Oct 19 5.48pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I most certainly don't support Labour, especially under Corbyn. My priority, like that of Parliament, is to stop a "no deal" Brexit. After that it will be up to the MPs to decide when to hold a GE and whether they want to consult the people again. I can begin to see a good argument being made to cancel Brexit altogether which might gain sufficient support in the country as a whole to actually succeed. The SNP threatening to leave the UK if we Brexit might well change a few minds. I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly. I have supported Palace since 1952 and followed them from near and far ever since. As a kid I cycled to the ground and left my bike on the Holmesdale Rd. Was there when we lost to Real Madrid 3-4, when we first gained promotion to the 1st Div and for our first game in it. Hundreds of games over the years. I have watched them in the middle of the night over the net whilst on the other side of the world. So I am not just a fan. I am a fanatic. But I am also politically active! If you were walking the mutt I hope he dragged you into the pub kicking and screaming. Then the smell and aromas of your favourite ale kept you there for a couple. Dont let me down wissy. I dont like your political arguments but I like the fact you like a yeast.

cryrst

The garden of England 15 Oct 19 5.48pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly.

If you were walking the mutt I hope he dragged you into the pub kicking and screaming.
Then the smell and aromas of your favourite ale kept you there for a couple.
Dont let me down wissy.
I dont like your political arguments but I like the fact you like a yeast.

becky over the moon 15 Oct 19 6.32pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I most certainly don't support Labour, especially under Corbyn. My priority, like that of Parliament, is to stop a "no deal" Brexit. After that it will be up to the MPs to decide when to hold a GE and whether they want to consult the people again. I can begin to see a good argument being made to cancel Brexit altogether which might gain sufficient support in the country as a whole to actually succeed. The SNP threatening to leave the UK if we Brexit might well change a few minds. I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly. I have supported Palace since 1952 and followed them from near and far ever since. As a kid I cycled to the ground and left my bike on the Holmesdale Rd. Was there when we lost to Real Madrid 3-4, when we first gained promotion to the 1st Div and for our first game in it. Hundreds of games over the years. I have watched them in the middle of the night over the net whilst on the other side of the world. So I am not just a fan. I am a fanatic. But I am also politically active! Unless you are an elected Member of Parliament, where you will have a vote on how/if we exit the EU,I would be interested to hear how you expect to achieve this. Unless of course you are part of a Guy Fawkes Mk II conspiracy? A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

becky

over the moon 15 Oct 19 6.32pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I most certainly don't support Labour, especially under Corbyn. My priority, like that of Parliament, is to stop a "no deal" Brexit. After that it will be up to the MPs to decide when to hold a GE and whether they want to consult the people again.

I actually spend very little time on here. I have been out since 11.30 and just got home, which is not unusual. I just type quickly.

Unless you are an elected Member of Parliament, where you will have a vote on how/if we exit the EU,I would be interested to hear how you expect to achieve this.
Unless of course you are part of a Guy Fawkes Mk II conspiracy?

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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