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General Election 2017

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View CambridgeEagle's Profile CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 25 May 17 9.45am Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Extremely hard.

He's part of the 'progressive' collective that will be responsible for Labour's hard defeat.

I predict that he won't take his share of responsibility though....it will be the fault of others.

But once the 'progressives' eventually lose their position at the helm of Labour the truth will be plain as day for all to see.

What truth is this? Please share.

 

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 25 May 17 9.47am

The Tories will win the election in a couple of weeks, not much doubt at all about that. However, it has to be said that their campaign has been awful and will reduce the majority they could have attained.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 25 May 17 9.49am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

The Tories will win the election in a couple of weeks, not much doubt at all about that. However, it has to be said that their campaign has been awful and will reduce the majority they could have attained.

Yep.

May has been over-promoted big-time and even hardened Tories must be a bit concerned about her it's that obvious.

 


Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]


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View Hansy's Profile Hansy Flag 25 May 17 9.55am Send a Private Message to Hansy Add Hansy as a friend

We also saw Increased unemployment from 2005. Budget Deficit increase (Originally a surplus in the first few years of Blair premiership).

Corbyn is promising the world to the young. What they don't realise is the free education they will receive if he wins, they will eventually pay for it in the long run. And if you have people like Abbott who is the Home Secretary, that can't get her figures right and calls all those in favour of Brexit racists. It is a recipe for disaster.

I think I suffered in a Labour run Education period (Having been school from 2001 to 2008, and my local MP being Labour for many years), where we had 30-40 pupils in every class, where now the average is 20.4. In my original school, instead of the normal 8 Tutor groups, there are now 10 with the same amount of pupils they accept in. This means that the pupils in each class has decreased since I was at school.

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 25 May 17 9.57am

Originally posted by Hansy

We also saw Increased unemployment from 2005. Budget Deficit increase (Originally a surplus in the first few years of Blair premiership).

Corbyn is promising the world to the young. What they don't realise is the free education they will receive if he wins, they will eventually pay for it in the long run. And if you have people like Abbott who is the Home Secretary, that can't get her figures right and calls all those in favour of Brexit racists. It is a recipe for disaster.

I think I suffered in a Labour run Education period (Having been school from 2001 to 2008, and my local MP being Labour for many years), where we had 30-40 pupils in every class, where now the average is 20.4. In my original school, instead of the normal 8 Tutor groups, there are now 10 with the same amount of pupils they accept in. This means that the pupils in each class has decreased since I was at school.

Where did you get your average class size figures from? Seems very low.

 

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View CambridgeEagle's Profile CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 25 May 17 9.57am Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

More criticism of the Tory manifesto:

JOHN WEBBER, HEAD OF RATINGS, COLLIERS INTERNATIONAL
"What I find staggering is that [the manifesto reads] almost as if the government had nothing to do with what has happened over the past seven years. There is another review practically every year and the government is still sitting on the last one, which was instigated because they decided to postpone the last revaluation.

The manifesto talks about simplicity, but what the government has just done is to introduce the most complicated way to run a business rates appeals system that they could possibly dream up. It is a nightmare and it is designed to be a nightmare - it is certainly not transparent or simple. All this talk about helping small businesses is a bit of a joke - to mention simplicity insults their intelligence.

The worrying thing is that if the government can’t even get business rates right, what are they going to be like in the Brexit negotiations? That is what businesses should be concerned about."


Be in no doubt, the Tories have managed this issue shockingly. Some businesses in London have had their rates increase by over 400% this year. This is a big problem for business, especially retailers in London and the South East.


Just so it's clear this is a widely held view:

MARK HIGGIN, PARTNER AND HEAD OF RATING, MONTAGU EVANS
It’s difficult not to feel underwhelmed by the manifesto promises on business rates. Talk of longer-term reforms gives the impression of a problem that the government doesn’t know how to solve being kicked further into the long grass.

Talk of creating a simplified system will be met with incredulity - since 2010 layer upon layer of complexity has been foisted on the system.


JERRY SCHURDER, HEAD OF BUSINESS RATES, GERALD EVE
Firms will roll their eyes at the prospect of yet another structural review. They have given their views on business rates over and again - at least five times since 2013 - and it’s high time this information was acted on. Companies don’t need more consultation; they need genuine reform of the rating system and they need it now. Another talking shop review only delays the implementation of much-needed changes.

The 2016 spring budget promised more frequent revaluations, but in the subsequent 16 months virtually zero progress has been made beyond the publication of an apparently ignored discussion paper.


[Link]

 

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View Hansy's Profile Hansy Flag 25 May 17 10.01am Send a Private Message to Hansy Add Hansy as a friend

Originally posted by nickgusset

Where did you get your average class size figures from? Seems very low.

The average secondary school class in England contained 20.4 students according to the latest school census.

Data collected by the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) found that the UK had some of the smallest average class sizes in the developed world.

Although class sizes in Japan and Germany tend to be larger, children in both countries out-performed UK students in the latest influential PISA rankings.

- BBC report in Jan 2017. [Link]

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 25 May 17 10.01am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

What truth is this? Please share.

The truth I'm referring to is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour's leadership which the Labour membership enabled has ultimately failed the British working class in this country.

The fact that this would happen has been obvious to most for a very long time and yet the 'progressive' membership of the Labour party still re-elected Corbyn.

Hence supporters of Corbyn, like yourself, deserve criticism for ultimately not providing the country with what they can point to as a viable alternative. Apparently it is always someone else's fault. Not to my eyes it isn't.

The truth is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour has been the biggest waste of time and energy since I can remember. It's so short sighted...The UK is an aging nation of home owners, where the older vote far more often...'Progressive' leadership is never going to work...You would have been far better off with keeping the 'progressive' element more low key. All you have achieved is a cementing in of a Conservative leadership.

I consider myself a red Tory so for me that is a mixed bag.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Hansy's Profile Hansy Flag 25 May 17 10.05am Send a Private Message to Hansy Add Hansy as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

The truth I'm referring to is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour's leadership which the Labour membership enabled has ultimately failed the British working class in this country.

The fact that this would happen has been obvious to most for a very long time and yet the 'progressive' membership of the Labour party still re-elected Corbyn.

Hence supporters of Corbyn, like yourself, deserve criticism for ultimately not providing the country with what they can point to as a viable alternative. Apparently it is always someone else's fault. Not to my eyes it isn't.

The truth is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour has been the biggest waste of time and energy since I can remember. It's so short sighted...The UK is an aging nation of home owners, where the older vote far more often...'Progressive' leadership is never going to work...You would have been far better off with keeping the 'progressive' element more low key. All you have achieved is a cementing in of a Conservative leadership.

I consider myself a red Tory so for me that is a mixed bag.

Agree entirely with this.

 

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 25 May 17 10.11am

Originally posted by Hansy

Agree entirely with this.

And me.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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View CambridgeEagle's Profile CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 25 May 17 10.13am Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

The truth I'm referring to is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour's leadership which the Labour membership enabled has ultimately failed the British working class in this country.

The fact that this would happen has been obvious to most for a very long time and yet the 'progressive' membership of the Labour party still re-elected Corbyn.

Hence supporters of Corbyn, like yourself, deserve criticism for ultimately not providing the country with what they can point to as a viable alternative. Apparently it is always someone else's fault. Not to my eyes it isn't.

The truth is that the 'progressive' takeover of Labour has been the biggest waste of time and energy since I can remember. It's so short sighted...The UK is an aging nation of home owners, where the older vote far more often...'Progressive' leadership is never going to work...You would have been far better off with keeping the 'progressive' element more low key. All you have achieved is a cementing in of a Conservative leadership.

I consider myself a red Tory so for me that is a mixed bag.

If Labour wins then the working class will be much better off.

Labour also now have something like a 10-20 point lead among the youngest voters. It's less class based today than in the past.

[Link]

It's hard to suggest it would be anyone's fault if Labour don't win as there is no guarantee or way of telling that they would have done better under a more "Blairite" candidate for example.

At the end of the day Corbyn will have to shoulder some of the blame for being so stubborn, but so will the PLP and the membership. It could be suggested that a better presented and more press friendly leader with the exact same policies and things would be very different. But who knows.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 25 May 17 10.14am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

Facts:

GDP growth was higher in EVERY YEAR of the last Labour government until 2008 than EVERY YEAR BUT ONE of this Conservative government.

2008 and 2009 saw a recession as a result of the GFC, not Labour's fiscal or monetary policy. The GFC was not caused by the UK government, it was caused by excessive risk taking and financial mismanagement by global banks and financiers. The UK was complicit since 1979 along with the US and European governments with ever decreasing regulation and freeing up of the financial system which allowed such unchecked risk taking and poor corporate governance, but it was not the ones making those lending decisions.

Excuses excuses.

 

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