Hillary, Wikileaks, Russia
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 Stuk  Top half 27 Jul 16 5.50pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
And you admit there were sanctions, which is not "nothing" being done. Yes, they have hurt all concerned, but far more so Russia - the target. And, again, Ukraine is better off with sanctions being prosecuted than a land war being prosecuted in its streets. Oil prices have not helped Russia, of course, but that wasn't your original point; which was that nothing had been done, which you have now retracted. And if you think that "picking between two people" is all we're doing, then you're delusional. Bush took the US and its UK lapdog into Iraq, killed hundreds of thousands and created ISIS. Do you think Gore does the same? To answer my own question: never in a month of Sundays! Presidents matter. Edited by Ray in Houston (27 Jul 2016 5.34pm) Several EU countries and the Swiss/Norwegians wouldn't agree with you. We did do nothing, sanctions were an afterthought when the west realised they'd let them annex part of another country. As I said, it hasn't helped Ukraine at all. That's exactly what it boils down to. You don't get any say on their decisions once you've voted for a or b. Bush was a f***ing idiot, and the country voted him in again. At least we can't be blamed for voting in Blair, we don't pick our PM. Out of the current two I'd say they're both a liability when it comes to foreign policy and/or future conflicts you may get involved in. If presidents mattered you'd stop getting rid of, or completely hamstringing at least, the half decent one you have had.
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Ray in Houston  Houston 27 Jul 16 8.51pm |
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Originally posted by Stuk
Several EU countries and the Swiss/Norwegians wouldn't agree with you. We did do nothing, sanctions were an afterthought when the west realised they'd let them annex part of another country. As I said, it hasn't helped Ukraine at all. That's exactly what it boils down to. You don't get any say on their decisions once you've voted for a or b. Bush was a f***ing idiot, and the country voted him in again. At least we can't be blamed for voting in Blair, we don't pick our PM. Out of the current two I'd say they're both a liability when it comes to foreign policy and/or future conflicts you may get involved in. If presidents mattered you'd stop getting rid of, or completely hamstringing at least, the half decent one you have had.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Stuk Top half 27 Jul 16 9.02pm |
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You haven't explained any of it. Like me you can only offer your opinion. I'll only add that my previous post was supposed to say the ones you've had. Plural.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 28 Jul 16 11.47am |
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Also, in terms of Blair vs Bush, Blair was at least competent and intelligent. I don't like the guy, I don't like his policies, but Bush, what I don't understand is why anyone would consider a man who is actually stupid and ignorant, as the person they'd want to lead the country. Its like deciding that the special needs kid, should be the Head of Education. Blair was a c**t, but he wasn't actually an incompetent idiot. Are Trumps supporters really so blind to what they're actually doing in supporting a candidate who actually doesn't have any viable policies? Or has democracy finally descended into the US into a choose your own rapist popularity contest. Do Americans even care anymore, or is it all about shouting loudly and hating the otherside. Its terrible to see the Republican party reduced to this hollow, horrible thing that is only about what it is against, rather than for, dressed up as patriotism. He's not even a very good businessman.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| qlip26 New York City 28 Jul 16 2.05pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Also, in terms of Blair vs Bush, Blair was at least competent and intelligent. I don't like the guy, I don't like his policies, but Bush, what I don't understand is why anyone would consider a man who is actually stupid and ignorant, as the person they'd want to lead the country. Its like deciding that the special needs kid, should be the Head of Education. Blair was a c**t, but he wasn't actually an incompetent idiot. Are Trumps supporters really so blind to what they're actually doing in supporting a candidate who actually doesn't have any viable policies? Or has democracy finally descended into the US into a choose your own rapist popularity contest. Do Americans even care anymore, or is it all about shouting loudly and hating the otherside. Its terrible to see the Republican party reduced to this hollow, horrible thing that is only about what it is against, rather than for, dressed up as patriotism. He's not even a very good businessman. i visited england for the first time in 2003. i was in my very early 20s. almost anyone i met asked me variations on the same two questions: (1) did you vote for george bush and (2) why did americans elect this special needs child? it was a complete embarrassment then. but now it is much, much worse. to answer your question, yes. there are a large number of americans who only digest media way to right of what you'd find in the daily mail. they believe that their country has been hijacked by minorities and globalists. the only prescription for change is a strongman who promises to take them back to the era of american greatness, ie, "make america great again". or a time when families could survive on one income supplied by factory labor while neighborhoods and schools were racially homogeneous. i don't know any trump supporters in nyc. not one. and i have many republican friends. they know he is a fraud and a con man. no one is more upset about the state of the republican party than they are. but we live in a bubble. new yorkers know he is a sociopathic egomanic. the election is going to be decided between who votes more, college educated people and minorities or non college educated whites. Edited by qlip26 (28 Jul 2016 2.05pm)
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| Stuk Top half 28 Jul 16 2.16pm |
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Originally posted by qlip26
i visited england for the first time in 2003. i was in my very early 20s. almost anyone i met asked me variations on the same two questions: (1) did you vote for george bush and (2) why did americans elect this special needs child? it was a complete embarrassment then. but now it is much, much worse. to answer your question, yes. there are a large number of americans who only digest media way to right of what you'd find in the daily mail. they believe that their country has been hijacked by minorities and globalists. the only prescription for change is a strongman who promises to take them back to the era of american greatness, ie, "make america great again". or a time when families could survive on one income supplied by factory labor while neighborhoods and schools were racially homogeneous. i don't know any trump supporters in nyc. not one. and i have many republican friends. they know he is a fraud and a con man. no one is more upset about the state of the republican party than they are. but we live in a bubble. new yorkers know he is a sociopathic egomanic. the election is going to be decided between who votes more, college educated people and minorities or non college educated whites. Edited by qlip26 (28 Jul 2016 2.05pm) I'd guess that both Trump, Bush and their offspring, along with every other white republican senator and their offspring are college educated.
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| qlip26 New York City 28 Jul 16 2.21pm |
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"I'd guess that both Trump, Bush and their offspring, along with every other white republican senator and their offspring are college educated." do you always see things in absolutes? i'll be more clear. 60-70% of the former group will never support trump; 60-70% of the latter will never vote for hrc. also, the bushes are out on trump.
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| Stuk Top half 28 Jul 16 2.58pm |
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Originally posted by qlip26
"I'd guess that both Trump, Bush and their offspring, along with every other white republican senator and their offspring are college educated." do you always see things in absolutes? i'll be more clear. 60-70% of the former group will never support trump; 60-70% of the latter will never vote for hrc. also, the bushes are out on trump. Nope, but I can't stand lazy stereotypes. Same thing we kept hearing during the EU referendum. HRC sounds like a downgraded HTC. Is that really how they're referring to her over there? The two George's might not be publicly backing Trump (he did kick the ass of one of their relatives after all, to use an Americanism) but I can't see them voting for Hillary. Not that it was my point, it was that they're college educated white people.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 28 Jul 16 3.47pm |
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Originally posted by Stuk
I'd guess that both Trump, Bush and their offspring, along with every other white republican senator and their offspring are college educated. I don't think Trump is stupid, just ignorant and dangerously egocentric - He probably knows what he is doing and blatantly playing to the 'idiot fringes'. I suspect however that Bush had 'special tuition and focus' from Yale and Harvard. Either that or most of us could graduate from Yale and Harvard without actually attending.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| nairb75 Baltimore 28 Jul 16 8.33pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Are Trumps supporters really so blind to what they're actually doing in supporting a candidate who actually doesn't have any viable policies? Or has democracy finally descended into the US into a choose your own rapist popularity contest. Do Americans even care anymore, or is it all about shouting loudly and hating the otherside. Its terrible to see the Republican party reduced to this hollow, horrible thing that is only about what it is against, rather than for, dressed up as patriotism. trump supporters are people living in the past. and they've lost every single thing they hold dear for the past 50+ years. they are almost entirely white people who have lost their prestige, jobs, etc. they lost on civil rights. they lost their low-skill jobs, they lost on abortion, they can't even call homosexuals bad names anymore. everything they thought they had is gone. they were in the majority group of influence and even though they still are, they feel as if they are not and have been elbowed out by other groups. marginalized. they don't even care about money. they say it's economic but it isn't. they are just mad as #### and someone needs to pay. and someone needs to bring it back to the good old days when they could say and do whatever they wanted with no repercussions. and all of those jobs will come back too. and then america will be great again!
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| Jamesrichards8 28 Jul 16 10.04pm |
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Originally posted by nairb75
trump supporters are people living in the past. and they've lost every single thing they hold dear for the past 50+ years. they are almost entirely white people who have lost their prestige, jobs, etc. they lost on civil rights. they lost their low-skill jobs, they lost on abortion, they can't even call homosexuals bad names anymore. everything they thought they had is gone. they were in the majority group of influence and even though they still are, they feel as if they are not and have been elbowed out by other groups. marginalized. they don't even care about money. they say it's economic but it isn't. they are just mad as #### and someone needs to pay. and someone needs to bring it back to the good old days when they could say and do whatever they wanted with no repercussions. and all of those jobs will come back too. and then america will be great again!
And the liberal vs conservative 'good vs evil' battle continues! zzzzzzzzzzz boring. You are oversimplifying in the most vindictive, insulting and obtuse way imaginable.
When you’re knocked on your back and your life’s a flop... |
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Kermit8  Hevon 28 Jul 16 10.35pm |
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You just know a certain type of Brexiteer is hoping for a Trump victory.
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