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December 12 2019 9.28am

Bias against Trump

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 3.37pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

It's not really about what Trump or any president wants. As I tried to explain to W12, it's all good saying you will drain the swamp but if you keep hiring goldman sachs to run your treasury, you have not drained the swamp. Presidents do what they are told.

You obviously didn't understand what Trump meant by 'drain the swamp'.

He meant to remove impediments to implementing his policies. Not remove a 'business class' as you seem to be thinking....Hell that is what Trump is himself.....That was more a Bannon thing and you think that because Trump said it that he wrote it?

When you read what's been happening in the White House 'draining the swamp', as in removing blocks to him....well that was one of his most unsuccessful ideas....Though he has more of a handle on it now.

Originally posted by Jway89

We will obviously disagree on if Bernie or Warren will be any good, but the fact that they want money out of politics and they stick to that is quite refreshing and the way it should be. Corporations and Banks don't vote and yet they influence so much.

The fact that Trump and Boris and all politicians think low interest rates are great, just shows how much they all don't know or understand.

Are you seriously telling me that far left politics is going to work in America? Well actually I can't think of where it's ever worked. I preferred what Bernie was saying in 2016 to today.....Even though it still wouldn't work......But now the Democrats are absurd.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 3.37pm)

 

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Deleted 01 Dec 19 4.02pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Are you seriously telling me that far left politics is going to work in America? Well actually I can't think of where it's ever worked. I preferred what Bernie was saying in 2016 to today.....Even though it still wouldn't work......But now the Democrats are absurd.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 3.37pm)

He meant running the country as a business, where he makes the decisions and they are implemented, but that's not how it works. Checks and balances are there for a reason. Part of the beaurocracy he talks about is the revolving door policy that these large banks have. It's pretty easy to see, but obviously he doesn't mean them.

He has been just as incompetent at doing anything as all the others. Tax cuts. Again i have no problem with taxes or tax cuts, but there are a certain group that do not pay their %.

Far left to you or some americans is pretty much what we have here with the NHS as an example. The thing is that if it is going to work anywhere it will be the US.

I don't believe the state should run everything, but there should be one at least working hand in hand with private business.

Edited by Jway89 (01 Dec 2019 4.15pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 4.16pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

He meant running the country as a business, where he makes the decisions and they are implemented, but that's not how it works. Checks and balances are there for a reason. Part of the beaurocracy he talks about is the revolving door policy that these large banks have. It's pretty to see, but obviously he doesn't mean them.

He has been just as incompetent at doing anything as all the others. Tax cuts. Again i have no problem with taxes or tax cuts, but there are a certain group that do not pay their %.

Far left to you or some americans is pretty much what we have here with the NHS as an example. The thing is that if it is going to work anywhere it will be the US.

I don't believe the state should run everything, but there should be one at least working hand in hand with private business.

Well, I'm been reading 'Fear' by Bob Woodward so we will just have to differ on what Trump meant and what Bannon wrote.

Nevertheless if we were just talking about healthcare in the US I might agree with you....but implementing a 'single payer' system in the US isn't the half of it....though the US already has medicare.

The Democrats aren't the party of twenty years ago....they are bats***e crazy on a whole range of issues...little different to Corbyn.

Besides, I don't think a single payer system fits America how it's set up now. It would need slow...and I mean slow implementation. They private provision is huge and employs tons....jobs and taxes.

It probably make America more ethical but also poorer....and I don't want a poor America because we have real threats in the world.

I think moving towards it definitely was an option in the past.....but I think it isn't really going to work now.....Some states just won't have it....just like they won't accept it when Democrats try to change the 1 and 2 amendments.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 4.20pm)

 

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Deleted 01 Dec 19 4.34pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Well, I'm been reading 'Fear' by Bob Woodward so we will just have to differ on what Trump meant and what Bannon wrote.

Nevertheless if we were just talking about healthcare in the US I might agree with you....but implementing a 'single payer' system in the US isn't the half of it....though the US already has medicare.

The Democrats aren't the party of twenty years ago....they are bats***e crazy on a whole range of issues...little different to Corbyn.

Besides, I don't think a single payer system fits America how it's set up now. It would need slow...and I mean slow implementation. They private provision is huge and employs tons....jobs and taxes.

It probably make America more ethical but also poorer....and I don't want a poor America because we have real threats in the world.

But long term, I think moving towards it definitely is an option.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 4.18pm)

Just on healthcare. If you break your leg and dont want to go to A&E because you are uninsured and will have to pay $8k, in the richest country known, that is a problem. Those workers are likely to be hired by the hospitals as admin staff. The Mercatus Centre, funded by right wing billionaires found that Medicare for all would be cheaper by $2T over 10 years than the current system.

So there you are, an extra $2T to drone strike whoever you want.

We can go on about their other policies, like wealth taxes.

What i will say is, the far left or right dont come out of nowhere. Ukip was a fringe nothing party along with the BNP. A financial collapse, caused in America, but that affected this country, leading to austetity, leads to far right and left wing ideologies increasing. You see this everywhere and over all periods of time.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 6.01pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

Just on healthcare. If you break your leg and dont want to go to A&E because you are uninsured and will have to pay k, in the richest country known, that is a problem. Those workers are likely to be hired by the hospitals as admin staff. The Mercatus Centre, funded by right wing billionaires found that Medicare for all would be cheaper by T over 10 years than the current system.

Are those 'right wing billionaires' the Koch brothers? As in the Koch brothers who want mass immigration....I think when you're talking right wing....it's neo liberal right wing and not socially.

They aren't anything to do with the right I stand with.

When it comes to the morality of a 'single payer' system you will get no argument from me.

However, like I say, your US healthcare system is like an oil tanker and it would be a nightmare to turn it around.

In reality, until the socialists take over in the US it isn't going to happen.....and I don't think the republicans will accept it anyway because it'll be apart of huge changes across the board that they know will be coming on the 1st and 2nd amendments.

Originally posted by Jway89

So there you are, an extra T to drone strike whoever you want.

We can go on about their other policies, like wealth taxes.

What i will say is, the far left or right dont come out of nowhere. Ukip was a fringe nothing party along with the BNP. A financial collapse, caused in America, but that affected this country, leading to austetity, leads to far right and left wing ideologies increasing. You see this everywhere and over all periods of time.

The emergence of the far left/right is multifactored.....I'd agree that it's obviously always been there. However, since social media both camps are far more defined and knowing of themselves and their opponents.

In the US demographics are the main driver for the right and for the left it's....well I'd say intersectional feminism amongst others, which they thinks leads to social justice....but I would wouldn't I....maybe as you're more left than me you're better placed to speak on their motivations.


Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 6.04pm)

 

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Deleted 01 Dec 19 6.46pm

I think the better term is capitalist right wing.

As with demographics in voting preference, it's pretty simple isn't it? For the majority at least.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 6.59pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

I think the better term is capitalist right wing.

As with demographics in voting preference, it's pretty simple isn't it? For the majority at least.

Yep, which would mean that as the US became more Hispanic so that the white republicans will never see power again in the US.......The country that they created....Even the English language would eventually be demoted.

To even try to gain power the Republicans would have to move left and essentially become right wing democrats.....and why would Hispanics and blacks vote for them? It's essentially voting for the party of the 'whites'.

So for the social conservatives in the US it's not going to happen...The republican youth is far more socially conservative than their boomer leaders and .....Once the penny drops their will be a fault line within America.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 7.02pm)

 

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Deleted 01 Dec 19 7.13pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Yep, which would mean that as the US became more Hispanic so that the white republicans will never see power again in the US.......The country that they created....Even the English language would eventually be demoted.

To even try to gain power the Republicans would have to move left and essentially become right wing democrats.....and why would Hispanics and blacks vote for them? It's essentially voting for the party of the 'whites'.

So for the social conservatives in the US it's not going to happen...The republican youth is far more socially conservative than their boomer leaders and .....Once the penny drops their will be a fault line within America.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 7.02pm)

So it's the fact that the population was predominantly white that america was so great?

Do you honestly think that other races don't hold conservative views? I know they don't.

I don't agree with the way in which immigration is implemented, however to not allow people in because they won't vote the way you do isn't a substantial reason.

BTW, which politician do you feel reflects your views best?

 

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View Jimenez's Profile Jimenez Flag SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 01 Dec 19 7.29pm Send a Private Message to Jimenez Add Jimenez as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

So it's the fact that the population was predominantly white that america was so great?

Do you honestly think that other races don't hold conservative views? I know they don't.

I don't agree with the way in which immigration is implemented, however to not allow people in because they won't vote the way you do isn't a substantial reason.

BTW, which politician do you feel reflects your views best?

I have Latino friends who are more Conservative than me, believe me. I am often quite shocked at some of the stuff they believe in, Including Immigration & surprisingly The Democrats who they find extremely patronising.

 


Pro USA & Israel

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 7.37pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

So it's the fact that the population was predominantly white that america was so great?

Do you honestly think that other races don't hold conservative views? I know they don't.

Well Europeans made Europe and the Anglosphere into the civilisations they are.

It's not really about the conservatism as such....because when it comes to social conservative, Islam and in fact, lot of religions and states make European social conservatism look quite tame.

The statistics don't lie....If you look at South America, where hispanics come from they vote left and ruin their economics all the time.....the economics don't lie and the crime rates don't lie....In America, they vote 70 percent Democrat and basically that isn't going to change.

It's about living within the kind of societies you want to live in. Not the ones corporations and internationalists want for you.

It isn't everybody of course and that's not what I'm saying....for example middle class Cubans with memory of Castro will vote republican but the numbers are collectively tiny.

But what difference does the nuance make.....The outcome is still the same. The future for America is disunity not unity.....Sorry to be so pessimistic about it.

Though the outcome may be an eventual future for many Europeans of the right.

Originally posted by Jway89

I don't agree with the way in which immigration is implemented, however to not allow people in because they won't vote the way you do isn't a substantial reason.

Mmmmm....I kinda disagree.


Originally posted by Jway89

BTW, which politician do you feel reflects your views best?

There isn't one I can think of.....A bit of Trump, a bit of Farage....a bit of Batten.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 7.39pm)

 

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Deleted 01 Dec 19 7.51pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

There isn't one I can think of.....A bit of Trump, a bit of Farage....a bit of Batten.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 7.39pm)

I would encourage you to really look into American interventionism in Latin America to really see why that region is in a shambles. Obviously , there is corruption too.

It's very easy to make a decision on regions and relate them to race, but it is much more complicated than that.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 01 Dec 19 7.56pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Jway89

I would encourage you to really look into American interventionism in Latin America
to really see why that region is in a shambles. Obviously , there is corruption too.

It's very easy to make a decision on regions and relate them to race, but it is much more complicated than that.

That whole ideology is a complete and utter nonsense.

Nothing but excuse politics....Ok, how comes so many other countries are doing well after western interventions.....China, Japan, Israel the list goes on.

Excuse politics when the reality is far more obvious.

 

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