Steve Bannon to speak in Berkerly next week
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jamiemartin721  Reading 20 Sep 17 5.18pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Pizza gate was there certainly....the law courts are open if so desired. There were plenty of fake news stories about Trump as well of course. Click bait is the new unethical money spinner......If action is to be taken on this stuff.....then I think it has to be very carefully done. However, what I've seen, in terms of censorship, from Google, Twitter and Facebook is not good at all. Edited by Stirlingsays (19 Sep 2017 11.14am) I don't think banning click bait is actually suppression of free speech, more like reasonable regulation of advertising and advertising standards. Its either news, or not. Sites like Infowars are not about 'free speech', they're the opposite of free speech. As I said earlier, if your lying, you're not contributing to free speech, you're telling people what to think. That is the real Orwellian nightmare. Not that you can't speak freely, but that your being indoctrinated into accepting lies and truth. Also, whilst we're at it, we should also regulate Social Media accordingly, and how free speech is applied and protected there.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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 Beanyboysmd 20 Sep 17 5.52pm |
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I always try to see the other sides point of view, its always fun to find out what makes someone tick... If however, someone's political views have "Made in America" on the label, I will tune out and ignore it. I have literally no interest in people giving their opinions of American politics and lazily use it to try to draw parallels with here has no real opinion of value. In America, you have to pick one of two sides, and they will tell you where you stand on issues. Its an awful broken corrupt system that fails on every level. Here there are parties for every conceivable political view. There is literally a party for everyone and if there isn't, you can make one. You need virtually no money, you don't need sponsorship and you don't need big business to support you. In America you pick from 2 parties or an independent if they are stinking rich... So no, whatever happens politically in America has no bearing on here. Screw their rotten system and shame on anyone trying to copy any agenda from there...
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Ray in Houston  Houston 22 Sep 17 6.12pm |
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Word is that Milo's "s***show" (the co-organiser's description, not mine) of an event at Berkeley is going to be cancelled. [Link] A number of the announced speakers had no idea they were being proposed for the event, others (like Bannon and Coulter) had never confirmed their appearance, and the organisers failed to provide the university with the necessary paperwork for it to block out space and provide security. Milo has been drip-feeding comments all week leading up to cancellation, which he is expected to announce tomorrow - blaming UC Berkeley for the whole mess in the process.
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| Stirlingsays 22 Sep 17 6.24pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
I don't think banning click bait is actually suppression of free speech, more like reasonable regulation of advertising and advertising standards. Its either news, or not. Sites like Infowars are not about 'free speech', they're the opposite of free speech. As I said earlier, if your lying, you're not contributing to free speech, you're telling people what to think. That is the real Orwellian nightmare. Not that you can't speak freely, but that your being indoctrinated into accepting lies and truth. Also, whilst we're at it, we should also regulate Social Media accordingly, and how free speech is applied and protected there. Click bait is bad.....click bait journalism is mostly lying it's true....I suppose I just suspicious of this reality being used as cover for censoring 'views we don't like'. I think an example of this is found in your attitude to 'info wars'. I don't agree that it's quite the same thing. Some of the things Alex Jones has said are awful....like saying Sandy Hook wasn't what it so clearly was. However, much of what he spins does come under right wing republicanism. And that the danger of the recent moves in my view. While I don't watch Jones, I quite like some of Paul Joseph Watson's stuff and he comes under 'info wars' so this also troubles me. I don't agree with you saying that their speech isn't free speech or indeed that Watson is a liar if you imply that. What he does is push a confrontational conservative worldview. I am concerned about who decides who is lying? You still haven't dealt with this problem in your replies. Who watches the watcher? Who decides what is a worldview and what are lies. This is why America's position in relation to free speech is so much more superior to ours.....But I would support some careful action on click bait. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 6.25pm)
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| Stirlingsays 22 Sep 17 6.31pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Word is that Milo's "s***show" (the co-organiser's description, not mine) of an event at Berkeley is going to be cancelled. [Link] A number of the announced speakers had no idea they were being proposed for the event, others (like Bannon and Coulter) had never confirmed their appearance, and the organisers failed to provide the university with the necessary paperwork for it to block out space and provide security. Milo has been drip-feeding comments all week leading up to cancellation, which he is expected to announce tomorrow - blaming UC Berkeley for the whole mess in the process. What an amazingly one eyed way of viewing the suppression of free speech as a positive. Berkeley are totally responsible for the political mess they have created within their university. Their reputation for free speech is in tatters and they had to spend 600, 000 dollars on security the other week just to stop their own students from stopping Shapiro's speech. If Berkeley cancel this speech they will deserve the continued hits to their reputation as little more than a 'progressive' institution that's partly funded by tax payers......The majority of whom don't agree with their student's politics of rioting and shutting down free speech. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 6.32pm)
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 22 Sep 17 6.36pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
What an amazingly one eyed way of viewing the suppression of free speech as a positive. Berkeley are totally responsible for the political mess they have created within their university. Their reputation for free speech is in tatters and they had to spend 600, 000 dollars on security the other week just to stop their own students from stopping Shapiro's speech. If Berkeley cancel this speech they will deserve the continued hits to their reputation as little more than a 'progressive' institution that's partly funded by tax payers......The majority of whom don't agree with their student's politics of rioting and shutting down free speech. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 6.32pm) The organisers didn't have the necessary paperwork. Doesn't sound like Berkeley's fault. Still if those right wing nutnobs can't get the paperwork right at least it doesn't give them the chance to spread their quasi racist devisive shock jock drivel to those that think others are less superior.
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Kermit8  Hevon 22 Sep 17 6.36pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
What an amazingly one eyed way of viewing the suppression of free speech as a positive. Berkeley are totally responsible for the political mess they have created within their university. Their reputation for free speech is in tatters and they had to spend 600, 000 dollars on security the other week just to stop their own students from stopping Shapiro's speech. If Berkeley cancel this speech they will deserve the continued hits to their reputation as little more than a 'progressive' institution that's partly funded by tax payers......The majority of whom don't agree with their student's politics of rioting and shutting down free speech. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 6.32pm) Just out of curiosity how did you feel back in the 80's, or now even looking back, the Thatcher's administration's decision to gag Sein Fein in public and make it illegal for their voices to be heard?
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| Ray in Houston Houston 22 Sep 17 6.37pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
What an amazingly one eyed way of viewing the suppression of free speech as a positive. Berkeley are totally responsible for the political mess they have created within their university. Their reputation for free speech is in tatters and they had to spend 600, 000 dollars on security the other week just to stop their own students from stopping Shapiro's speech. If Berkeley cancel this speech they will deserve the continued hits to their reputation as little more than a 'progressive' institution that's partly funded by tax payers......The majority of whom don't agree with their student's politics of rioting and shutting down free speech.
How is all of that s*** the fault of the venue?
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| Stirlingsays 22 Sep 17 7.06pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
How is all of that s*** the fault of the venue? It's the fault of the venue because it's their responsibility.....as a partly publicly funded body to be able to stage free speech events. The trouble makers are their students. It's their politically minded tuition that has created this and as far as I see it's an example of the 'revolution eating itself'. If they cancel this event....It would be one of many they have cancelled and they again will be fully deserving of the huge amount of criticism they have received and personally I look forward to them losing their public funding.
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| Stirlingsays 22 Sep 17 7.15pm |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
Just out of curiosity how did you feel back in the 80's, or now even looking back, the Thatcher's administration's decision to gag Sein Fein in public and make it illegal for their voices to be heard? If someone is supporting the murder of your own country's soldiers it probably is reasonable to censor their propaganda on nationally broadcast TV stations. What that has to do with a free speech rally organized by the republican body at Berkeley....You may not like Milo but he isn't supporting the murder of anybody......This rally is not being broadcast nationally and with only those present who have paid to be there I don't know.....Put your crowbar comparisons back in the shed Kermy. Sein Fein were supporting the murder of British soldiers. I have never supported terrorist organisations....the difference between Sinn Fein and the IRA was purely in the title....This only changed a little late on. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 7.23pm)
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| Ray in Houston Houston 22 Sep 17 8.06pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
It's the fault of the venue because it's their responsibility.....as a partly publicly funded body to be able to stage free speech events. The trouble makers are their students. It's their politically minded tuition that has created this and as far as I see it's an example of the 'revolution eating itself'. If they cancel this event....It would be one of many they have cancelled and they again will be fully deserving of the huge amount of criticism they have received and personally I look forward to them losing their public funding. Berkeley isn't cancelling the event, Milo is. I'm sure the 4 - four, total - speakers he had confirmed will be disappointed. You seem to have a giant bee in your bonnet about education establishments oppressing free speech - I believe this is the 4th or 5th thread you've started on the subject in the space of about a week. To a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
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| Stirlingsays 22 Sep 17 8.16pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Berkeley isn't cancelling the event, Milo is. I'm sure the 4 - four, total - speakers he had confirmed will be disappointed. You seem to have a giant bee in your bonnet about education establishments oppressing free speech - I believe this is the 4th or 5th thread you've started on the subject in the space of about a week. To a hammer, everything looks like a nail. Well, Berkeley shut down Milo in February. Where do you get your information that Milo has cancelled this event?....I'm not sure what the significance of the number of speakers is. Posters currently up on Berkeley campus. Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Sep 2017 8.18pm)
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