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January 29 2022 2.19pm

The grand old duke of york, he had 10,000.........

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View Henry of Peckham's Profile Henry of Peckham Flag Eton Mess 13 Jan 22 10.09pm Send a Private Message to Henry of Peckham Add Henry of Peckham as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I don't like Andrew, and he is guilty of hanging out with some dodgy company, but was the girl he allegedly slept with not 17?

Other than being a dickhead, can someone tell me what crime has he actually committed?

Allegedly, he 'met up' with the girl in London, NY and Florida. I believe the age of consent in the those US states is 18. It varies from state to state in the US.

 


Denial is not just a river in Egypt

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 13 Jan 22 10.37pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of his personal conduct, I certainly think he's being used as a distraction from bigger fish who were involved. There were multiple billionaires who suddenly seemed awfully fond of Epstein and giving him access to his riches. And of course we hear nothing more of the mass of incriminating sounds media taken from the man's properties. Sounds like having a perpetual hold on them is more useful than holding them to account.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 14 Jan 22 12.24am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Genuinely surprised that the Queen stripped him quite like that.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 14 Jan 22 7.28am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Genuinely surprised that the Queen stripped him quite like that.

Holy sh!t. So she's at it too?

 

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View Mapletree's Profile Mapletree Flag Croydon 14 Jan 22 8.25am Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by Palace Old Geezer

I too Hrolf, find it hard to understand what he did that was illegal. He was weak and stupid to be lured into Epstein's crazy world. But, my understanding is that it's simply down to the US minimum age laws, accepting that different States vary. Like you can buy a gun when you're 18 and drive a car at 16, but it's illegal to have sex if you're under 18.

This woman who's accusing Andrew certainly had a difficult early life, but like others involved with Epstein she was participating in his wierd world for a long time before cutting adrift. I mean, she wasn't a child and she must have known what she was doing. You'd think she could have said 'no, this is not for me' and cleared off sooner if she didn't want to get involved.

Grooming is when someone builds a relationship, trust and emotional connection with a child or young person so they can manipulate, exploit and abuse them.

Children and young people who are groomed can be sexually abused, exploited or trafficked.

[Link]

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 14 Jan 22 9.16am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Palace Old Geezer

I too Hrolf, find it hard to understand what he did that was illegal. He was weak and stupid to be lured into Epstein's crazy world. But, my understanding is that it's simply down to the US minimum age laws, accepting that different States vary. Like you can buy a gun when you're 18 and drive a car at 16, but it's illegal to have sex if you're under 18.

This woman who's accusing Andrew certainly had a difficult early life, but like others involved with Epstein she was participating in his weird world for a long time before cutting adrift. I mean, she wasn't a child and she must have known what she was doing. You'd think she could have said 'no, this is not for me' and cleared off sooner if she didn't want to get involved.

Several in Epstein's orbit were under age though, and whether a year this way or that it's of course easy for for us to say 'why didn't they just not get involved' as if to disproportionately cast blame on them. The whole point of grooming is surely to create an atmosphere that is far more manipulative and controlling than it may appear on the surface. The wider context of the fact that he was a prolific pedo for decades is surely pertinent to what these girls went through. The idea that we can extract this one girl from it as some sexed up tart who was playing 4D Chess as a 'long con', would seem to be a very narrow view of the wider realities and power dynamics.

But in terms of Andrews involvement, yes I'd say we should judge it based on the extent of his personal involvement and whatever they legally may mean. He's something of a 'fall guy' for those who have had more unnerving and hand in glove involvement in Epstein's world.

Edited by BlueJay (14 Jan 2022 9.18am)

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 14 Jan 22 9.19am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

I read an article by a lawyer as to why Virgina Roberts wasn't called by the prosecution in the Maxwell trial.

It seems she is a victim / offender apparently there are plenty of witnesses that she groomed young girls and wasn't an innocent participant.

That doesn't mean that she wasn't a victim but it does mean that the jury might have viewed her unsympathetically so she was never called. I guess you could call that victim blaming.

Anyway if this ever goes to trial (I expect Andy will pay her off) this will be the strategy of his defence e.g. she groomed him and others.

 


One more point

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 14 Jan 22 9.40am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

I read an article by a lawyer as to why Virgina Roberts wasn't called by the prosecution in the Maxwell trial.

It seems she is a victim / offender apparently there are plenty of witnesses that she groomed young girls and wasn't an innocent participant.

That doesn't mean that she wasn't a victim but it does mean that the jury might have viewed her unsympathetically so she was never called. I guess you could call that victim blaming.

Anyway if this ever goes to trial (I expect Andy will pay her off) this will be the strategy of his defence e.g. she groomed him and others.

Most likely. I think Andrew would do almost anything to avoid going to trial though. A big financial settlement with a vague apology of some kind attached if my best guess!

 

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Online Flag Croydon 14 Jan 22 9.41am Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

I was thinking why didn't Andrew just clear off?

Me I'd have quietly disappeared to a new life in the sun.

Now screwed by his own mother, the present incumbent but not rightful Queen.

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 14 Jan 22 9.49am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

She's certainly cut him loose it would appear. Anything to create distance and protect the institution it seems.

 

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Online Flag Croydon 14 Jan 22 10.00am Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

They are like the Hapsburgs in those old WW1 documentaries.

 

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View Teddy Eagle's Profile Teddy Eagle Flag 14 Jan 22 10.06am Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

I was thinking why didn't Andrew just clear off?

Me I'd have quietly disappeared to a new life in the sun.

Now screwed by his own mother, the present incumbent but not rightful Queen.

Presumably because out of innate arrogance, hubris, or whatever it is, he thought he was untouchable.
Leaving aside his now former position itís just such a sleazy situation - heís a bit younger than me but I genuinely canít imagine any of my mates claiming he had access to a string of teenaged girls and we could all join in; most of my friends have grandchildren around that age and would find the suggestion quite abhorrent.

 

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