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April 29 2024 10.09am

Ukraine Situation - Should We Be Worried?

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W12 02 Mar 22 10.23pm

Originally posted by BlueJay


Well I'm certainly with you on that, as I am firmly against all of these infringements of liberty. I commented on here frequently about that 'Kill the Bill' march, where they sought to demonise those legitimately protesting something that's to my mind disturbing. Stories of police with 'broken arms' literally confirmed by police, that turned out to be b0llocks. I'm against all of this stuff as they play left against right (with one group thumbing the eye of the other) to get approval for all of these attacks on freedoms. This benefits no-one as they can be used by any government in power, so impact us all, and they never row any of this stuff back.

An ageing population not getting technology, and a younger one with no concept of privacy unfortunately combine to create a future where a lot of this stuff may be pass unquestioned.


Yeah I agree but there is a lot more urgency to this than you are suggesting. What recently happened in Canada especially should chill anyone from all political persuasions to the bone.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 02 Mar 22 10.24pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

At least you're alive and well and able to express such free speech. Several innocent citizens in Ukraine unfortunately cannot say the same now, and of course if you were in Russia, you'd likely be arrested and caged for protesting (along with thousands of others right now, including children) if your particular view was reversed and critical of their country. Or maybe falling off a balcony or poisoned if you amped up the volume too much. Still, that's a 'strong leader' for you I guess .

Edited by BlueJay (02 Mar 2022 9.30pm)

I'm not going to put up Russia as better...in fact I think for free speech it's worst and I won't pretend that I know much more on freedoms than what the western media tell me about Russia and Eastern Europe in general....however I'm hearing that the Ukraine under Zelenskyy also arrested journalists and political opposition.

 


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View Ouzo Dan's Profile Ouzo Dan 02 Mar 22 10.24pm Send a Private Message to Ouzo Dan Add Ouzo Dan as a friend

Originally posted by Grumbles

Out of all posters your have been more factual rather than opinion.

TBH, i think it will spiral into a European war.

Its been about 20 years since I was last in the British Army.

All I do is read combat & military books, I follow active servicemen on Social media, and for Ukraine follow on instagram

cossackgundi
raoulduke_69

When I post its a mixture of my own experience/knowledge coupled with the opinion of those who are there, I then throw in my own opinion - for what its worth, I used to think this would stop east of the Dnieper however with Belarus televising this 'blunder' [Link] I've changed my mind, this will escalate far beyond the Ukrainian border.

 


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BlueJay Flag UK 02 Mar 22 10.30pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm not going to put up Russia as better...in fact I think for free speech it's worst and I won't pretend that I know much more on freedoms than what the western media tell me about Russia and Eastern Europe in general....however I'm hearing that the Ukraine under Zelenskyy also arrested journalists and political opposition.

That wouldn't surprise me at all, though its somewhat overshadowed by current events and what to do in the here and now. In a week or so it's possible that Zelenskyy won't even be alive. Though maybe he'll get out if the military close in.

 

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View Ouzo Dan's Profile Ouzo Dan 02 Mar 22 10.34pm Send a Private Message to Ouzo Dan Add Ouzo Dan as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

With talks due to start again tomorrow my instinct is that it's more likely to be a strategic pause. A sword of Damocles swinging over the heads of the Ukrainian negotiating team.

I cannot believe with the length of time they were getting prepared for this that something as fundamental as supplies would be failing so soon.

Its nigh on impossible to defend a 40 mile long convoy.
If its paused its asking for trouble, if its out of fuel its asking for trouble.

Logistics is the bane of any military, we ran out of fuel in Gulf War 1, what were seeing from the Russians is supply problems literal miles into Ukrainian territory, its shambolic and in a conventional war between NATO & Russia we'd honestly slaughter the Russians, think highway of death levels of Slaughter, all Putin has is the threat of Nukes.

Its not to say he doesnt have modern infantry units or equipment at his disposal however to make up the numbers its filled with out of date cold war equipment & cold war tactics.

Edited by Ouzo Dan (02 Mar 2022 10.46pm)

 


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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 02 Mar 22 10.36pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

He most certainly won't want to lose face, and so I see this rumbling on. At the same time the sanctions are certainly having a big impact and I can't see those easing up anytime soon either. A neutral state would be a solution that could essentially square the circle so I can certainly see the merits of it. Whether both Putin and the Ukrainian people are willing to accept that, we will have to see. It may depend how much the invasion escalates prior.

What I fear....aside from this opening up into a wider war and then nuclear....is cold war 2....something everyone seems hell bent on.

Russia are part of the BRIC countries which would also have the two facing countries added to it like pakistan.....once again economies would be re-routed and we would be back to square one with a world at cold war with each other.

There are no winners here...it's a fecking disaster.

The west should be focused on saving the most Ukrainians in Eastern Ukraine it can and negotiating with Putin on that rather than beating a war drum and encouraging civilians to travel over there into a mincer.

If that's what some want to do I respect their rights to do it but I think our system is encouraging rather than warning.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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BlueJay Flag UK 02 Mar 22 10.38pm

Originally posted by W12

Yeah I agree but there is a lot more urgency to this than you are suggesting. What recently happened in Canada especially should chill anyone from all political persuasions to the bone.

The problem there is that any push to move power into the hands of the people (whatever that might mean to people) requires significant portion of the population to get on board. I can't help but think that there's enough distractions and dynamics in place to stop that ever happening, and that the only time it ever would is it things turn so much to sh!t that there is nothing to lose. War, total economic collapse etc. Massive negatives (that I certainly don't ever want to happen!) that something new would inevitably emerge from.

I've often thought that living in a poor country that corporations and other governments don't generally give a damn about wouldn't be a bad call, on account that its less liable to get caught up in the push and pull of global affairs. A more local life, removed from this seemingly univeral need to be obsessed with things that are more often than not detached from our own lives.

Anyway, that's enough of me going on haha.


 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 02 Mar 22 10.42pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

That wouldn't surprise me at all, though its somewhat overshadowed by current events and what to do in the here and now. In a week or so it's possible that Zelenskyy won't even be alive. Though maybe he'll get out if the military close in.

I hope so, Zelenskyy is a brave man and could have got out. I also have my fingers crossed for the boxers.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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BlueJay Flag UK 02 Mar 22 10.52pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

What I fear....aside from this opening up into a wider war and then nuclear....is cold war 2....something everyone seems hell bent on.

Russia are part of the BRIC countries which would also have the two facing countries added to it like pakistan.....once again economies would be re-routed and we would be back to square one with a world at cold war with each other.

There are no winners here...it's a fecking disaster.

The west should be focused on saving the most Ukrainians in Eastern Ukraine it can and negotiating with Putin on that rather than beating a war drum and encouraging civilians to travel over there into a mincer.

If that's what some want to do I respect their rights to do it but I think our system is encouraging rather than warning.

Yes, there is no doubt that we live in worrying times and this could move in directions that just make matters even worse. Last month I didn't anticipate reading into how viable is it to shoot down nukes. Can't see it happening, and I hope for a peaceful resolution still one way or another rather than a new cold war... but well.. never a dull moment!


 

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BlueJay Flag UK 02 Mar 22 10.54pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I hope so, Zelenskyy is a brave man and could have got out. I also have my fingers crossed for the boxers.

Yes, very brave of them all. It will be tragic and just show how crazy the world is, if their 'warriors in the ring' reputation ends this way out of it. They're in my thoughts.

Edited by BlueJay (02 Mar 2022 10.58pm)

 

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View Ouzo Dan's Profile Ouzo Dan 02 Mar 22 10.55pm Send a Private Message to Ouzo Dan Add Ouzo Dan as a friend

It appears Kherson is the first major city to fall into Russian control.

Some thoughts from me..

Its all well and good throwing equipment/guns etc at the Ukrainian military however Ukraine are taking casualties too & at some point are going to have a severe shortage of professional soldiers to fight, we could potentially be looking at another Afghan situation where the Russians get there hands on a mother load of bling western tech & cash.

Poland & Slovakia were all set to throw a load of Migs at Ukraine however at the 11th hour the plug was pulled, the cynic in me says this was done because they will need them for themselves.

Odesa in Russian sights now.


Edited by Ouzo Dan (02 Mar 2022 10.58pm)

 


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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 02 Mar 22 11.03pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

Yes, there is no doubt that we live in worrying times and this could move in directions that just make matters even worse. Last month I didn't anticipate reading into how viable is it to shoot down nukes. Can't see it happening, and I hope for a peaceful resolution still one way or another rather than a new cold war... but well.. never a dull moment!


The bomber always gets through because they send them all at once....it's not something any of us really want to think about.

Since Reagan we have been hoping for some kind of technological shield or effective system that protects against the crazy power of ICMs....but it's been quiet for decades.

I know in the seventies the Labour government seriously looked into underground bunkers for the common man/woman but it was dropped over cost.

I've always thought that there is a moral responsibility not to drop that idea....there must be some re-course. But our modern western elites are even less paternal over us than back then.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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