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May 21 2024 1.39pm

Forest

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Online Flag 20 Mar 24 7.22am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

I think the Citeh one is going to be a challenge, I can almost imagine some sort of plea bargain to make it all go away & start with a clean slate (given the amount of charges & the time its going to take to go through them one by one) but to make that happen Citeh will have to admit that for at least some of the charges they broke the rules & they don't seem prepared to do that-

Ultimately the powers that be are going to want to punish Citeh in a way that reflects suitably with any financial breaches that they can prove but they are not going to want to publicly castigate one of their golden geese.

As an outsider its easy to casually sit here & think - they broke the rules for a long period of time they should be relegated, titles & cups stripped, transfer embargo etc etc etc, but honestly I cant see it being that drastic -

when its all said & done it will probably end up with City starting a new season in the PL with a -20 points deduction & some public statements from both sides claiming that most of it was a misunderstanding of the ways that rules were applied at the time & how both parties still love each other & want to put the whole unfortunate saga to bed so that everyone can get on with enjoying the new season -


 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 20 Mar 24 8.27am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

I think the Citeh one is going to be a challenge, I can almost imagine some sort of plea bargain to make it all go away & start with a clean slate (given the amount of charges & the time its going to take to go through them one by one) but to make that happen Citeh will have to admit that for at least some of the charges they broke the rules & they don't seem prepared to do that-

Ultimately the powers that be are going to want to punish Citeh in a way that reflects suitably with any financial breaches that they can prove but they are not going to want to publicly castigate one of their golden geese.

As an outsider its easy to casually sit here & think - they broke the rules for a long period of time they should be relegated, titles & cups stripped, transfer embargo etc etc etc, but honestly I cant see it being that drastic -

when its all said & done it will probably end up with City starting a new season in the PL with a -20 points deduction & some public statements from both sides claiming that most of it was a misunderstanding of the ways that rules were applied at the time & how both parties still love each other & want to put the whole unfortunate saga to bed so that everyone can get on with enjoying the new season -


If City by some miracle were relegated it still would not be a fair outcome. They would be back in the PL the following season whilst keeping all their trophies.

A fair result would be that all their trophies should be cancelled and for every year they cheated they would incur a points deduction for each following season.

So to be clear if they cheated for 10 years then for the following 10 years they should be penalised each season.

Never going to happen of course, the most likely outcome is a one season penalty which their fans would take all day if they kept their trophies.

 


One more point

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View Sansbup's Profile Sansbup Flag Norfolk 20 Mar 24 1.33pm Send a Private Message to Sansbup Add Sansbup as a friend

In my view, all judgements in these cases should be applied in the summer before the next season. So either they relegate a team, or deduct points this should be applied to the coming season before it starts. No mid-season points deductions.

This would be much fairer for everyone.

 

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Online Flag 20 Mar 24 2.25pm Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

Except the teams that got relegated in place of the ones that cheated.

Originally posted by Sansbup

In my view, all judgements in these cases should be applied in the summer before the next season. So either they relegate a team, or deduct points this should be applied to the coming season before it starts. No mid-season points deductions.

This would be much fairer for everyone.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards View HKOwen's Profile HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 20 Mar 24 10.47pm Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

It's not a level playing field ( Citeh ), spend on lawyers and potentially evade punishment.

The PL will protects it's product.

Fairly clear both Everton and Forest rolled the dice and lost.

Lots of talk about Chelsea being next

I will take anything that helps Palace maintain PL status

 


Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Online Flag 21 Mar 24 6.12am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

Apparently Chelsea referred themselves to the commission for transgressions during the Abramovic era, my guess is they did that because:

a) They knew there were rules that had been broken & wanted to get ahead of the game, especially seeing the charges being levied against City -
b) They wanted to get the credit for reporting themselves / co operating and anticipating leniency.
c) They wanted to get any punishment out of the way whilst they were having a crap season /consolidating problems.
d) They wanted to have begun to have an understanding of how the commission worked / real life experience before they found themselves being called up for transgressions in the Boehly era -

Originally posted by HKOwen

It's not a level playing field ( Citeh ), spend on lawyers and potentially evade punishment.

The PL will protects it's product.

Fairly clear both Everton and Forest rolled the dice and lost.

Lots of talk about Chelsea being next

I will take anything that helps Palace maintain PL status

 

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View Davepalace707's Profile Davepalace707 Flag Northumberland 21 Mar 24 7.45am Send a Private Message to Davepalace707 Add Davepalace707 as a friend

Originally posted by HKOwen

It's not a level playing field ( Citeh ), spend on lawyers and potentially evade punishment.

The PL will protects it's product.

Fairly clear both Everton and Forest rolled the dice and lost.

Lots of talk about Chelsea being next

I will take anything that helps Palace maintain PL status

They will only have lost if they get relegated this season. One of them won’t be and there’s a chance neither will be. They both overspent last season and stayed up by four or fewer points. You could argue they’ve already won as without spending they’d have been relegated. Four or six point deductions is not an adequate deterrent and other teams will gamble on spending to stay up.

 

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View Dubai Eagle's Profile Dubai Eagle Online Flag 21 Mar 24 8.24am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

When you read the report on the Forest hearing it mentions several times that one of the things that the commission want to avoid is future situations where clubs can reliably forecast what penalty they will incur if they fall foul of the guidelines (by whatever amount) but its clear that even at these relatively early stages its already happening -

IDK what the answer is but maybe part of the answer could be harsher sentences for repeat offenders ?

Originally posted by Davepalace707

They will only have lost if they get relegated this season. One of them won’t be and there’s a chance neither will be. They both overspent last season and stayed up by four or fewer points. You could argue they’ve already won as without spending they’d have been relegated. Four or six point deductions is not an adequate deterrent and other teams will gamble on spending to stay up.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 21 Mar 24 8.29am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

When you read the report on the Forest hearing it mentions several times that one of the things that the commission want to avoid is future situations where clubs can reliably forecast what penalty they will incur if they fall foul of the guidelines (by whatever amount) but its clear that even at these relatively early stages its already happening -

IDK what the answer is but maybe part of the answer could be harsher sentences for repeat offenders ?

I get the point but it means that the fans wont understand why one club gets treated differently to another and then we suspect the process.

I would prefer a simple tariff system after all fans should be able to understand the rules.

You then need to ensure that the tariff system doesn't reward rule breaking.

 


One more point

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 21 Mar 24 9.11am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

If City by some miracle were relegated it still would not be a fair outcome. They would be back in the PL the following season whilst keeping all their trophies.

A fair result would be that all their trophies should be cancelled and for every year they cheated they would incur a points deduction for each following season.

So to be clear if they cheated for 10 years then for the following 10 years they should be penalised each season.

Never going to happen of course, the most likely outcome is a one season penalty which their fans would take all day if they kept their trophies.

People may scoff, but the fact that the regulator is now backed by statutory force, I suspect the Sheikh will not be able to buy his way out of this. Too many eyes on this.

I would not be surprised if the FA "did a Rangers" and turfed them out of the professional league. EUFA may also ban them from European competition, but that would be a largely symbolic gesture given they are not going to qualify from the Conference.

It would throw up a whole raft of issues - now academic - what their current owner does, a fire sale of the worlds most expensive talent (we would target their U21s), what happens to the power vacuum, what the prem will look like when they return in successive promotions, will they reclaim their top status...

 

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 21 Mar 24 9.17am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

Apparently Chelsea referred themselves to the commission for transgressions during the Abramovic era, my guess is they did that because:

a) They knew there were rules that had been broken & wanted to get ahead of the game, especially seeing the charges being levied against City -
b) They wanted to get the credit for reporting themselves / co operating and anticipating leniency.
c) They wanted to get any punishment out of the way whilst they were having a crap season /consolidating problems.
d) They wanted to have begun to have an understanding of how the commission worked / real life experience before they found themselves being called up for transgressions in the Boehly era -

This would be the most significant factor.

And it also suggests their legal advice is: you did it and any defence has no prospect of success. Mea culpa and acts of mitigation and they are likely to be treated much better than Man City who appear to have sought to cock-a-snoop, resist and ride their luck.

But they should still be penalised in a way that genuinely hurts. You can't help but feel that Boehly has bought himself a pig in a poke.

 

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View EagleinSF's Profile EagleinSF Flag San Fransisco 21 Mar 24 1.53pm Send a Private Message to EagleinSF Add EagleinSF as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

IDK what the answer is but maybe part of the answer could be harsher sentences for repeat offenders ?

I'd do a sliding scale from 6 - 12 points for the first offence and a 1 window transfer ban.

2nd offence double, 3rd triple etc.

Maybe some teams would risk it once to stay up, but I don't think they'd repeat if it meant losing their PL status.

 

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