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teens sue trump administration on climate change

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 03 Jan 18 9.51pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


Once again, this is complete and utter bollocks. The scientific community uses the peer review system and every single one of them wants to prove each other wrong. It's an incredibly vigorous challenge.

But because scientists don't all agree exactly on the same conclusions, people like you try to claim there isn't consensus. Meanwhile, in the real world, the vast majority of peer-reviewed studies agree on the base findings that we're warming up the climate at an alarming rate and it's a very bad thing to do so.


Edited by Ray in Houston (03 Jan 2018 8.53pm)

No, people like me claim that scientific consensus is often driven by factors outside of science.

In fact, I keep an open mind about the whole subject.

You might want to look that up.

 

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View Ray in Houston's Profile Ray in Houston Flag Houston 03 Jan 18 10.14pm Send a Private Message to Ray in Houston Add Ray in Houston as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

No, people like me claim that scientific consensus is often driven by factors outside of science.

In fact, I keep an open mind about the whole subject.

You might want to look that up.


That's all ya got?

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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View becky's Profile becky Flag over the moon 04 Jan 18 6.39am Send a Private Message to becky Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add becky as a friend

Aside from the debate of whether climate change is real or not, what puzzles me about this topic is how he hell a couple of dozen teenagers can afford the legal fees to sue the government, on what has been stated to be an ongoing battle covering the subject over several different charges........

 


A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 04 Jan 18 8.03am Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


That's all ya got?

Better to have an open mind than the delusion of rigid certainty.
As one of your favourites, Franklin eluded to. The only thing certain is death and taxes.

 

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View Rubin's Profile Rubin Flag 04 Jan 18 11.41am Send a Private Message to Rubin Add Rubin as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

No, they have occurred over tens of thousands of years.

The scientific community does not tolerate naysayers. It never has. It is not wise to speak out against the consensus if you want to preserve your reputation.

I have seen good arguments for man made global warming but the evidence is nowhere near as cut and dried as some like yourelf claim.
I am not interested in agenda driven science. I want the truth.

And funding.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 04 Jan 18 12.15pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Rubin

And funding.

Money talks.

 

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View Ray in Houston's Profile Ray in Houston Flag Houston 04 Jan 18 3.32pm Send a Private Message to Ray in Houston Add Ray in Houston as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Better to have an open mind than the delusion of rigid certainty.
As one of your favourites, Franklin eluded to. The only thing certain is death and taxes.


There is nothing rigid about science - your failure to grasp this being a common theme in this thread. Scientists put forth a "theory" and then it gets peer reviewed - a process in which any and all competing scientists get to kick the crap out of it and see if it holds up. If it does, then it becomes the scientific consensus as and until further research (e.g. from technological advances) debunks some or all of it. In such cases, the process starts all over again and we have a new consensus or we don't, depending on how the peer review goes.

There is nothing rigid about this process at all.

And since when has ignoring the consensus findings of 97% of the scientific community been the smart play?

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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wordup Flag 04 Jan 18 3.48pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


There is nothing rigid about science - your failure to grasp this being a common theme in this thread. Scientists put forth a "theory" and then it gets peer reviewed - a process in which any and all competing scientists get to kick the crap out of it and see if it holds up. If it does, then it becomes the scientific consensus as and until further research (e.g. from technological advances) debunks some or all of it. In such cases, the process starts all over again and we have a new consensus or we don't, depending on how the peer review goes.

There is nothing rigid about this process at all.

And since when has ignoring the consensus findings of 97% of the scientific community been the smart play?

Since people can just yell 'fake news' when they don't understand something and feel proud of their lack of knowledge rather than the need to educate themselves.

Though in fairness, huge money from the oil industry has been trying to influence scientific and public opinion on climate change for decades with some success in the US mostly. They've even routinely hidden or scrapped their own research when it doesn't back up the propaganda.

Thankfully solar and the likes are getting very cheap now so it's becoming a go to option even compared to coal and so on. Elon Musk and people like him will do their best to drag us out of this s*** heap and I hope they do so in time. If people want to care about immigration changing the face of our nation, it would also help if they realised the impact of issues such as this to lives and our contribution to it instead of moving along predictable political lines with some 'who knows, carry on regardless' nonsense.


Edited by wordup (04 Jan 2018 3.49pm)

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 04 Jan 18 4.04pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


There is nothing rigid about science - your failure to grasp this being a common theme in this thread. Scientists put forth a "theory" and then it gets peer reviewed - a process in which any and all competing scientists get to kick the crap out of it and see if it holds up. If it does, then it becomes the scientific consensus as and until further research (e.g. from technological advances) debunks some or all of it. In such cases, the process starts all over again and we have a new consensus or we don't, depending on how the peer review goes.

There is nothing rigid about this process at all.

And since when has ignoring the consensus findings of 97% of the scientific community been the smart play?

My failure to grasp?

Ha ha, you are funny.

I know how science works bud.

If you want funding, you don't buck the trend and when theories are peer reviewed, it is by other scientists who need funding.
The world is warming and some of that might be caused by man but please don't tell me it's a certainty because 90% of scientists say so. If science was always right then we would still believe the Earth was flat. Now I know that the scientific process has moved on since those days but how many theories accepted by the majority have turned out to be partly or entirely bulls***?

[Link]

 

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View Ray in Houston's Profile Ray in Houston Flag Houston 04 Jan 18 4.17pm Send a Private Message to Ray in Houston Add Ray in Houston as a friend

Originally posted by wordup

Since people can just yell 'fake news' when they don't understand something and feel proud of their lack of knowledge rather than the need to educate themselves.

Though in fairness, huge money from the oil industry has been trying to influence scientific and public opinion on climate change for decades with some success in the US mostly. They've even routinely hidden or scrapped their own research when it doesn't back up the propaganda.

Thankfully solar and the likes are getting very cheap now so it's becoming a go to option even compared to coal and so on. Elon Musk and people like him will do their best to drag us out of this s*** heap and I hope they do so in time. If people want to care about immigration changing the face of our nation, it would also help if they realised the impact of issues such as this to lives and our contribution to it instead of moving along predictable political lines with some 'who knows, carry on regardless' nonsense.


Exxon's in-house scientists had connected fossil fuels to climate change back in the 1980s. They buried it.

As renewable technology gets cheaper to install, it will gain more and more traction. Solar is on the cusp of this - as a home energy solution - right now, and the cost continues to fall dramatically. Energy analysts report that some emerging economies are skipping fossil fuels completely and going directly for renewables.

It'll take a long time to wean ourselves off a fossil fuels, but if we can start laying down more renewables and less fossil fuel-based generating capacity as demand grows, we will mitigate greatly the environmental impact.

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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View Ray in Houston's Profile Ray in Houston Flag Houston 04 Jan 18 4.23pm Send a Private Message to Ray in Houston Add Ray in Houston as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

My failure to grasp?

Ha ha, you are funny.

I know how science works bud.

If you want funding, you don't buck the trend and when theories are peer reviewed, it is by other scientists who need funding.
The world is warming and some of that might be caused by man but please don't tell me it's a certainty because 90% of scientists say so. If science was always right then we would still believe the Earth was flat. Now I know that the scientific process has moved on since those days but how many theories accepted by the majority have turned out to be partly or entirely bulls***?

[Link]


You are clueless. Scientists thought the sun revolved around the earth but could never quite prove it. Then Copernicus offered a theory that it was the other way around, because science isn't rigid, and others tested and ultimately concurred with his findings. [Link]

If things were as you say, scientists would still be trying to prove that that sun was our bitch because society and the all-powerful church of the time was vested in this being so.

Scientists don't make money re-proving someone else's science. They make money when they break new ground. The link you provided shows this to be the case.

Edited by Ray in Houston (04 Jan 2018 4.24pm)

 


We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 04 Jan 18 4.50pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Ray in Houston


You are clueless. Scientists thought the sun revolved around the earth but could never quite prove it. Then Copernicus offered a theory that it was the other way around, because science isn't rigid, and others tested and ultimately concurred with his findings. [Link]

If things were as you say, scientists would still be trying to prove that that sun was our bitch because society and the all-powerful church of the time was vested in this being so.

Scientists don't make money re-proving someone else's science. They make money when they break new ground. The link you provided shows this to be the case.

Edited by Ray in Houston (04 Jan 2018 4.24pm)

Yes and no. The church controlled scientific thinking and only when this stranglehold was loosened did free thinking flourish. Aristarchus had a similar theory to Copernicus hundreds of years earlier and even when Copernicus finally decided to risk ridicule and religious objection and publish his work, it was still being disputed by the church decades later.
Now the resistance to minority theories is often science itself. It takes a lot to make 90% of scientist admit they were wrong especially when they have made a career out of it.

 

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