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July 20 2019 1.00pm

New Zealand shooting at mosques

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 15 Mar 19 4.47pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

And yet in those cases, you are the first to argue the ideology is to blame...

Ideology is different from recognising a demonstrable factual reality.

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 15 Mar 19 4.53pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Ideology is different from recognising a demonstrable factual reality.

I donít agree itís a demonstrable factual reality, but thatís been done to death, so letís agree to disagree there.

Everyone believes their ideology is the true one.

 

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View dollardays's Profile dollardays Flag 15 Mar 19 4.56pm Send a Private Message to dollardays Add dollardays as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


As for what is likely to have angered this guy....Your opinions on what is important to him are far more likely to anger him far more than mine.

If this guy listened to me, he certainly wouldn't be murdering anyone that's for sure.

Edited by Stirlingsays (15 Mar 2019 4.48pm)

Someone should've been looking at this NZ guy's public online activity earlier, thats's for sure.


Thanks for your comments anyway. For anyone interested, again, my actual comment and views are below.


Original Message

A sickening act.


I'm pleased I've criticised both religious extremism and racial resistance groups on here. It's all too easy online to plug into these fringe movements or to go down an us vs them road to radicalisation. This guy announced what he was going to do before posting his muddled and cliched 'white genecide' ethno state manifesto on a chan site, live streaming his heinous acts to anyone interested. It's important to see the dignity in all, not get warped ideas about who does and doesn't truly belong in their own country. The regular focus on genetic themed racial stuff that is suddenly ever present on here for instance is alienating, unhelpful and a rung on the ladder this leads nowhere pleasant.

Hrolf makes a good point about how violence begets violence. Previous attacks add weight to the likelihood of attacks like this, and this in turn will no doubt tip some religious radical over the edge. I've never been for mass immigration, making a country only about benefiting elites through cheap labour. It does have an impact on stability of a country and can cause friction within communities. Religion can complicate and result in insular communities that hold age old beliefs detached from that of the country. Possibly Brexit will put the breaks on things if it actually ever happens. Even if it does though, it's important to remember that at that point the country is what it is. People still have to learn to get along in peace and to try to find commonality rather than differences no matter how hard or futile that may sometimes appear. We see here what the alternative to doing that is.

Edited by dollardays (15 Mar 2019 5.57pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 4.59pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Thatís your truth; I canít be bothered to recycle a debate thatís been had 100 times, but everyone believes their view to be the truth, hence why they believe it.

It wasn't much of a debate because the statistics are pretty clear. Mostly the left/neo liberals just don't bother or cry 'racist'.

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Iím not suggesting anything of the sort; just pointing out the hypocrisy of you saying the media are lying to put blame on the right, when you readily lay blame to the left.

Letís be clear; Iíve never suggested closing down anything, just highlighted an inconsistency.

That's fair enough.

I do blame the left and the neo liberals (note, it isn't only the left by any means) for the creation of this problem.

Is that somehow incorrect, was our immigration policy not designed by them?

So it's hardly hypocrisy if I'm correct.

You can say I'm wrong, and I'd like to hear the argument....but a hypocrite? Na.


 

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View W12's Profile W12 Flag 15 Mar 19 5.11pm Send a Private Message to W12 Add W12 as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I think we must not confuse good people who exhibit 'Christian' attitudes by helping other people and those promoting scientific ignorance, ridiculous fairy stories and the worship of invisible beings.

These things are separate.

I was really just talking about the difference between actually going out of your way to help people and virtue signalling. I think Christianity actually encourages or even expects people to get off their arse and do something for the community.

 

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View EverybodyDannsNow's Profile EverybodyDannsNow Flag SE19 15 Mar 19 5.14pm Send a Private Message to EverybodyDannsNow Add EverybodyDannsNow as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

That's fair enough.

I do blame the left and the neo liberals (note, it isn't only the left by any means) for the creation of this problem.

Is that somehow incorrect, was our immigration policy not designed by them?

So it's hardly hypocrisy if I'm correct.

You can say I'm wrong, and I'd like to hear the argument....but a hypocrite? Na.


No, itís not incorrect, or at least not demonstrably so; I am of same opinion that the left/neo-liberals are a contributing factor, just as I believe the right are a contributing factor to this incident.

Those two positions arenít mutually exclusive, so just because you are correct on one, it doesnít by definition make you correct on the other, hence why I consider it hypocrisy.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 5.21pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

No, itís not incorrect, or at least not demonstrably so; I am of same opinion that the left/neo-liberals are a contributing factor, just as I believe the right are a contributing factor to this incident.

Those two positions arenít mutually exclusive, so just because you are correct on one, it doesnít by definition make you correct on the other, hence why I consider it hypocrisy.

If you want to consider it hypocrisy, even though I don't think that stands up....cool.

 

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View laddo's Profile laddo Flag london 15 Mar 19 5.27pm Send a Private Message to laddo Add laddo as a friend

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

Do you have to try and make political capital out of everything?

Bloke who did it wrote a 70 page right-wing manifesto. Denying this is political because you feel uncomfortable this bloke would have shared similar views to your own is the ultimate example of burying head in sand.

 


laddo

"People say, live fast, die young. I say live fast, die old. That's me, the non-conformist".
David Brent.

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 5.29pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by laddo

Bloke who did it wrote a 70 page right-wing manifesto. Denying this is political because you feel uncomfortable this bloke would have shared similar views to your own is the ultimate example of burying head in sand.


So with the next Islamic attack are you going to head off to an Islamic website and tell them the same thing?

 

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View laddo's Profile laddo Flag london 15 Mar 19 6.36pm Send a Private Message to laddo Add laddo as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


So with the next Islamic attack are you going to head off to an Islamic website and tell them the same thing?

I donít frequent Islamic websites. I find myself on this one because Iím a palace fan. In recent months itís been obvious there are a minority of right-wing tommy Robinson loving morons who post under Ďnews and politicsí who today posted Ďremorseí for those innocent people, yet buy-in to that Luton rent-a-gob who uses language like ĎIslamic invasioní when spouting his rubbish. All you who metaphorically suck him off inadvertently condone todayís hideous crime.

But,..letís be frank here. Behind your disingenuous sympathy you donít really give a sh*t. Muslim blood to you is less valuable to English blood. Itís just today youíve realised that wa*kstain of humanity in Christchurch has similar views to your own. Maybe you go on the same websites. Who knows. But right-wing extremism is as bad as Islamic extremism. All as bad as each other, including tommy Robinson and his supporters.

 


laddo

"People say, live fast, die young. I say live fast, die old. That's me, the non-conformist".
David Brent.

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View PalazioVecchio's Profile PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 15 Mar 19 6.42pm Send a Private Message to PalazioVecchio Add PalazioVecchio as a friend

As top enemies the shooter has identified :
Angela Merkel

Erdogan

Sadiq Khan


So we can guess all his other ideas.

 


34,300 reasons to love Selhurst in 2021

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag Wisbech, England 15 Mar 19 6.45pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by laddo

I donít frequent Islamic websites. I find myself on this one because Iím a palace fan. In recent months itís been obvious there are a minority of right-wing tommy Robinson loving morons who post under Ďnews and politicsí who today posted Ďremorseí for those innocent people, yet buy-in to that Luton rent-a-gob who uses language like ĎIslamic invasioní when spouting his rubbish. All you who metaphorically suck him off inadvertently condone todayís hideous crime.

But,..letís be frank here. Behind your disingenuous sympathy you donít really give a sh*t. Muslim blood to you is less valuable to English blood. Itís just today youíve realised that wa*kstain of humanity in Christchurch has similar views to your own. Maybe you go on the same websites. Who knows. But right-wing extremism is as bad as Islamic extremism. All as bad as each other, including tommy Robinson and his supporters.

My sympathy isn't disingenuous. What this guy did was inhuman and monstrous and that's how I feel about it.

I presume you're English, but believe me I certainly have more respect for Muslims than I have for people like you......So you don't really know what you're talking about.

 

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