so you get all your understanding of World Politics from Sky News ? i feel sorry for you.

Trump was right about the belligerent West and its constant Wars.

Eze Peasy at Anfield....

It's not about 'letting Putin do what he wants'. It's about plotting a course that lessens the damage.

The western elites have chosen a path and use the media to support it. They omit whatever would challenge that position and voices like you just support whatever their consensus is.

I make the point that under the direction I support this war would never have occurred. As for what should be done I simply don't support taking highly self destructive paths that achieve very little.

I agree with criticising Putin for starting this war and I agree with support for the Ukrainians...however the decision to effectively create a cold war is very dangerous to humanity both militarily and only economically hurts the vulnerable.....and for what....so that you can claim some moral victory. Well, when the poor have to choose between heating their homes or feeding their children I'm sorry but I think that moralism is highly suspect.

So I heavily criticise the approach that led us here.

Instead of this constant support for war and aggression I support the same energy being placed towards peace. I don't see this happening....all I see is media...which is directed...being used to support cold war....a decision that can only hurt the middle and lower classes....but not the elites themselves. It also doesn't help the Ukrainians either.

You made the claim the other day that because I'm conservative...well I'm a social conservative....that caring about the poor was somehow socialist.....this irritated me. I come from the council estates and been poor for a good portion of my life and consider myself working class. I've seen what the practical affect of leftist policies has been....so don't play that leftist game that caring about those with less is somehow the domain of the left. I regard that as a myth.

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Mar 2022 3.58am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

a classy comment from you there. Mods, this bloke just accused me of being more extreme than the Nazi's. Simply because i disapprove of all the sabre-rattling from NATO.

Eze Peasy at Anfield....

That is a typical unsupported and unverifiable claim of the right. It's the promise of the mythical green grass in the fields over the "if only" hills.

There is no "constant support for war and aggression"! All that is being done is to seek peace. We haven't created a new cold war. What Putin has done meant one was inevitable unless we stood back and did nothing.

The Soviet Union collapsed because the countries of Eastern Europe gathered the collective will to free themselves of the yoke imposed on them by Stalin. That an ex member of the KGB, and the bunch of ruthless thugs who support him, feel cheated by that and are manoeuvring to reverse it, doesn't mean we just allow them to. Those hard won freedoms need to be protected, not just for them, but for our safety and security too.

No-one wants to see the Ukrainians, or the poor and vulnerable at home and around the world, suffering. Ensuring that is kept to a minimum whilst making the necessary and unavoidable responses to Putin I am certain is in the minds of the decision takers.

Of course, with the benefit of hindsight, there will be things we have done wrong, or could have done better. The most obvious being that we were complacent in thinking that Putin really didn't mean it and could be shepherded into the modern world. We should have done this the moment he walked into Crimea.

This obsession with the "elites", as if there is a homogeneous group of people all conspiring together to protect themselves at the expense of everyone else, is just an invention of bogeymen. Of course, there are those in positions of authority. There are the wealthy, both old money and new. There are those who report on them. Their interests sometimes coincide, but not always, and there isn't, and cannot be, any co-ordination. In any case, most are not the evil despots that some imagine them to be. They are mostly good people trying to do their best.

We are where we are, and at times like these, politics need to be put in a box and allowed to gather dust. We need all hands on the wheel if we are going to turn the ship away from the course which will see us on the rocks. We can decide the best way to rebuild once we are back in calm water again.

Muttering into your coffee about "if only" just wastes energy and time.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

No idea, but they do have some form for that...

Busy today but I'll respond tonight or tomorrow on why I have that position on Nato and our elites of the last thirty years.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)