Ukraine Situation - Should We Be Worried?
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 Spiderman  Horsham 25 Feb 22 12.17pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
Russian claims over genocidal behaviour is probably true and for 8 years completely ignored everywhere. Images of damaged villages in Southern Russia today fired on by the Ukraine side could be nazis out of control militias etc. It's not good enough for Putin and Lavrov to claim this as justification for what they are doing to Ukraine though.
As I previously said, claims of genocide completely refuted by John Pienaar
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 25 Feb 22 12.18pm |
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Originally posted by Matov
You would have thought that with all this talk of sanctions and looking to hurt the Russians economically then you would see the EU decide to stop buying its gas which is, after all, one of its primary exports. But oddly, nothing much at all. Weird that. Didn’t Europe keep buying Russian gas during the Cold War.
COYP |
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| Stirlingsays 25 Feb 22 12.23pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
I know you got my point, but for the benefit of those Russo-philes out there who argue that Ukraine was a corrupt, illusory state so why should we care... Medium sized nation with unpleasant, autocratic government seeking to masquerade as something better but having no ambitions beyond their border (Poland / Ukraine) being invaded by far more powerful and even worse autocratic neighbour (Germany / Russia) led by charismatic, nationalist, populist, nutter (Hitler / Putin) who harbours alarming ambitions to expand well beyond their current border in a campaign that could spiral into a very wide-ranging conflict. Should we worry? My position is that we should worry but not be hot headed or look to escalate. We should stick to the terms of Nato and reinforce those border countries. If Putin attacks a Nato country that is war and that's how it works. He needs to be assured of that. Having Biden as president is a problem, but no point stating the obvious now. If it's true that Putin is serious in re-taking all the old soviet union in some kind of, old man on his last legs bucket list venture to recreate the old empire', then it's obviously potentially deadly for all of us. If Nato retaliates Putin has made a veiled threat to use nuclear weapons in Europe as a lesson to the US to stay out. We are 'little brother' and would be the ideal target being far enough away radiation wise. Do I think that serious? The problem with that threat is that we have a nuclear submarine on constant patrol with 16 Trident 2 missiles. We aren't some insignificant 'little brother' and nuking us would, instead of being a lesson, would very likely see us nuking Russia cities in response and hence we have WW3. I'm very critic of how we got here....most people just focus on the last five minutes and have a one way mirror but nevertheless, Nato is a pack designed for this exact threat and if Putin attacks a Nato country we aren't going to sit on our hands. Far more likely is what Maple suggested and that he takes East Ukraine and sits back and watches from there....if he takes all of the Ukraine, he pushes everything to the limit. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Feb 2022 12.46pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 25 Feb 22 12.31pm |
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Originally posted by HKOwen
An application was made in 2008, please read There is NO formal application on the table. Ukraine started a process called a "membership action plan" which could lead to the point when an application could be submitted. It was though shelved with the country preferring to stay non-aligned. It is close to Nato and regarded as a strategic partner. There has been an expression of mutual, eventual, intent but membership is decades away at the earliest. I suspect that expression was more to keep the Ukrainians onside than anything else. Nato isn't stupid. This is an excuse by Putin, and not a reason. Judged on his actions you can understand why Ukraine would want to join.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Stirlingsays 25 Feb 22 12.41pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
There is NO formal application on the table. Ukraine started a process called a "membership action plan" which could lead to the point when an application could be submitted. It was though shelved with the country preferring to stay non-aligned. It is close to Nato and regarded as a strategic partner. There has been an expression of mutual, eventual, intent but membership is decades away at the earliest. I suspect that expression was more to keep the Ukrainians onside than anything else. Nato isn't stupid. This is an excuse by Putin, and not a reason. Judged on his actions you can understand why Ukraine would want to join. I agree with you up to an extent here but the problem with your analysis is that you, in my view, paint your opponents as evil and irrational. We saw this with Trump and now Putin. Putin and Nato had twenty years to come to a resolution over Nato's expansion eastwards into the former soviet union states. According to Liddle at one point Putin was far more open to Nato and I want to know why there was this lack of compromise and why it continued.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| mezzer Main Stand, Block F, Row 20 seat 1... 25 Feb 22 12.46pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
Apologies in advance: [Link] The Russian entry this year is probably a remake of Boom Bang A Bang.
Living down here does have some advantages. At least you can see them cry. |
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| Eaglecoops CR3 25 Feb 22 12.50pm |
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I find it mildly amusing that those who were self proclaimed experts on covid matters appear to be the same protagonists who are now expert in the field of war. Is there literally no end to the stream of talent we have on here?
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Nicholas91  The Democratic Republic of Kent 25 Feb 22 12.53pm |
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Originally posted by Eaglecoops
I find it mildly amusing that those who were self proclaimed experts on covid matters appear to be the same protagonists who are now expert in the field of war. Is there literally no end to the stream of talent we have on here? You wait until nuclear warfare, brain surgery and rocket science hit the news!
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
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HKOwen  Hong Kong 25 Feb 22 1.00pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
Labour MPs withdraw from anti-Nato statement after threat of suspension. Starmer's idea of a free society definitely isn't mine. If this little Hitler gets his way and RT is banned it will only be here in the UK you can watch it online from other platforms in English. It is a sign of the times here in the UK that 13 people could express mild anti-NATO feelings and be silenced. The things we accuse Russia of we are doing ourselves.
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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| HKOwen Hong Kong 25 Feb 22 1.03pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
There is NO formal application on the table. Ukraine started a process called a "membership action plan" which could lead to the point when an application could be submitted. It was though shelved with the country preferring to stay non-aligned. It is close to Nato and regarded as a strategic partner. There has been an expression of mutual, eventual, intent but membership is decades away at the earliest. I suspect that expression was more to keep the Ukrainians onside than anything else. Nato isn't stupid. This is an excuse by Putin, and not a reason. Judged on his actions you can understand why Ukraine would want to join. I see now , what you mean is no new application has been made since the one in 2008 that was subsequently withdrawn.
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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eagleman13  On The Road To Hell & Alicante 25 Feb 22 1.07pm |
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Now F1 has followed suit . . . [Link]
I'm a blind man, i'm a blind man, now my room is cold, |
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Teddy Eagle  25 Feb 22 1.17pm |
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Originally posted by eagleman13
Now F1 has followed suit . . . [Link] That’s a pity. Lewis Hamilton could’ve sorted this during a pit stop.
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