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June 25 2022 2.56am

2022 Conservative Leadership Election.

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 07 Jun 22 7.20pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

'The UK rated the country least likely to honour its treaty obligations and commitments'.

That's a bit like saying that, internationally, the UK is a pain in the a***e you should avoid dealing with.

Hence matters like the USA trade deal, the NI protocol have a major drawback for the USA and EU.

Trusting us, and in particular, a PM with no integrity.

Boris is here to stay for a while. Boo hoo!

Sadly, he is the best PM available...Except maybe for Nigel Farage.

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 07 Jun 22 7.33pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Boris is here to stay for a while. Boo hoo!

Sadly, he is the best PM available...Except maybe for Nigel Farage.

We would certainly be a lot better off in many metrics if that were the case.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 08 Jun 22 7.41am Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Boris is here to stay for a while. Boo hoo!

Sadly, he is the best PM available...Except maybe for Nigel Farage.

Maybe youíre right, which shows how sh1t the choice is.

 


COYP

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 08 Jun 22 8.01am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

'The UK rated the country least likely to honour its treaty obligations and commitments'.

That's a bit like saying that, internationally, the UK is a pain in the a***e you should avoid dealing with.

Hence matters like the USA trade deal, the NI protocol have a major drawback for the USA and EU.

Trusting us, and in particular, a PM with no integrity.

Is that from a survey? If so a survey of who. Have they asked world leaders or a bunch of spotty lefties.

Ask the people of the Ukraine how they feel about the UK standing up to its obligations. I have actually met some Ukrainian refugees in Romania they were fulsome in their praise of the UK.

Edited by Badger11 (08 Jun 2022 8.03am)

 


One more point

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 08 Jun 22 8.16am Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

To be fair, the label 'Perfidious Albion' has hung around the neck of this septic Isle for centuries.

In the world of diplomacy, the accepted view is that the UK has neither friends nor enemies. Only interests.

The UK plc is the world's biggest organised crime family. Neither good nor bad, just as it is.

 


In 1967, when Polish mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life, replied: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 08 Jun 22 8.20am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Matov

To be fair, the label 'Perfidious Albion' has hung around the neck of this septic Isle for centuries.

In the world of diplomacy, the accepted view is that the UK has neither friends nor enemies. Only interests.

The UK plc is the world's biggest organised crime family. Neither good nor bad, just as it is.

Good point which applies to pretty much every other country. The biggest breaker of EU rules are the French who complain the loudest when we do the same, it's self interest.

Edited by Badger11 (08 Jun 2022 8.21am)

 


One more point

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View Matov's Profile Matov Flag 08 Jun 22 8.35am Send a Private Message to Matov Add Matov as a friend

Originally posted by Badger11

Good point which applies to pretty much every other country. The biggest breaker of EU rules are the French who complain the loudest when we do the same, it's self interest.

Edited by Badger11 (08 Jun 2022 8.21am)


Trust me, it applies to us more than most. We might not be the biggest kid in the playground anymore but we still see ourselves as one of the smartest. And the notion of English exceptionalism still colours any and every action we take.

Plus, and this might enrage some, but the reality is that being English does mean something still. The people who matter in the world speak our language. Our culture, for good and bad, impacts on almost every nation in the world.

If an alien was to observe the world and write its history, then Britain would deserve a chapter all of its own, along with mention in many, many others. And that don't happen without being utter f***ing c***s along the way. The clever bit is how the world still seems to fawn over our Royal Family and so on. Genius really.

 


In 1967, when Polish mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life, replied: "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed communists."

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 08 Jun 22 8.39am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Leadership challeneges compared

confidence.jpg Attachment: confidence.jpg (97.57Kb)

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 08 Jun 22 8.45am Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Boris is here to stay for a while. Boo hoo!

Most likely. Still pretty much a coin toss as to whether he'll be gone this year or hang on until an election. At least then the people can decide.

 

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View silvertop's Profile silvertop Flag Portishead 08 Jun 22 11.06am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Matov

Well I would have to disagree with you (edit-about the exciting bit) Of course, I have my theory about Labours second referendum stance being primarily about a way of ensuring Corybn never reached number 10, primarily in light of how well he did in 2017.

But lets say that during that period of time, a 'Governement of National Unity' had emerged, as was the want of many Remainers. Now they would have had to hold it together long enough to pass the necessary legislation to get the second referendum held. Probably about a 6 month gap. So assuming this farce comes into play in November 2019, you probably have the second referendum in the May. Of course nobody could have predicted Covid so lets leave that to one side.

So you have your second referendum ahead with a Corbyn led coalition barely able to do anything else. The only issue is Brexit. Now I know for a fact that the policy towards any second referendum from the likes of Farage and so on would have been a boycott. After all, what would be the point? If your vote could be ignored the once, why bother voting again?

But come the May, we the vote. And its probably a less than 40% turn out. Remain win it but perhaps with less than 17.2 million votes that Leave got in 2016.

What is actually decided? Does the issue go away? Or does the country erupt? And in any future election, as we saw in December 2019, the Tories would have hammered away at the issue, and quite rightly so.

Throw in Covid itself, and lockdowns, and maybe an attempt to kick this ludicrous second referendum down the road (and to be fair, there might have been some valid reasons for that at the time) and the UK possibly fractures forever. Genuine real-world consequences. Deaths. Violence across the country.

I would have fought. In every sense of the word. I don't write that as hyperbole or boasting but as actual, cold, fact. Would have been trying to burn Parliament down. Willing to go to prison or even put my own life on the line. Again, people can feel free to mock this stance as macho posturing but I would be willing to look anybody in the eye and repeat my claims.

Thankfully it never happened but our politicians risked this.

I don't see it as exciting. I see it as playing with fire.

Edited by Matov (07 Jun 2022 6.13pm)

...While I am struggling to think of a more exciting scenario, although not the good type. That said...


I don't underestimate your commitment, but I fear you may over estimate that of the rest of the British public. The continent has exploded over and over again over the centuries but, since the Civil War, we have proven very unwilling to engage in any of that revolutionary stuff. Add to that the fact that Brexiteers are generally long in the tooth, you are as likely to be joined by bus loads of the Darby & Joan Club carrying placards. I fear you may be disappointed.

Your prediction of political polarization is well founded though. The rise of the populist, ultra right, English nationalist movement is a genuine threat and they have a reasonable chance of government as a reaction to reversing the referendum or overturning it through a new vote. The Tories will split into the 2 factions that already exist and the right will consume the little parties like Heritage to secure government. For one term. The trouble is, you can only put the lunatics in charge once before even their thickest supporter realizes they can't deliver on anything save throwing a few thousand dark skinned people out. Thereafter, the Union will survive and politics will drift back to Centrist sensible dullery and we will all wonder whether we dreamt it.

 

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View Forest Hillbilly's Profile Forest Hillbilly Flag in a hidey-hole 08 Jun 22 11.06am Send a Private Message to Forest Hillbilly Add Forest Hillbilly as a friend

The uneasy feeling I have is that (if you believe polls) there seems to be a small majority of voters want Johnson gone, or at least wouldn't vote for him again.
And BJ, although previously elected, is still leading the country.

The electorate have changed their minds, and want BJ gone. When will this happen in this so-called democracy?
Who want a liar to lead the UK in international conflicts and negotiations where trust will inevitably be greatly eroded, especially amongst European leaders

 


,.,.,..,

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Flag Croydon 08 Jun 22 2.15pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

'I have only alienated 148 of colleagues because of the huge things I have done'.

BJ obviously referring to the size of the puking and vomiting and of course partying at Westminster a testament to his stewardship of the country.

And of course he is an excellent war leader in the Churchill mode, it's just that we are not actually at war itself.

 

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